Claim that Americans are harvesting dead Iraqis' organs? Harpers Mag.

This is just one of the really weird things that one occasionally finds in Harpers.

Hearts and Brains

Posted on Monday, December 5, 2005.

From an article published December 18, 2004 in the Saudi newspaper Al-Watan. The story also appeared in papers in Syria and Iran. Translated by the Middle East Media Research Institute.

Originally from Harper's Magazine, July 2005.

http://harpers.org/HeartsAndBrains.html

Sources

Secret European military intelligence reports indicate the transformation of the American humanitarian mission in Iraq into a profitable trade through the practice of American physicians extracting human organs from the dead and wounded. A secret team of American physicians follows the troops during their attacks on Iraqi armed men to ensure quick operations.

The reports confirm the finding of dozens of mutilated cadavers, some without heads. The American military command could not explain the missing parts. The reports also confirm that the bodies are burned to conceal the crime of organ extraction. The reports further indicate that American medical teams have recruited some Iraqis to guide them to dead and critically injured individuals. These teams offer $40 for every usable kidney and $25 for an eye.

The reports also indicate that a number of those killed in Abu Ghraib and other prisons had organs extracted. Following their mutilation, the bodies were discarded far from the prisons to conceal the facts. The American forces prevented the media by force from getting near the scenes. But the relatives of the Iraqis are aware of the facts. The Europeans have noticed the absence of organs from the cadavers that were dealt with by the Americans and have reported to their commanders, who instructed them to maintain silence and to avoid discussion of the subject due to its gravity.

http://harpers.org/HeartsAndBrains.html

we can study their brains and find out why they are so into terra terra terra.... or just defending their own country.

However, I'm skeptical. I haven't heard about lots of people getting transplants. Heck, they probably don't have enough electricity to keep an operating room going long enough to do a transplant.

two words for you... private contractors. As for hearing about lots of transplants... you wouldn't, because they'd only be going to the people who can afford them, and they're not publicising this. Is it actually happening? I don't know, but to some degree i would not doubt that it is possible.

Actually with this gang in charge, I'm tempted to ask: Anyone seen Osama lately? He could use a kidney.

:shrug:

grandma... miss her dearly, more than you could imagine.... sweet lady, taught me to crochet she did. Can you just see it? :)

country has sunk to just gets worse and worse. And don't come along and tell me that they are saving lives. You ethically can't harvest organs without the consent of the donor before death or their family.

One, the translation from the Arabic press is from controversial MEMRI who Juan Cole has had a couple of run-ins with...

http://www.antiwar.com/cole/?articleid=3898

http://www.antiwar.com/cole/?articleid=4047

So it's possible it was mistranslated.

And it's most likely Arab propaganda.

Harper's just lays it out there with no opinion though... which they often do with that section.

I think Harpers, by publishing the translations of this stuff, is trying to show how ridiculous some of the anti-Americanism in the mid-east media can get.

Leaving us to wonder what they may be thinking by printing it.

Right now though it wouldn't surprise me considering what they have done in the past with no shame or remorse about it.

It's almost as bloody ridiculous as ripping premature babies out of incubators in a hospital and leaving them to die...

Propaganda.

Edited for typo

we, the unwashed masses, believed our leaders. We don't anymore. However, there were rumors leaking about Abu Ghraib before the pictures came out. We didn't believe the rumors, but we couldn't deny the photos. So no matter how bizarre the statement, I will reserve judgement until it's disproved. You see this is how much we trust our governmment now.

Also, how does a guy like Osama bin Laden get by without kidneys? People on dialysis last an average of five years without a tranplant. So if it's true that Osama is still alive and able to hide in caves and other rural places, it means that somehow he got a transplant. It seems war would leave a lot of dead bodies around. Food for thought.

went along with this, elective war from the get-go!

ever buy this stuff, which means it resurfaces from time to time all over the world, usually blamed on Americans.

The problem with this story is that the donors and the recipients have to be matched not only by gross blood type but buy tissue type, as well. Then there are several viruses to consider in both donor and recipient. Plus, you have a very short shelf life for organs taken from cadavers. Generally, you need to have a recipient lined up and ready while the lab does some fairly advanced testing on a prospective donor.

In other words, you don't pick up a stiff on the street, chop out his heart, and expect to use it on somebody right away, especially somebody from a completely different part of the world.

My best guess is that some organs may have been removed for autopsy or other study, especially since neurotoxins and depleted uranium are both suspected of causing a great deal of disease and birth injury in that country.

This bullshit story has been all around Central America for years, usually involving a drunk waking up in a bathtub full of ice with both kidneys gone.

Don't buy it.

Don't we still have troops assigned there? Wouldn't they have medical facilities? We aren't that far from Cuba that organs couldn't be harvested and sent by refrigeration to those hospitals that have transplant teams on standby who do all those things you mention for a match. They have a database of recipients that they match up in hours and get into the operating room with little time wasted..

That is how they transport organs...because time is of the essence.

one has, your custom is an irrelevance. The more vile the accusation the more likely it is to invite the credence of people intelligent enough to think in terms of first principles, until at least plausibly denied. All I see on here is the kind of bombastic huffing and puffing I attribute to the people who denied the elections were bent.

This sounds like the kind of inflammatory propaganda that is disseminated during war. Where are they using these organs?

As far as I know, kidneys have to be used within hours. So for this to be very profitable they would need to have a large number of paying dialysis patients ready and waiting for those kidneys.

How would they advertise for people willing to pay for black market kidneys? Where would they do the surgery? It would be very difficult to hide that kind of large scale activity.

I just can't see someone actually planning and carrying out something like this. There are probably any number of profitable black market opportunities available in a war zone. A lot of them would be much safer and easier to carry out than this.

These reports originated in state controlled newspapers in Saudi Arabia, Syria and Iran. A lot of skepticism and independent verification is in order. Ever hear of urban legends, propaganda, lies?

Snarky... I just copied and pasted something from Harpers which appeared on the front page of their website a day ago.

Geez....

It's not like I am quoting the fricking the UK Sun or National Enquirer here....

As if there is not enough ill-will..

My best friend donated her son's organs, and i knwo how intricate the process is. Timing is critical. Does anyone really think that "prison extractions" or "snatch & grab" organ theft would result in viable organ donation?

There is a HUGE amount of medical/surgigal/lab work involved in organ donation. People just don't cut out a kidney, wrap it up in newspapers, and FedEx it ..

It says right on top of the page.

And it's part of their Readings section on war.

http://harpers.org/ReadingsWar.html

"wondering" if there's any gas in the can.. the fumes can ignite it:(

It's almost as bloody ridiculous as ripping premature babies out of incubators in a hospital and leaving them to die...

Propaganda.

terra organs, anyways?

This administration is OUT OF CONTROL!!!!!.. GET THE HELL OUT NOW! DAMMIT! THIS PISSES ME OFF!!!!

The phsysicans responsible need to be found and executed.

and I believe that they are shipping the blood to the jooooos to make their matza! Gimme a friggin break. :tinfoilhat:

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

in the likes of Guatemala and Chile who would find it implausible.

Oh I think you are absolutely right, which is why it's that much more irresponsible of Harpers. This story will play especially well on the arab media, and the beauty is your refutation of the story will never be heard.

You need to sharpen your irony antennae. Ever heard of the MK-ULTRA program? There is no depth to which peole who worship the golden calf will not sink. Or is your name Rip Van Winkle?

perception of the administration. The whole world would have laughed such a rumour out of court, during the incumbencies of Clinton or Carter or Roosevelt. And there you are shooting the messenger, Harper's.

Harper's are doing the administration a service. Whether it is true or false, the reality is clearly that the rumour is out there, and the administration needs to to take on board that it can't have things both ways. Either it continues to ignore the norms of international law, posturing, swaggering, torturing, bombing civilian areas and brutalising the population in a war that is illegal; or it makes plans to expedite a total withdrawal from Iraq while, in the meantime, making less cretinous, more purposeful efforts to win the hearts and minds of the populace, to minimise further slaughter. It might entail the replacement of the more bloody-minded neocon leaders such as Rumsfelt, and ceding the matter of their replacement to the likes of Murtha and his colleagues in the CIA.

needs to give their head a shake. As others have said, organ transplantation is a very complex procedure. You can't just cut out the organ and call it good. It takes a trained surgeon to know where to cut and it also takes a whole team to process said organ. There is blood typing, tissue typing, checking for viruses (Hep C, HIV for example). So this whole story is bunk.

The checks can be done later. What's the matter with you?

... Aside from the medical intricacies/realities of organ donation.
I'm surprised Harpers would print this.

:think:

What does matter is it's being reported in the Arab world, and judging from our ghastly behavior in other ways, I'm sure many are taking it seriously. Never thought I'd see the day where people believe America is capable of doing such a heinous thing.

have their organs removed. Or maybe the other way around.

Sick twisted MOFO's

Republicans are laughing at a lot of the people in this thread.

Maybe we should have spent MORE on planting happy stories.

Of course it's not happening, but people are disappearing, bodies are burnt, and the US isn't trusted.

I guess they have some new food to eat.

At least the WWN does not expect to be believed. They publish for entertainment. Harpers desires to be believed and runs with a story that a quick call to a doctor could reveal to them that their story was crap.

Organs have to be harvested under very stringent guidelines for them to be viable.
Just grabbing them and throwing them in a cooler isn't gonna cut it. What about blood and tissue matches?
Smells like propaganda to me.:shrug:

I don't believe it, but it is interesting to see that this demonization is going on both ways.

Truly disturbing. As the Shadow would say, "Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?"

I will reserve judgment until all the dust settles and someone can offer a modicum, or even an iota, of proof. Until then, I will leave the technical details of the plausibility of organ extraction in extremis to those more well-versed in medical procedures than moi.