Please help me educate my 16 year old son on Truth

My son for the last 4 years has lived with his "fundie, conservative, narcissistic, bush loving" dad. This man is the epitome of what is wrong with this country. It is really horrible how my son has been brainwashed, even against his own "immoral" mother and her liberal ways.

I was thinking about first explaining to him that everything is not what it appears to be, and as the establishment would want you to believe. Then I thought that I would show him the 9/11 film that is sold by fromthewilderness.com. I thought that maybe that would get his curiousity going and cause him to ask questions, and begin to question some of the basic lies that he believes as gospel.

It is very important to me that his "lets kill them Iraqi's" amongst his other poisonous mindsets is given a good jolt. He has the basic foundation of kindness and truth inside of him, because I raised him for the first 12 years of his life, so it is in there.

I thought that this would be a good place to start. Any thoughts or ideas from my fellows here would be appreciated.

Don't be combative with him on these kinds of things. But in instances where attitudes you do not want to be associated with rear their ugly head (i.e. the "let's kill them Iraqis" comment), do NOT let him get away with it in your house.

But the best way to teach him is by example. If you want him to be caring and respectful, then simply live that way. He's 16, and he probably won't respond directly -- but it WILL sink in.

Give him time. I read with great concern your discription of his father, now is NOT the time to be hatefull. If you go to your son with that attitued he will shut down on the spot.

Let him know it's ok to have his own ideas, but he must learn to state them in a less hostile and ugly way. This is your door, get him thinking for himself. Note, for himself, even after you have had a chance to expose him to other views and takes, you must be ready to except that sometimes he will have another opinion than yours.

The best gift you can give him is letting him know you'll love him even if he does not share all your views and that you'll respect him. When he feels safe enough, he'll be able to share so much more with you and he'll be able to really hear what your trying to teach him.

I agree on teaching kids to question. I don't even let my kids agree with me without challenging them to justify their reasons. I want them to have independent minds because that's the only way they can truly have the strength of their own beliefs that they will need in this world. I wouldn't allow out and out racist comments, but I would respect him while disagreeing with his opinions. I raised my kids from birth and they say some pretty wild things sometimes too. And they don't always end up agreeing with me even after I've 'set them straight'. I wouldn't want it any other way.

manner....not as instruction or teaching.

Just bring issues up as you come across them in daily life or on Tv, in movies, etc.

Rent some good political movies, but don't show them as a teaching tool, just for 'fun.'

I also would not criticize him for his ideas, and also would not use the relationship with your ex to show your son all that is wrong with those attitudes!

I wish you luck, and you are absolutely right about the truth being in there is you feel he was open and receptive to it for those first 12 years....

All the best,

DemEx

don't hit him with the hard stuff like 9-11 LIHOP/MIHOP. If you lead with that you'll probably shut his mind right off.

I'd focus on the small things first, just proven well known facts from everyday politics. Take it slowly.

Give him Al Franken to read. Follow that with Paul Krugman. Also, some Bishop Spong would be a good antidote to fundamentalism.

Maybe a book about Viet Nam would make the same points without challenging his beliefs in the war head-on.

By Howard Zinn.

Give him a taste of his own medicine, rant about the facist scum, throw in a few "thou shall not kills", "thou shall not lie" (then rant about the 16 words). Go ballistic on the treasonous outing of the CIA undercover agent. Mention the Starr investigation and "thou shall not bear false witness".

If he gives you any crap, don't forget the "honor thy mother and father" bit.

Logic won't work with a teenager, if you want to change his behavior, then emulate it. That will change his attitude real fast.

How old is he?

Get a copy of Ruppert's "Truth and Lies" and watch it with him.

If he's like most teenagers, his natural instinct to rebel could kick in. It might even create an activist.


http://www.viewerplus.com/product.asp?Stat=Vision&ID=12043

Who are learning English. One of the best antidotes for the "killthewhozits" syndrome is getting to know and making friends with whozits :))

And people with money find it easier to operate in their own interests. Even those that own the media and the means of propaganda do so because they have the money to do so. They write the tax laws in their own interests. They invade countries in their own interests. The truth is not a simple black and white argument because people with money have found ingenuous methods of presenting their viewpoints in a way that might be appealing to those that would otherwise disagree with them from the start. They present the idea that everyone or anyone can be a millionaire in this country. That is not a truth.

As others said don't hit him over the head with conspiracy theories. One can be liberal, even radical and not believe in LIHOP or MIHOP.

even some liberals like to hide their head in the sand

masculine.

It's quite the opposite, in fact. When I was growing up I was surrounded by mostly died in the wool Democrats, and they were all *real* tough guys. Laborers, veterans, firefighters, truck drivers... whatever.

A man doesn't just jump when he's told to jump, or hate when he's told to hate. He asks questions and looks out for the interests of not only his country, but his friends, family, and coworkers.

Just agree to disagree with him. Argue your points and back them up with sources if necessary, but don't hope for much.

:eyes:

Then take him to an army recruiter. Then tell him to put up or shut up.

It is difficult (impossible?) to educate a 16-year old on things like this. I agree with those who say, "Tread lightly." If you come on strong, he will shut you out and move further right. Even a gentle message is perceived by teenagers as "lecturing" and they do not respond well to that approach.

My 17-year old daughter is pretty left-leaning, but she cannot hear anything against the right because her two best friends are republican anti-choicers and she feels disloyal when I attack Bush*. I have learned to back off. But she reads Newsweek (for school) and gets a less-than-Fox view. I have faith that she is on my side most of the time.

I disagree with those who suggest giving him Franken or Conason or Moore books. He has enough reading to do from school, especially "heavy" stuff like that. Short (really short) articles on a single, specific topic might be helpful in exposing him to the truth.

And it also would help to frame things in terms, and on topics, that he cares about. It is easier to get across a specific point on one thing, rather than global issues. For instance, if he shows any environmental interest and has a pet, show him how Bush* is allowing corporations freer reign to abuse animals in laboratories. Make your points relevant to him, personally.

Good luck.

Racism, conservatism, and biggoted views are easy. They require little or no thought... lots of circular logic.

What you need to do is simply ask questions, and make him review his own conclusions.


He says kill all them iraqis... ask him what that would solve. Ask him how he would feel if Iraqis bombed his home and killed his family. Would he hate them... would he stop hating them for it if they killed more of his people?

If not, why does he think killing Iraqis will make peope in the mid-east stop hating us. What would that solve?

Make him review and evaluate the effectivness of his ideas... what are his goals. It is easy to just vent anger, but to come up with real solutions to real problems is another matter.

..to think like you, if the result is the same?

I'm guessing he's not walking around beating people up or stealing or doing drugs or stuff like that. He's probably a good kid right?

It's better for him to see the truth on his own, than to have your version of truth jammed into him. He will rebel against that, just like eventually he'll rebel against his father. He'll end up finding his own way.

Just make sure he knows the basics of right and wrong and stuff like that. No need to get a 14 year old all caught up in political bickerings. Let the kid be a kid.

As for "lets kill iraqis", if he said that, then he has a normal 14 year olds view of war. You should explain that war should always be the last resort and not be met with such glee.

and has been through hell with his dad. Dad denied him access to his mom for 4 years. Is an all-star athlete, and has never been in trouble because his everymove has been monitored. Contol freak dad. Held him back in 8th grade with a 3.83 grade point average so he would be bigger and older to compete in baseball in highschool. Not allowed any privacy and all people that he associates with, which are very few, are thoroughly screened. Father is very sick.

So you had him for 12 years and the father undid 12 years of your work in 4 years?

take him away from his father

mindset with a more truely Christian church that has activities for young people. Volunteering in a soup kitchen, packaging food for community pantries, delivering food for shut ins, tutoring a disadvantaged child might help turn on the lights his dad has darkened.

Otherwise, just keep it light and use the odd teachable moments that occur in the course of the week for indirect instruction. Be fair, firm, and tell him why you are doing what you do, believe the way you do. Not to lecture, but just as casual asides he doesn't really have to respond to.

Has he read 1984, To Kill a Mockingbird, Huckleberry Finn? The car can be a good place to, talk about things like that, if he talks in anything over a monsyllabic mumble.

The cartoon Zits has helped me a lot with my son. It can give you a sense of where his head is, and reassure you that you are on the right track and know other parents are in much the same boat.

Good luck.

Since he is 16, I’m assuming he is not a fan of reading on ones own time. So here are video and audio of the truth post 911. I would encourage you to watch them and decide who makes the final cut.

(Note) You can right click and save as, on all but the second video.

(BBC) Greg Palast-
Investigative reporter Greg Palast turns his magnifying glass on the Bush dynasty, asking why the Bush family name has been associated with so many scandals over the last twenty-five years.
video

(BBC) Greg Palast- Bush blocking Bin Laden Probe
video

Gore Vidal- Interview about post 911
mp3

Gore Vidal - American Empire and Corruption
video
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The Bush administration's dangerous manufacturing of post-9-11 dread
By: (Veteran, Congressman ) Jim McDermott
Veteransforpeace

It helps to let him know, Veterans and Miltary familys are against this war. Here are some of them.

http://www.veteransforpeace.org/about.htm
http://www.vaiw.org/vet/index.php
http://www.mfso.org/
http://www.bringthemhomenow.org/
http://www.sftt.org/
http://www.vvaw.org/

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George W. Bush’s


Accomplishments As President

· In my first three years in office over 3.5 million Americans lost their job.

· Spent the surplus

· Shattered record for biggest annual deficit (500 billion) in history.

· Set economic record for most private bankruptcies filed in any 12-month period.

· Set the all-time record for most foreclosures in a 12-month period.

· Changed EPA rules that will Increase Pollution by 1.6 Million Tons

· Cut healthcare benefits for war veterans

· Attempted to cut hazard pay for troops serving in Iraq

· Failed to fulfill my pledge to get Osama Bin Laden 'dead or alive’.

· Covered up for my rich friends the Saudi’s, for financing two 911 highjackers. 15 out of the 19 highjackers were from Saudi Arabia. (None from Iraq)

· Used forged evidence and lied about “Weapons of mass destruction” to get us into a Quagmire in Iraq. (Then taunted the Guerillas to kill our troops by saying “ Bring them on”)

· Removed more freedoms and civil liberties for Americans than any other president in U.S. history.

Records and References

· I’m AWOL from the National Guard and deserted the military during a time of war.

· Republican Trent Lott “ We can support the troops without supporting the president”

· Republican Theodore Roosevelt, 26th US President “To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

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"Beware the leader who beats the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into patriotic fervor, for patriotism is a double-edged sword. It emboldens the blood and narrows the mind.

And when the drums of war have reached fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need to seize the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so."

Have you read the Patriot act 1, or the leaked Patriot act 2?

They rewrite many constitutional Amendments and spits in the eye of the Constitution, and the freedoms Bush claims they hate us for.

In this manufactured culture of fear and crisis, has being proud become a substitute to critical thinking? If you answered yes to any of the above questions I’m afraid it has.

Have you read the Patriot’s handbook the Constitution?
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good ideas, I really appreciate it.

There are some nice ones in the U.S. Tell him he's going to a really funky summer camp. If he can take the discipline he'll be seeing Truth ina WHOLE new way in no time.

that he is interested in: History, Automobiles, Sports...anything. Then help him to learn as much as possible about that subject. Talk to him about that subject(s). If he is already motivated by a previous interest you have half the battle to educate him won. Then it is a matter of helping him learn how everything is interconnected. Hopefully his natural curiosity will take over.

If he isn't a genious in a couple of years its your fault, hee, hee.

without words. They will sink in.

As an example, I've got a dry erase board on my wall which is filled with inspiration.
It has: 2 pictures of my young son -- that's the only thing "personal" -- along with several photos of the Feb 15 anti-war protests from my favorite cities, a photo of Tariq Ayoub the Al Jazeera journalist who was killed on the roof of the Palestine hotel (who had a toddler), a photo of Christian Bonhoeffeur who was a prominent theologian who stood up to the Nazis and died in the camps, a photo of two children standing amidst a scene of moon-like devestation in Afghanistan, a photo of a baby held in hands, and the 7 deadly sins by mahatma gandhi (Wealth without work, pleasure without conscience, knowledge without character, commerce without morality, science without humanity, worship without sacrifice, and politics without principle).

It's still in work, but it's very uplifting to me and it's a visible reminder of why I work on the things that I work on, and why I care, why I MUST care.

For your son, maybe such a display in your study or near your computer would spark his interest in the deeper truths that underlie your views and your efforts. He might grow to admire you for your heart. He might allow himself to develop views different from his friends or his father, because he would see that you are NOT alone in your views, that there's an entire world of real and admirable people out there who are fighting the same battles.

I also think, though, that at his age, he has a powerful motivation to want to 'be like his father', perhaps feeling a bit unstable in his relationship with his dad, and striving as a teen to fit in and find his male identity.

If I were in your shoes I'd be inclined to push it too much and run the risk of violating the cardinal rule of motherhood: give unconditional love. So that's why I like the wall of photos idea -- no words required; just quiet, creative inspiration.

If you haven't read the Berkeley study of "common psychological factors linked to political conservatism", read it. Read some of the conservative criticisms too; they're good for a laugh, if nothing else. The point is, whether or not conservatives accept that analysis, it seems to be dead-on accurate, in my experience.

The way that liberals can use that knowledge is to help us understand how the far right has gained "conservative" momentum in the last couple of decades: by promoting, playing to, and exploiting those psychological factors.

If that's true, then that's our real enemy -- and that's about the only clue we're likely to get as to where and how to mount an effective counter-attack.

My parents used to vote republican but switched when Bush1 took office...
We never had that kind of seperation in our house...although we did have relatives that think being a Republican and going along with what BushCo says is the only way...

I would say...watch shows that show the inconsistencies of what is coming out of the White House...don't force them on him...but say let's watch this and talk about it afterwards...

Dam...I just thought of something...I hope he hasn't started to watch Faux News or listens to Rush Limpjaw, or Sean Hannity, or Annthrax...eeesh...scary thought...you are on you own with that one..

Most of all...don't force you views on him...talk to him about how you feel and show him the facts behind the lies and deception...just don't rush it...if he's going to be a Republican I think that there is nothing you can really do...except let him find out for himself when the shit hits the fan...

"Son, I respect your opinions. But maybe, just maybe, things are not as black-and-white as the TV news and the talk shows make them out to be. One hard lesson that I had to learn was to find things out for myself--to go dig up the facts and come to my own conclusions. It's been terribly difficult, but my life has been too important to me to let anyone tell me how to think.

Now it's OK with me if you really want to join the military, but they will not accept you for a couple of more years. So why don't you use that time to find out exactly what life is going to be like for someone assigned to, let's say, Iraq?"

Good luck in your quest, lnp!

:loveya:
dbt

A kid who is 16 years old(which I am) can make decisions and make their minds about issues. If I were you I would let him be, he is old enough to start thinking for himself which he already is no matter how much you think 'dad' has brainwashed him.