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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-08-05 07:52 PM
Original message
Dear Gov Dean -- Talk about extreme hiking …
Edited on Thu Dec-08-05 07:52 PM by understandinglife
8 December 2005

Steve Clemons reports today at The Washington Note on a discussion he had with the journalist Yosri Fouda. Mr. Fouda has conducted extensive interviews with Khaled El-Masri, the victim of Bush administration kidnapping and rendition. As Steve Clemons recounts:

El-Masri, a German citizen of Lebanese descent, was kidnapped while vacationing by American intelligence agents. He was transported and "questioned" -- allegedly roughly -- by American authorities in Afghanistan. Along the way, these investigators finally figured out he was innocent and reported back to CIA Director George Tenet. Tenet had him held ANYWAY for another two months.

And then. . .you might ask, could it get worse? Well, yes.

We dumped him blind-folded in the deep forest, mountainous triangle area between Albania, Serbia and Macedonia. He had to walk out with no money, no identification.

http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/001136.html


Please do what you can to ensure that the media and the US Congress ask Ms Rice to explain how it is that once El-Masri was known to be innocent he was left to perish in a dangerous wilderness. Since Ms Rice has claimed that the United States will do all it can to make amends for its misdeeds, she should be forced to address how the United States is going to enable El-Masri to recover from the cruel and unusual treatment Bush’s CIA administered to him.

Our America is being permanently tarnished by Bush and the neoconsters willful disregard for basic human rights and international law -- the case of Khaled El-Masri is but one more reason why.

If you have any doubt about the lasting consequences of the now extensive recognition of the damage Bush and the neoconsters have done you need look no further than The Economist – Global Agenda for 7 December 2005:

America seeks, but fails, to quell the uproar in Europe over CIA shenanigans

Ms Rice’s aim was to reassure America’s European allies, still fuming over reports that their own airspace and territory had been used by the CIA for its covert operations, including secret prisons. Alas, such is the suspicion about America and its treatment of terrorist suspects following Guantánamo Bay and Abu Ghraib that her hosts immediately scoured her meticulously crafted declaration for loopholes. Worse, they found plenty of them.

Ms Rice said, for example, that America does not use other countries’ airspace or airports to transport detainees to a third country where they “will be tortured”. But the Convention Against Torture makes it unlawful to transport anyone to a country where there are “substantial grounds” for believing they might be tortured.

Ms Rice refused to confirm or deny the existence of secret CIA prisons for interrogating terrorist suspects in Europe. It might compromise the success of intelligence, law enforcement or military matters, she explained. But, given her admission that detainees have been transported to third countries for interrogation, the presumption must be that undisclosed detention centres do exist—or have done in the past—where such interrogations take place. Why else place them outside America and keep them secret?

Much more at the link:

http://www.economist.com/agenda/displaystory.cfm?story_id=5277867


Any attempt to deny the practice of rendition for the purpose of transporting a victim of Bush’s regime of terror to a place that permits torture will now have to overcome the existence of a Department of Defense ‘torture by proxy’ policy memorandum uncovered in the case of Majid Mahmud Abdu Ahmad described today in the Los Angeles Times: http://tinyurl.com/7d7lt

I agree with John R Judis’ latest comments about you, Gov Dean, in his New Republic OnLine article entitled ”IN DEFENSE OF DEAN.” To paraphrase, America ignores what you have to say at its own peril. I hope you have much more to say about Bush and the neoconsters’ illegal war of aggression on Iraq and their cruel crimes against humanity for which we now have an abundance of examples.

Our America is being permanently tarnished by Bush and the neoconsters willful disregard for basic human rights and international law, and it is time for every citizen to make a decision to stop them and bring them to justice.

"We the People ..." have reached the "America, Or Not?" moment in the history of the Republic.



Peace.

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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-08-05 08:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. UL - you ARE amazing!
Thanks for sharing this info!
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-08-05 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Thank you. I don't have much else to offer other than what I can write.
Wish it could be much more.

My hope is to write a "Dear Gov Dean -- ..." letter each day between now and election day, November, 2006, and I'll post each of them here for folk to comment. I'm printing and mailing each letter ~ 24 h after I post here as to include any specific comments that improve the message.


Peace.
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radio4progressives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. I think it's great..
are you the author of phamplet the We the People have no clothes, that's hyperlinked in your sig?

i just bookmarked it in my favorites and will be reading in full at a later time... read the first few pages and it's awesome..

hope it's getting around...
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Yes, I'm the author of the pamphlet. Am seeking a publisher, but ...
... have made it available for download at no cost to enable folk to spread it to as many friends, colleagues, family members, ...., as they'd like.

Thank you.


Peace.
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Wordie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-08-05 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
2. K&R
I just ran across the same thing: unbelieveable!

What possible justification could there be for treating a person we knew to be innocent in this manner???

Thanks for posting this.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 12:16 AM
Response to Original message
4. "The Bush administration based a crucial prewar assertion about ties ...
... between Iraq and Al Qaeda on detailed statements made by a prisoner while in Egyptian custody who later said he had fabricated them to escape harsh treatment, according to current and former government officials.

The officials said the captive, Ibn al-Shaykh al-Libi, provided his most specific and elaborate accounts about ties between Iraq and Al Qaeda only after he was secretly handed over to Egypt by the United States in January 2002, in a process known as rendition.

More at the link:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/09/politics/09intel.html?ei=5094&en=7e35bbb61b8d1d0c&hp=&ex=1134190800&partner=homepage&pagewanted=all


This torture thing is not only evil, it is vastly stupid. Anyone needing more convincing, just grok this:

Britain's Top Court Rules Information Gotten by Torture Is Never Admissible Evidence

By SARAH LYALL

LONDON, Dec. 8 - Britain's highest court thrust itself into the middle of a roiling international debate on Thursday, declaring that evidence obtained through torture - no matter by whom - was not admissible in British courts. It also said Britain had a "positive obligation" to uphold antitorture principles abroad as well as at home.

"The issue is one of constitutional principle, whether evidence obtained by torturing another human being may lawfully be admitted against a party to proceedings in a British court, irrespective of where, or by whom, or on whose authority the torture was inflicted," said Lord Bingham, writing the lead opinion in a unanimous ruling for the Law Lords. "To that question I would give a very clear negative answer."

The ruling dealt specifically with 10 men who were detained after the attacks on the United States on Sept. 11, 2001, and were held without charge in Britain on suspicion of being terrorists. But while the question at hand concerned only British courts, the ruling seems to have been made with the current international situation very much in mind. Several of the concurring opinions referred explicitly, and not flatteringly, to the United States.

Much more at the link:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/09/international/europe/09britain.html?pagewanted=print


Colossally stupid, AND EVIL.


Peace.





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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
5. Sort of makes you wonder
--how in fawking HELL we were able to win WW II without doing this to German or Italian prisoners. Even with the internment camps for Japanese-Americans, however unjustified in retrospect, nobody got the bright idea to waterboard the inmates just in case they knew something about Tojo's war plans. What have we become!?!?!?
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. "What have we become!?!?!?" -- In_deed. That is the question We the People
... all must confront.

In other words, "America, Or Not?" is a decision each citizen must make and I humbly suggest that if Gov Dean and others truly want to "frame" the 2006 election accurately they should adopt "America, Or Not?" to do so.


Peace.
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 08:12 AM
Response to Original message
7. Kickin cause I can't believe this ain't on greatest yet. n/t
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Thank you! I'll be posting today's "Dear Gov Dean" letter later today.
Peace.
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 12:56 PM
Response to Original message
11. Sorry I missed this yesterday. We had 5 inches of snow and played
outside with the kids. Definitely rec'd.

this issue of torture/war crimes needs to remain on the Greates page for all to remember!
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Neat!! Thank you.
Peace.
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
13. I think I'm starting to get it: Contempt for protection of the innocent.
That's the core of their deeply immoral, anti-American ethos.

That's why they can defend torture as necessary in a "post 9/11 world", while ignoring the fact that something like 70% of the Iraqis detained by us in their own country, and tortured at Abu Ghraib and other sites, were innocent people swept up mass arrests.

That's why they can hold a guy for two months after they KNOW he's innocent, then dump him in a remote mountain location.

That's why the deaths of 100,000 innocent Iraqi civilians as a result of this war can be ignored. Have we killed more Iraqis than Saddam yet? We've almost sacrificed as many soldiers in Iraq as there were victims on 9/11. Those soldiers: innocent.

Secret prisons into which people disappear: no protection for potentially innocent people. Zero.


America is all about the rule of law, and due process. This regime has stood all of that on its head. They must be held accountable.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-10-05 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. "America is all about the rule of law, and due process. This regime has
... has stood all of that on its head. They must be held accountable."

I agree. One of my next letters to Gov. Dean will make reference to what I call the "Nuremberg chalice": Bush and the neoconsters will take their turn drinking from it. Can't happen soon enough, but, it will not happen unless we are unrelenting in holding them accountable.


Peace.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 01:13 PM
Response to Original message
14. Let's not forget Posada Carriles either.
The reason we can't extradite him to Venezuela is that he "might be tortured".

http://www.stabroeknews.com/index.pl/article_general_news?id=38275890
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Inland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 01:30 PM
Response to Original message
15. K&R nt
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BigBearJohn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 06:36 PM
Response to Original message
16. This is REPREHENSIBLE. The list keeps growing and growing and growing....
What the hell does it take to wake up this nation? :nuke:
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-09-05 07:12 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. "What the hell does it take to wake up this nation?" .... Our being as ...
... unrelenting in forcing the truth into clear, persistent view. We just need to keep at it, my friend.


Peace.
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