Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

UCSB Geologist Discovers Pattern in Earth's Long-Term Climate Record

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Environment/Energy Donate to DU
 
OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-06-10 10:29 PM
Original message
UCSB Geologist Discovers Pattern in Earth's Long-Term Climate Record
Edited on Tue Apr-06-10 10:31 PM by OKIsItJustMe
http://www.ia.ucsb.edu/pa/display.aspx?pkey=2212

UCSB Geologist Discovers Pattern in Earth's Long-Term Climate Record

April 6, 2010

(Santa Barbara, Calif.) –– In an analysis of the past 1.2 million years, UC Santa Barbara geologist Lorraine Lisiecki discovered a pattern that connects the regular changes of the Earth's orbital cycle to changes in the Earth's climate. The finding is reported in this week's issue of the scientific journal Nature Geoscience.

Lisiecki performed her analysis of climate by examining ocean sediment cores. These cores come from 57 locations around the world. By analyzing sediments, scientists are able to chart the Earth's climate for millions of years in the past. Lisiecki's contribution is the linking of the climate record to the history of the Earth's orbit.

It is known that the Earth's orbit around the sun changes shape every 100,000 years. The orbit becomes either more round or more elliptical at these intervals. The shape of the orbit is known as its "eccentricity." A related aspect is the 41,000-year cycle in the tilt of the Earth's axis.

Glaciation of the Earth also occurs every 100,000 years. Lisiecki found that the timing of changes in climate and eccentricity coincided. "The clear correlation between the timing of the change in orbit and the change in the Earth's climate is strong evidence of a link between the two," said Lisiecki. "It is unlikely that these events would not be related to one another."

Besides finding a link between change in the shape of the orbit and the onset of glaciation, Lisiecki found a surprising correlation. She discovered that the largest glacial cycles occurred during the weakest changes in the eccentricity of Earth's orbit –– and vice versa. She found that the stronger changes in the Earth's orbit correlated to weaker changes in climate. "This may mean that the Earth's climate has internal instability in addition to sensitivity to changes in the orbit," said Lisiecki.

She concludes that the pattern of climate change over the past million years likely involves complicated interactions between different parts of the climate system, as well as three different orbital systems. The first two orbital systems are the orbit's eccentricity, and tilt. The third is "precession," or a change in the orientation of the rotation axis.

###


http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/vaop/ncurrent/abs/ngeo828.html

(See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milutin_Milankovi%C4%87">Milutin Milanković)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-06-10 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. There was a somewhat surprising local forum discussion about this.
It seems there are people in all corners of the world who are superficially demeaning.

http://www.edhat.com/site/tidbit.cfm?id=1215&tid=1394&art=29186
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-06-10 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Some years back, I kept company with a Geologist
Edited on Tue Apr-06-10 11:12 PM by OKIsItJustMe
She gave a presentation to her department regarding "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles">Milankovitch Cycles." (I helped her prepare some graphics.) At that time, virtually none of her colleagues had heard of this theory of glaciation.

I'm willing to assume that Professor Lisiecki has brought something new to this field of study, but let's give credit where credit is due.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
starroute Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-06-10 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. I have some sheets on this that I must have xeroxed in the 1970's
I'm not sure what they're from -- maybe Scientific American -- but they cite the work of N. Shackleton and N. Opdyke using oxygen isotopes in marine fossils and also mention tables prepared by A.D. Vernekar. This is when it was first realized that there hadn't just been four ice ages in the last million years or so but that they'd occurred with a regular 100,000-year periodicity.

Googling on "Shackleton and Opdyke" reveals that their groundbreaking work was published in 1973 and 1976. (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6VBC-4N0YV5P-1&_user=10&_coverDate=12%2F31%2F2006&_rdoc=1&_fmt=high&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_searchStrId=1284208392&_rerunOrigin=google&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=91d49267a20fe81f8515ba91e885e830) And Anandu Vernekar was working on ice age climates by 1975. (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6WPN-4DV0NYR-6C&_user=10&_coverDate=09%2F30%2F1975&_rdoc=1&_fmt=high&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_rerunOrigin=google&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=726ea31f70b2b6c0a7f3295ececffda1)

So the credit here has to go a fair ways back.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dogmudgeon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Milankovitch himself connected the cycles to glaciation
Of course, he realized it would take more than his own hypothesizing to settle the matter. In the past 70 years since he first published, his hypotheses have been confirmed overall. Prof. Lisiecki has probably found new, compelling lines of evidence to support this confirmation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milutin_Milankovi%C4%87">More insight on this illustrious scientist can also be found at Wikipedia.

--d!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 07:44 AM
Response to Original message
5. As I'm sure others expected
This appears (once again) to be a somewhat poorly written press release, in that it does not credit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milutin_Milankovi%C4%87">Milutin Milanković, but had it been written by Professor Lisiecki, I'm confident it would have.

http://www.lorraine-lisiecki.com/
...

Research Interests

My research focuses on computational approaches to the interpretation of paleoclimate records. I believe that the integrated analysis of widely distributed paleoclimate records will yield important information about the climate system that cannot be obtained by studying these records individually. I am particularly interested in the evolution of Plio-Pleistocene climate as it relates to Milankovitch forcing, 100-kyr glacial cycles, and deep-ocean circulation. I also develop and distribute software related to age model development and stratigraphy. The analytical techniques I use most frequently are stratigraphic correlation, simple physical models, dynamic programming, and mathematical tools such as time series analysis, principal component analysis, and computational probability and statistics.

http://www.lorraine-lisiecki.com/simple.html">What does this mean? Simple, non-technical explanations of what I study and why. Also, PowerPoint slides for teachers.
...



http://www.lorraine-lisiecki.com/simple.html
...

What causes glacial cycles?

Glaciers and ice sheets form when winter snow does not completely melt away each summer. Then the next winter's snow falls on top of this old snow, and even more snow is left behind after the next summer. After many years, this small imbalance in snowfall versus melting can create huge ice sheets. Whether or not snow melts completely away each year is primarily controlled by the amount of summer sunlight. This is known as Milankovitch theory.

The amount of sunlight received at a certain location varies with time due to cyclic changes in the Earth's orbit and tilt. These change with time due to the gravitational forces of the moon and the other planets. The three three types of change are tilt (obliquity), precession, and eccentricity. They vary in cycles of 19,000 to 400,000 years. The strongest cycle in summer sunlight in ice-sheet forming regions is 23,000 years caused by precession, but glacial cycles over the last million years are all about 100,000 years long, which is the length of one eccentricity cycle. Before that time, glacial cycles were 41,000 years long, corresponding to the length of the cycle in Earth's tilt. Why the ice sheets respond most strongly to the 41,000 and 100,000 year cycles is one of the biggest mysteries in our field. Read more about http://www.lorraine-lisiecki.com/thesis_appendix.html#1-1-Milankovitch-Theory">Milankovitch theory and http://www.lorraine-lisiecki.com/thesis_appendix.html#1-2-Orbital-Cycles">orbital cycles.

http://www.lorraine-lisiecki.com/orbital_cycles.ppt">Download Power Point slides illustrating the different orbital cycles.
...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eppur_se_muova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Thanks for helping set the record straight.
University press releases, unfortunately, are all too often written to highlight the accomplishments of the U's own researchers, and gloss over niceties such as crediting prior research. The researchers themselves follow the usual professional standards of citing all major previous work, from whatever source.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Viking12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
6. Just more research confirming Milankovitch's long accepted theory
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Some still dispute the theory
Edited on Wed Apr-07-10 01:11 PM by OKIsItJustMe
From the appendix to Professor Lisiecki's thesis:

http://www.lorraine-lisiecki.com/thesis_appendix.html#1-1-Milankovitch-Theory
...

The main argument in favor of Milankovitch theory is the dominance of precession, obliquity, and eccentricity frequencies in both insolation changes and the climate record. |For opposing viewpoints, see Winograd et al., 1992; Muller and MacDonald, 1997; Wunsch, 2004|. The main challenge is that high-latitude summer insolation is dominated by 19- and 23-kyr precession cycles, but late Pleistocene glacial cycles are 100 kyr and early Pleistocene glacial cycles are 41 kyr. The many variations of Milankovitch theory created to account for this discrepancy are collectively known as theories of orbital forcing, due to their emphasis on the role that Earth's orbital configuration plays in controlling insolation. However, the specific mechanisms by which insolation changes produce observed climate responses are still poorly understood; some recent theories are presented in Section 1.3.

...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Viking12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Dispute may be the wrong term here....
Wunsch (2004), for instance, does not dispute the theory but makes an argument that the case isn't yet strong enough given complexity of the system and the sparsity of paleo-data.

http://ocean.mit.edu/~cwunsch/papersonline/milankovitchqsr2004.pdf
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Hmmm... interesting paper (thanks for the link)
Edited on Wed Apr-07-10 01:53 PM by OKIsItJustMe
...

Abstract

A number of records commonly described as showing control of climate change by Milankovitch insolation forcing are re-examined. The fraction of the record variance attributable to orbital changes never exceeds 20%. In no case, including a tuned core, do these forcing bands explain the overall behavior of the records. At zero order, all records are consistent with stochastic models of varying complexity with a small superimposed Milankovitch response, mainly in the obliquity band. Evidence cited to support the hypothesis that the 100 Ka glacial/interglacial cycles are controlled by the quasi-periodic insolation forcing is likely indistinguishable from chance, given the small sample size and near-integer ratios of 100 Ka to the precessional periods. At the least, the stochastic background ‘‘noise’’ is likely to be of importance.

...

6. Summary

The main issue is the small sample size: seven Pleistocene ice ages with six intervals. The resulting record of myriadic climate variability in deep-sea and ice cores is dominated by processes indistinguishable from stochastic, apart from a very small amount (less than 20% and sometimes less than 1%) of the variance attributable to insolation forcing. Climate variability in this range of periods is difficult to distinguish from a form of random walk with small superimposed deterministic elements. Evidence that Milankovitch forcing ‘‘controls’’ the records, in particular the 100 ka glacial/interglacial, is very thin and somewhat implausible, given that most of the high frequency variability lies elsewhere. These results are not a proof of stochastic control of the Pleistocene glaciations, nor that deterministic elements are not in part a factor. But the stochastic behavior hypothesis should not be set aside arbitrarily—as it has at least as strong a foundation as does that of orbital control.

...


It sounds like a http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dispute">dispute to me, but there's no need for us to argue the point.

Suffice it to say that more evidence has been added in favor of what Wunsch termed, "The so-called Milankovitch hypothesis."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Viking12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Touche'
I am a French commie for using that term?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Yes.
Thanks for the information. ;)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #11
16. I have nothing against "French commies"
:toast:

"The French don't care what they do actually, as long as they pronounce it properly."
- Henry Higgins
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NickB79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 02:47 AM
Response to Original message
13. Is it too early to compare recent climate records to this cycle?
In order to see whether current trends are within or outside the ranges that would be expected?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Viking12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. The orbital forcings happen on a scale of many hundreds to thousands of years.
The current changes are of a rate and magnitude that eliminates orbital forcing as the culprit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pscot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
15. What is the relevance of these cyclic changes
Edited on Thu Apr-08-10 10:39 AM by pscot
to ourcurrent situation, if any? It seems obvious that we've been in a warming period for the last 18 to 20 thousand years. Where are we now in terms of thse orbital cycles? To what extent is the current warming atributable to the forcing effects of one or more of these cycles? How long before the wheel turns and the planet begins cooling again?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Viking12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. ....
What is the relevance of these cyclic changes to our current situation, if any? To what extent is the current warming attributable to the forcing effects of one or more of these cycles?

None and none.


It seems obvious that we've been in a warming period for the last 18 to 20 thousand years. Where are we now in terms of these orbital cycles? How long before the wheel turns and the planet begins cooling again?

About 2/3 through the predicted 23K interglacial. It will be quite some time before the orbital forcings would be manifest. "A model of future climate based on the observed orbital-climate relation- ships, but ignoring anthropogenic effects, predicts that the long-term trend over the next several thousand years is toward extensive Northern Hemisphere glaciation" (p. 12)
http://www.mantleplumes.org/WebDocuments/Hays1976.pdf
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. heh
It is some bs that the amount of sunshine predicates the amount of ice, eh?

It is air temperature that decides whether water is frozen or not.

Glaciers in the high mountains close to the equator and receiving abundant sunlight year round were melted away before being formed? Of course not. But the warming air temperatures due to co2 are melting the always sunlit glaciers. The only change has been warming air not the amounts of sunlight.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Actually, soot (AKA "black carbon") may be more of a problem than CO2 for the mountain glaciers
http://newscenter.lbl.gov/feature-stories/2010/02/03/black-carbon-himalayan-glaciers/

Black Carbon a Significant Factor in Melting of Himalayan Glaciers

February 03, 2010
Julie Chao 510-486-6491 JHChao@lbl.gov
Email Print AA
Feature

The fact that glaciers in the Himalayan mountains are thinning is not disputed. However, few researchers have attempted to rigorously examine and quantify the causes. Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory scientist Surabi Menon set out to isolate the impacts of the most commonly blamed culprit—greenhouse gases, such as carbon dioxide—from other particles in the air that may be causing the melting. Menon and her collaborators found that airborne black carbon aerosols, or soot, from India is a major contributor to the decline in snow and ice cover on the glaciers.

“Our simulations showed greenhouse gases alone are not nearly enough to be responsible for the snow melt,” says Menon, a physicist and staff scientist in Berkeley Lab’s Environmental Energy Technologies Division. “Most of the change in snow and ice cover—about 90 percent—is from aerosols. Black carbon alone contributes at least 30 percent of this sum.”

Menon and her collaborators used two sets of aerosol inventories by Indian researchers to run their simulations; their results were published online in the journal Atmospheric Chemistry and Physics.

The actual contribution of black carbon, emitted largely as a result of burning fossil fuels and biomass, may be even higher than 30 percent because the inventories report less black carbon than what has been measured by observations at several stations in India. (However, these observations are too incomplete to be used in climate models.) “We may be underestimating the amount of black carbon by as much as a factor of four,” she says.

...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. well, ok, maybe
But the thing is, it is air pollution which is man generated, not sunshine.

It is the atmosphere which keeps the planet from burning on the sunny side up or going into a freeze on the dark side. And it is atmospheric pollution which is altering the balance and making the higher altitudes hotter, making the ice melt from glaciers.

Personally, I think the biggest culprit is the airplanes at high altitude spewing the crap. There is nothing up there to filter like there is on the ground. Think about that the next time yall fly.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun May 12th 2024, 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Environment/Energy Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC