Why is using the "b-word" Sexist?

I'm serious and would like some serious answers as to why that's sexist.

:popcorn:

It used to be a way for men to demean women and "put them in their place". But more and more that word has lost its power and is used for men,too.

Khash.

that hardly makes it not sexist, that just means that it is now homophobic as well, depending on context

your wife is at work, would you expect people to be calling her a bitch just for doing her job? or would you accept that calling her a bitch is a hostile act meant to make her feel like less valuable of a person

name calling is tacky and name calling to put women down is sexist period

it shouldn't be that hard to figure out

So, I fail to see how that's not sexist

:shrug:

i expressed myself poorly, you expressed it well

:pals:

It's still a very sexist word. It's still used mostly to demean women. And when it's used to demean men it's used to demean them as being less than manly.

It is used to belittle any sign of assertiveness in a woman.

I do sometimes hear it used in a casual or lighthearted way, but that doesn't mean it is only being used that way now, or even being used that way most of the time. I still mostly hear it used as a sexist attack on women.

and also to belittle any perceived LACK of assertiveness when used towards a man.

What a fucked up work we've created for ourselves.

And when a guy is said to "Be someone's B****" it's an explicite reference to being "owned" like a submissive or abused girlfriend or wife. It is specifically a gender loaded term that refers to women being dominated by men even when it's used to insult men.

but less so. Have you ever thought about the swear words we use, even when used against a man, they demean women. I think/hope I see a change. Slow, but happening.At last.

khash.

So no one thinks it is? Good. I agree with you all.

I want to understand the other point of view...

A popcorn fest all your own.

Lots of interesting discussion here. I'm going to have to read and respond later.

too many women have been beaten while a man yelled "bitch" at them.

It's just silly to deny that the word is sexist. It's also unnecessarily hateful when referring to a democratic candidate for President. Such characterizations just don't belong in GDP - and the mods agreed.

Using the B word is just as bad as using any other slur, and should be taken just as seriously.

Meaning, if it's used among friends then that's fine, but everyone else should leave it alone. I don't mind if a friend calls me a fag or queer (though I don't encourage it), but God help anyone else who says it. The n-word is often used by friends, but it's still a slur if you say it to someone you don't know.

He's just trying to justify somebody calling Hillary Clinton a bitch in GDP. It's bad enough we have such hateful misogynists here, but even worse that others try to defend their obviously sexist crap.

that at a time when we should be celebrating the fact that our party has a black man and a woman as front-runners for our ticket, we resort to this sort of petty bullshit that's more suited to republicans and the like.

I didn't say speaking about Hillary in that way was justified AT ALL. Nor was I trying to justify it. I was intrigued by the idea raised by some that it was sexist. It's unacceptable, but I'm not sure if it's sexist (reveals sexism) or misogynistic.

Please don't put words in my mouth or thoughts in my head when you have no idea. And I'll show you the same courtesy. Deal? Thanks. :hi:

young woman with the "b" word in letters about 2 inches high tattooed just below the collar line on the back of her neck. I was so appalled. Of course, she was proudly displaying this travesty.

I think that a woman has the right to claim bitch as a "fuck you" to patriarchy. I'm happy to refer to myself as a bitch as long as men are going to throw the word around as an insult against women they find intimidating. If that's what they want to call a real woman, a woman who isn't deferential to men, then sign me up -- I'll consider myself a bitch. However, if a man calls me a bitch he'll have to deal with my wrath. A lot like the N word in that way. Only acceptable for self-expression in contempt of the status quo.

It's just like any other insult that is reclaimed by the original target (the n word, dyke, etc.) It's a sense of empowerment, I believe.

Dave Chappelle, for one, IIRC. He walked away from his fabulously successful television show, and 50 million dollar contract with Comedy Central, because he realized that perpetuating sterotypes and hurtful names about blacks didn't empower them. He, and others, realized that they can try to reclaim the word all they want, but a large portion of white America still sees them as "niggers". They've only empowered white America more - how many times have you heard someone say "how come blacks can call themselves niggers but if I do, it's a big problem?"

I feel the same way about the word bitch. I don't see there ever being a benign use of that word, and when women call themselves "bitches" it only empowers misogynists - "hey, if she calls herself a bitch, why can't I?'".

IMO, women who proudly flaunt that word, and use it to describe themselves, hurt all women, whether they know or even care about it.

Not whether or not I agreed with it. Sorry if I didn't make that clear.

came off that way. I'm sorry for the confusion, too. :hi:

I'm not A bitch

I'm THE bitch.

And that's MS. BITCH to you.

need there be any reason more than that?

Historically, the word has been used to degrade women, and though it has other uses, that may be how it feels to the recipient.

Thank you, Indy.

i dunno

or at least an unmarried woman.

still a slur against women

interesting how our language evolved eh?

:hi:

"51%-Sweetheart, 49%-Bitch, Don't push it!" BTW, I agree that, since the word is used to demean women and "less assertive" men, it's use is often sexist.

"I'm a bitch and I'm proud of it!" Huh? And once my BIL said that my family (mostly female) is a family of bitches..Didn't go over very well with me...:eyes:

I see bitch and bastard as the gender specific words that mean the same thing.

A woman can be called both a bastard and a bitch, technically.

Bitch has a lot of connotations that bastard doesn't, and has traditionally been used to put women down, where bastard hasn't put men down, but put down an individual down.

So the words mean different things to different people.

as in "your mama couldn't keep her legs shut and now you don't know who your daddy is"

demeaning towards women, therefore it's still sexist. It's saying that men are like women, therefore the women get hit twice.

That was obviously from a woman.

I'll agree that using the b word on a man, hits women twice. But the woman who made that assertion argued that men got hit 0 times and saying that it is sexist to consider it an insult to be like a woman. I strongly disagree with that. It's still hits men once. The b word is still offensive.

insulted? I'm not clear where you're at with this. Because my opinion is that a man should NOT be insulted by being compared to a woman. If you think he should be insulted, that's pretty, well..., insulting.

but when you call someone by a term where the intent is to insult them, then that is insulting. A handy analogy would be the people who say it's not insulting to say Obama is Muslim or that Hillary is a lesbian because it's not insulting to be a Muslim or a lesbian.

Likewise, there are people who insult athletic or physically fit women by calling them names comparing them to men. It's not an insult to be compared to a man either, but the intent matters and the offensive terms matter.

It is a word that compares women to dogs if they decline to act submissive.

...makes the speaker a misogynist. Sad, but true.

Or better yet, since halfway through this thread you decided to listen to those who hold your preconceived idea that it is not sexist, why don't you walk up to your mom and grandmother and call them bitches. Then explain you mean it in the positive way. See how far that gets you.

just doesn't work.

I'm asking why it's "sexist."

forget about it.

I wouldn't raise the issue with any female friends, though.

:loveya:

does that help?

:thumbsup:

I wonder if gender specific insults are per se sexist?

For example, I would never call a woman a "dick." It is a term I use for men I dislike. Just as you're using it for me, I assume you wouldn't call me that if you thought I was female. That begs the question to me whether that is sexist? My thought is that a gender specific insult like that isn't per se sexist.

What say you?

where the one being the -ist (racist, sexist) has to belong to a group that has traditionally had power over the one being insulted.

i'm just being a non-gender specific smartass.

under the guise of being a smart-ass. I thought it was quite clever of you.

I don't say it as sexist. But if people hear it as sexist, then it's a problem.

But if the intent isn't there, whose problem is it?

"Dog" is the male hound, "Bitch" is the female hound. There is no problem with being a dog, but a big one with being a bitch.

Its a very handy word for expressing frustration. I like the word asshole for men too. But, (forgive the pun) you can't call a woman an asshole because even though she has one or might be one it is an innappropriate use of language. I perfer bitch for female assholes

power.

Nope. won't happen here. no way.

and ESPECIALLY not here!

are actually being the real crybabies.

without having to use the word "bitch" in regards to calling a woman one... or the "c" word for that matter. I've heard plenty of women refer to themselves as "bitch" though, when they think they did something wrong.

And, I don't say that somebody showing courage has "balls" - it's easy enough to say that they have "guts" or a "spine" or "backbone" or even "gumption"

:loveya: :thumbsup:

somehow, the words "balls" or "testicular fortitude" don't come to mind when I see or hear about a woman doing something courageous.

I guess something is wrong with me.

I have been called every offensive name known to man in my 54 years. I used to fret and fume at the insensitive people who spouted insults. Then I studied cognitive therapy and realized that I had thoughts and beliefs about the concepts that the words evoked and those thoughts and beliefs - mostly about my own perceived inferiority and my hunger for status socially.

So what I did is I came to know myself - my strengths and weaknesses and accepted them. I came to realize that I was, like everyone else, just a fallible human being. I further realized that status, fallibility, inferiority and strengths are perceptual and phenomenological values are relative and therefore insignificant.

Now I can called anything, and knowing myself fairly well I am usually able to laugh it off. I remain against sexism, homophobia, racism and classicism but I don't demand books to be burned or words to be scorned, or speach to be censored. People will rise above themselves and then they will rise above the power of words. Only then will we actually be "progressive."

I'll speak up because that's MY right. There are so many things that people say because no one challenges them. I personally learned to be less racist because people challenged my comments and attitudes.

Do I care what individuals say about me? Rarely. But I do care about allowing outdated and unproductive attitudes to continue just because that's always the way things have been.

Just like Bastard is sexist as well.

Why is using a gender specific insult necessarily sexist?

:banghead:

I mean it. Ask your mother if "bitch" is sexist. I really want to know what she says to you.

She would have laughed

and would have slapped my face.

however, some people can be bitches pretty often.

You can't get anywhere advocating censorship - either you scorn and dispense with free speech - or you grow beyond it. There is nothing progressive about putting people in a position where they can't offend - Their words speak for their character. Without their offensive words - how would you know their true character? They would appear saints like you perhaps? Do way with your ego, not speech.

It wouldn't make it not racist.

and attitudes at the offensive have to spew them off in all directions.

But you do have a point. There is a level where it doesn't need an equivalent not to be an -ist word.

Bitch carries other stuff with it - it's not just being female, it's being a female acting a certain way. It would be sexist if anything, for that. The behavior that will get that label for a woman doesn't get any negative man-label.

I suppose that the word "it" could be sexist in the right context if you stretch it far enough.

Remember when folks used to say "brotha" - lot of time now its "nigga.":yoiks:

Nice job :toast:

Hope you're having a lot of fun here. It's more fun to start off somewhere new by trying to understand where people are coming from instead of poking and prodding them to get some sort of reaction.

But you go ahead. Post away.

:grouphug:

She just called me a bit ago to tell me she was scared because some big boys were laughing and calling her and her 9 yr old friend ugly little bitches. I saw the big boys..they're about 14-15 yrs old.

Sexist? Tell me why it's not.

:eyes:

Bashflingin.

The most offensive word in the english language and it should be banned. People who use it should be condemned to death.

instead of continuing to post responses to the original post?

;)

about 'bastard!'

which basically brings it around to be sexist against women

;-)

Just like the person with homosexual feelings that secretly hates gays because he's afraid of his/her own hidden homosexual feelings, people who demand political correctness and a non-judgmental attitude are most allergic to love.

They secretly hate open duologue, free expression, free speech, and people who think differently while they take the position of a "tolerant" progressive.

They state that they are liberal and therefore believe in respect for all points of view, yet they have little tolerance and no respect for alternate points of view - They go to insults.

They are not liberal
They are not progressive
They want control and stifle free speech

But me, I'm worse.I wasn't true to my "last word." Let's keep this up. I have enjoyed this - let's keep our "tolerance" low and prove to those laughing conservatives our innate and subtle greatness.
:rofl:

envelope, aren't you? :eyes:

:cry:

For some odd reason you think you are being funny.

I was talking about a "reaction formation" a defense mechanism where a person punishes others to deny his own inner feelings that are the same as the person he is punishing. I don't have a homophobic bone in my body - I grew up in California with gay and lesbian friends and relivives. One of my specialties as a psychotherapist is gay and lesbian issues. I often do couples therapy with gay and lesbian couples. On the issue of Race I am a long standing member and chair of the Human rights task force in Idaho. I was instrumental is getting the Aryan nations out of Idaho and shutting them down. On the issue of the environment, I am a regional coordinator for a river conservation organization. On the issue of woman's equality I am a radical feminist and have been for 30 years. Don't let the "Idaho" label fool you. I'm just a free and critical thinker even where liberal issues are concerned. I am also an activist in the labor movement.

Ok. Congratulations on all your accomplishments anyway. At least it's clear from your record that you are willing to learn.

"Nothing up my sleeve"
"PRESTO" ---- GROWL
"I gota get another hat"

:yoiks:

Or how having standards in debate is a violation of free speech.

:spank:

angry... hmmm...

is that I get less angry and just become disdainfully amused.

so that's a fairly natural state for me to fall into. :P

Words do have power to do harm and I should have responded to all of you individually. The problem is that I am at work and I only have small breaks between seeing clients. True, it would be a lot more fair to answer everyone.

In the interests of peace. I'll tell you all a story about the B word my wife told me posted to the end of the posts from the original post.

She was the boss of a corporation and an employee called her an Fing Bitch. She gave him his paycheck unsigned. He stormed up to the business a 6 PM and said "you Fing B - my check couldn't be cashed. She said - "mayee you should remember the bitch who signs them"

Anyway, I'm old like these other folks who posted and the truth is I don't get too riled up about stuff like this either. I just like to get people going on an argument that is really somewhat indefensible - such as using the B word is appropriate. Of course it is not defensible depending upon the context in which it is used. I never call a woman a bitch (except Ann Colter).

I think my point is really that, with practice, one can overcome the ill effects of words using the power of one's mind and that is better than creating a society in which people are afraid to be themselves.

You might find this hard to believe, but I love and respect women. I'm the only male in an office of 20 females. My wife and I are deeply committed to each other and respect each other deeply. We don't talk this way. And, regarding the women at work, I don't think the same as they and in many ways our values are different, but I enjoy them so much. I have never, not once called any of them by the B word.

I moved from California to Idaho 20 yeas ago, I lived through the 50s and 60s. I watched black folks beat with sticks. I saw the college protests. I saw all of the Kennedy's killed or assassinated. I was in riots. I supported women's rights at marches. I ate the tear gas.

Now, Ive been in idaho for 20 years. Here, you can't say "Damn," you can't say "Hell." You can't say anything progressive or liberal. When you speak at colleagues or universities, people are offended if you make a democratic or non conservative point to your audience you get gasps and shunning. Freedom of speech is dead and I just want people to remember what the costs are. I'm deeply sorry if I offended.

I just hope I started some people thinking on a deeper level about these issues. Because it really isn't about you or me. It is about global standards regarding expression. No using that word for me unless Its Ann Courter.

But it's awfully condescending when you discount others' offense at its use.

:shrug:

or calling gay men faggots.

and other such bullshit?

I'm actually quite fallable - but dont tell anybody. They get mean too.:shrug:

"I'm actually quite fallable"

;)

I come here for funny.

:thumbsup:

Thanks. This took me a minute that I'm never going to get back.

And I think you are just stirring shit. :eyes:

:toast:

:banghead:

is the name for a female hound, Dog, is the name for a male one.

"Doe, a deer, a female deer . . . "

Yes, we are sexist, we notice the difference between sexes.

That "Bitch" has become a derogatory term is natural. Every culture likes to deride people with animal names by way of reduction.

Sexism? Well, good luck getting rid of it. Best bet is to take up the weapons left behind by your enemies and use them against them.

I think you know the answer, and you are just being an ass.

So I gave it serious consideration, and alerted on this thread.

thanks, lil missy!

:eyes:

when aimed at a woman demotes her to the status of a dog.