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New Jersey to add more nuclear, decision criticized by pesticide expert

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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 06:44 PM
Original message
New Jersey to add more nuclear, decision criticized by pesticide expert


"Environmental groups in New Jersey have something new to be unhappy about. Public Service Enterprise Group (PSEG) told the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) it will file an Early Site Permit (ESP) for a new nuclear reactor to be located in Lower Alloways Creek Township on the Delaware River in Salem County, NJ. If built a new reactor will join Salem 1 & 2 units and the Hope Creek reactor all operated by PSEG.

The NRC held an informational meeting on May 6 in Salem County to begin the lengthy regulatory process that could lead to approval of construction of a new reactor. The ESP is the first step in a process which could take up to 20 years depending on how fast the utility chooses to develop the project.

Environmental groups were quick to criticize the move parroting familiar lines about why nuclear energy won’t work. Jane Nogaki, spoke for the New Jersey Environmental Federation. Nogaki, who according to her web site profile, is an expert on pesticides, told the meeting the new reactor is not needed."

http://djysrv.blogspot.com/2010/05/new-jersey-has-more-nukes-in-its-future.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+blogspot%2FYiuo+%28Idaho+Samizdat%29
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Fledermaus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
1. But you are an expert in music, and you expect us to believe you?
I think I would bet on the person with a science degree.
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NNadir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Really? Maybe we should bacteriologists to design aircraft...
How about we get Ph.D's in computer science to rule on how to brain surgery?

How about we get dumbass people who believe that they should take perfectly good bicycles that consume no dangerous fossil fuels and http://www.fledermaus.us/">motorize them to rule on whether nuclear science, the science of Fermi, Seaborg, Wheeler and Bohr, should be banned because bicycle mechanics are incompetant to understand the fucking subject.

How about we get a stupid paid off Harvard dropout paid by BP to tell us all about how magic solar will save us while arguing to destroy the world's largest, by far, source of climate change gas free energy.

One would need to know absolutely zero about a scientific education to think that a bacteriologist knows shit from shinola about nuclear engineering.


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Fledermaus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Apparenty you are happy, with some one with degree in music telling us how much radiation is safe.
Edited on Sun May-23-10 11:11 PM by Fledermaus
How many units of what is safe?
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. I am not happy, with flying mouse, telling how much radiation is not safe.
Flying mouse is not nuclear expert. Flying mouse does not even "look" like nuclear expert.


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Fledermaus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Well, I have an engineering degree and I work with radiation every day.
Edited on Mon May-24-10 02:33 PM by Fledermaus
and the mouse is just one of several hobbies/experiments.

However, its not what type of education some one has but if they understand the scientific method.

You don't. At times your arguments are based on nothing but a personal whim.

And the hypocrisy of what you posted considering your own background!
:shrug:
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. They let you have an engineering degree with your poor command of grammar,
spelling, and logic?

They'll hand out a diploma to anyone these days. :D

Now back to my hypocrisy - I don't recall offering an opinion anywhere in OP, but I'm absolutely certain someone with your firm grasp on scientific method and attention to detail can show me where I did.

Thanks!
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kristopher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Your denial is a real testament to your courage.
You remind me of GW Shrub and the claims that he never said Iraq was behind 911. Just because your communication wasn't couched in direct declarative statements doesn't mean your message was vague or unclear.

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jpak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. apparently non-scientist autodidacts can design molten salt breeder reactors that eat CO2
:rofl:
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Heywood J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
5. "According to her website profile"?
Okay, so a self-described pesticide expert is now an expert on nuclear technology, electrical and civil engineering, and running a utility. It's not needed because she says it's not needed.

Christine Guhl, speaking for the New Jersey Chapter of the Sierra Club, expressed similar views. She told the news media an new nuclear plant will compete for investor funds that should be going to renewable energy projects.
Gasp - you mean competing for investment in the market that all other things requiring investment must compete in? Investors might have a choice in where their money goes? Shame!

I love how most nuclear-related articles are filled with "_____ says" and "_____ believe". Can we please have some actual facts?
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kristopher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Sure
Nuclear power isn't needed:

http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2010/03/29/0909075107.abstract

Cooper study is excellent comparative study of nuclear vs renewable alternatives:
http://www.olino.org/us/articles/2009/11/26/the-economics-of-nuclear-reactors-renaissance-or-relapse

Graphs from Cooper study
Nuclear power is too expensive and has too many externalities and risks:




Nuclear power industry uses a "lowball" strategy to sucker billions out of the public purse:


Nuclear costs are rising, while renewable costs are going the opposite direction - down.


Nuclear is a third rate solution to climate change and energy security needs. Comparative evaluation of all current options for meeting noncarbon energy needs:
Abstract here: http://www.rsc.org/publishing/journals/EE/article.asp?doi=b809990c

Full article for download here: http://www.stanford.edu/group/efmh/jacobson/revsolglobwarmairpol.htm


Energy Environ. Sci., 2009, 2, 148 - 173, DOI: 10.1039/b809990c

Review of solutions to global warming, air pollution, and energy security

Mark Z. Jacobson

Abstract
This paper reviews and ranks major proposed energy-related solutions to global warming, air pollution mortality, and energy security while considering other impacts of the proposed solutions, such as on water supply, land use, wildlife, resource availability, thermal pollution, water chemical pollution, nuclear proliferation, and undernutrition.

Nine electric power sources and two liquid fuel options are considered. The electricity sources include solar-photovoltaics (PV), concentrated solar power (CSP), wind, geothermal, hydroelectric, wave, tidal, nuclear, and coal with carbon capture and storage (CCS) technology. The liquid fuel options include corn-ethanol (E85) and cellulosic-E85. To place the electric and liquid fuel sources on an equal footing, we examine their comparative abilities to address the problems mentioned by powering new-technology vehicles, including battery-electric vehicles (BEVs), hydrogen fuel cell vehicles (HFCVs), and flex-fuel vehicles run on E85.

Twelve combinations of energy source-vehicle type are considered. Upon ranking and weighting each combination with respect to each of 11 impact categories, four clear divisions of ranking, or tiers, emerge.

Tier 1 (highest-ranked) includes wind-BEVs and wind-HFCVs.
Tier 2 includes CSP-BEVs, geothermal-BEVs, PV-BEVs, tidal-BEVs, and wave-BEVs.
Tier 3 includes hydro-BEVs, nuclear-BEVs, and CCS-BEVs.
Tier 4 includes corn- and cellulosic-E85.

Wind-BEVs ranked first in seven out of 11 categories, including the two most important, mortality and climate damage reduction. Although HFCVs are much less efficient than BEVs, wind-HFCVs are still very clean and were ranked second among all combinations.

Tier 2 options provide significant benefits and are recommended.

Tier 3 options are less desirable. However, hydroelectricity, which was ranked ahead of coal-CCS and nuclear with respect to climate and health, is an excellent load balancer, thus recommended.

The Tier 4 combinations (cellulosic- and corn-E85) were ranked lowest overall and with respect to climate, air pollution, land use, wildlife damage, and chemical waste. Cellulosic-E85 ranked lower than corn-E85 overall, primarily due to its potentially larger land footprint based on new data and its higher upstream air pollution emissions than corn-E85.

Whereas cellulosic-E85 may cause the greatest average human mortality, nuclear-BEVs cause the greatest upper-limit mortality risk due to the expansion of plutonium separation and uranium enrichment in nuclear energy facilities worldwide. Wind-BEVs and CSP-BEVs cause the least mortality.

The footprint area of wind-BEVs is 2–6 orders of magnitude less than that of any other option. Because of their low footprint and pollution, wind-BEVs cause the least wildlife loss.

The largest consumer of water is corn-E85. The smallest are wind-, tidal-, and wave-BEVs.

The US could theoretically replace all 2007 onroad vehicles with BEVs powered by 73000–144000 5 MW wind turbines, less than the 300000 airplanes the US produced during World War II, reducing US CO2 by 32.5–32.7% and nearly eliminating 15000/yr vehicle-related air pollution deaths in 2020.

In sum, use of wind, CSP, geothermal, tidal, PV, wave, and hydro to provide electricity for BEVs and HFCVs and, by extension, electricity for the residential, industrial, and commercial sectors, will result in the most benefit among the options considered. The combination of these technologies should be advanced as a solution to global warming, air pollution, and energy security. Coal-CCS and nuclear offer less benefit thus represent an opportunity cost loss, and the biofuel options provide no certain benefit and the greatest negative impacts.



One detailed example of a plan that moves us to noncarbon energy while reducing and eventually eliminating nuclear.
Civil Society Beyond BAU
http://www.civilsocietyinstitute.org/media/pdfs/Beyond%20BAU%205-11-10.pdf

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