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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 06:13 PM
Original message
Some gun owners in Mexico defy the law to defend themselves ...

Some gun owners in Mexico defy the law to defend themselves
by Angela Kocherga / 11 News
Posted on May 13, 2011 at 11:31 PM


CIUDAD JUAREZ, Mexico – Despite strict gun-control laws in Mexico, crime scenes are riddled with bullet holes. Both drug cartels and common criminals have guns. Now more private citizens are arming themselves for protection, even if it means breaking the law.

“People are desperate,” said Rogelio “Chief” Bravo, a private investigator in El Paso who has worked for clients just across the border in Ciudad Juarez too. “They’re telling the government, if you can’t protect us, let us protect ourselves.”

Juarez is ground zero in the drug war with 8,000 killings since the city exploded in violence in 2008.
Mexican authorities regularly display the weapons they confiscate from powerful drug traffickers.

***snip***

The Mexican constitution allows people to possess firearms,” explained John Hubert, a certified-concealed hand gun instructor in El Paso. “But over the years the government has passed so many requirements and laws and restrictions that it’s basically almost impossible.”
http://www.khou.com/news/texas-news/Gun-owners-in-Mexico--121814734.html


The video at the link is worth watching.
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Kurska Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 06:17 PM
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1. Can the ATF walk some baby killing, murder machines with assault clips to these guys?
Or do they exclusively arm drug dealers?
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Since the drug gangs often use fully automatic assault rifles ...
which are not readily available at gun stores in the United States and are EXTREMELY expensive, I have long suspected that many of the firearms which are smuggled across the border are being purchased by civilians.


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lost_in_nv Donating Member (7 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
2. As well they should
If their govt. won't or can't get control of the violence, then, by all means, the citizens should arm themselves.
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ileus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 06:52 PM
Response to Original message
4. Self defense is natural law...
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sharesunited Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 09:05 PM
Response to Original message
5. I know you. You post that more guns is better. Allow me to debunk you.
Edited on Sat May-14-11 09:05 PM by sharesunited
More guns and ammo equals more death. Less guns and ammo, and more impaired access, as a conscious public policy, is a joyous peaceful condition. If you want more guns, then you are an enemy of society.

Simple as that.

Have a nice day.
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lawodevolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Let me debunk you. Nigeria, Sierra Leon and all the top 20 highest crime nations
Have strong gun control, scarce guns and ammo.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=407157&mesg_id=407157

If you look at the data available for all nations, the 90 nations with the lowest murder rate had an average of 3 times higher gun possession rate than the average murder rates of the 90 most violent nations.

Care to retract you statement above?
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-11 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. What I have consistently said was that more guns does not equal more crime ...
I never posted that more guns are better. Obviously you don't "know" me as well as you thought you did or you have a short memory of what you read.

The facts and statistics support my view. In order to debunk me you will have to produce some evidence to support your position. In order to give you a chance I will once again give you a brief summary of my position which can be shown by three graphs:


source: Bureau of Justice Statistics http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/glance/cv2.cfm

Gun Background Checks In The U.S., 1999-2009

Background checks skyrocketed to their highest levels in a decade during the last quarter of 2008 and the first quarter of 2009.*

source: http://www.npr.org/news/graphics/2009/jun/background-checks/


source:http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2011/02/u-s-gun-production-rises-to-5-4-million-firearms-in-2009/

Obviously if more more firearms caused more crime, the violent crime rate would have skyrocketed in our nation since the mid 80s. Note that I am not saying that more firearms caused the crime rate to fall because there are far too many factors that could lead to a drop in the crime rate.

Nor did I say in the OP that more guns in Mexico would improve the situation. However, I can understand how many Mexicans have lost faith in their government to stop the problems caused by the drug cartels and are willing to break the law in order to have a means of self defense.

Your accusation that I am an "enemy of society" because I "want more guns" is a blatant distortion of my position. As I have pointed out, I never have advocated more guns as a solution, in fact I have often said that I would love to return to the time when I grew up in the 50s and the 60s where only a very few people found it necessary to own a firearm for self defense. Gun owners in that period of time were, in the main, hunters, target shooters and collectors. I hope you don't consider all gun owners to be enemies of society because if you do, you have just labeled 40 million people falsely.

I hope you also have a nice day.
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