Gaza militants say they fired chemical-tipped warhead at Israel

Gaza militants say fired chemical-tipped warhead
Wed Jun 28, 2006 9:39pm ET

GAZA (Reuters) - A spokesman for gunmen in the Gaza Strip said they had fired a rocket tipped with a chemical warhead at Israel early on Thursday.

The Israeli army had no immediate comment on the claim by the spokesman from the al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, an armed wing of Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas's Fatah movement.

The group had recently claimed to possess about 20 biological warheads for the makeshift rockets commonly fired from Gaza at Israeli towns. This was the first time the group had claimed firing such a rocket.

"The al-Aqsa Brigades have fired one rocket with a chemical warhead" at southern Israel, Abu Qusai, a spokesman for the group, said in Gaza.

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsarticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyid=2006-06-29T013909Z_01_L29258645_RTRUKOC_0_US-MIDEAST-ROCKET.xml&src=rss&rpc=22

damn!

ok

This will end in genocide for one side or the other. I just know it will.

The Palestinians are fucked.

There is no one with any capability to defend them.

or Olmert.

Why jeopardize cool trade relations with the United States just over some Palestinian kids?
Profits makes the payments on the vacation home, Hummer, and trips to the Caribbean.

For the ruling elite, what is the value of Palestinian kids?

making a claim that they've fired a bio/chem weapon, Tom?

And who is the ruling elite?

but I don't know why they'd claim it either.

I seriously doubt that Israel would hide that, if it is true. However, it could indeed be a 'bluff.' We will have to wait and see.

and I did a google search, this story first appeared on the Jerusalem Post and Nut Daily, but now it has been picked up by Reuters, that is why I have said IF the story is correct... they just oppened the gates of hell. By the way... the palestinians do have chemists and as I said meking some primitive WMDs (mustard gas) does not require much of an infrastructure or investment.

feeling on this! Just this evening on a "CNN Radio News" break on Air America, there was a reference to the Israeli Army looking for its kidnapped soldier and there being some "fly by's" of Israeli Jets over the home of Syrian Pres. Assad. I had this weird feeling when I heard that little "news" and then as I started reading this thread about a warhead with Chemicals being targeted at Israel, I just had this sick overwhelming feeling inside of "this is it"....this is where its going to begin...

If this is true, this is really, really, really serious and the silence of the media on it is not a mistake....

Gulp....I'm kicking this thread and watching closely.....And how soon before Syria and Iran are involved? :eyes:

they will be involved, whether they were responsible or not, fairly soon.

:shrug:

...more seriously than America. The scary thing about them is that they'll either do nothing or do a lot. Israel isn't about moderate responses.

if they are bluffing, they are idiots

fyi: it's been a blood bath for decades

will seem like a game if this is not a bluff, propaganda et al. Also if they did this, they just crossed a line from victim hood, to something else. Nobody in the
international arena, with a shred of common sense, will tolerate this... why? Flanders Field and Ypres. Yes, both sides have violated the Conventions for a while now, but this will not be fun. As I said, assuming worst case and they are not bluffing.

who are making the claim. I think it is propaganda, but it's from the Palestinian side of the mess. Again, I don't think it's true, just bizarre posturing.

really?

(one of the militant groups, Al Aqsah Brigades to be exact) making it. If they are bluffing, bad bluff, if they are not... they just opened the gates of hell for EVERYBODY in the area

...peace, I thought this would all be settled in peace.

It saddens me to have lived to see this day.

i'm sure israel will open the 'gates of hell', again, no matter what, though

Why is it that a Palestinian group can say something and it is labeled as Israeli propaganda?! Of course, I think I already know your answer considering you followed up with "i'm sure israel will open the 'gates of hell', again, no matter what, though" I guess there is only one side in this conflict. :eyes:

this sounds more like Israeli propaganda to cover up their aggressive collective punishment.

:eyes:

It just never ends!

:eyes:

It just never ends!

look here is a book i highly recommend

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/sitb-next/1400034639/102-2233310-4040906

no it is NOT on the conflict perse

In effect, YOU said this was Israeli propaganda, implying ISRAEL is now controlling terrorists' propaganda.

and i am not implying that israel is controlling palestinian propaganda just israel propaganda.

fyi

got it?!

See his post #42.

Groups like Al-Aksa don't have spokesmen. They don't make claims to the media. EVER. This is all an Israeli lie.

so sue me, i'm a skeptic. especially when it comes to reports of the other side having WMD's.

yes there are many lies, on all sides... but hey if you want to believe it was Shin Beit, my hat is truly off to Shin Beit for pulling this one off

are you slow in readying comprehension?

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsarticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyid=2006-06-29T013909Z_01_L29258645_RTRUKOC_0_US-MIDEAST-ROCKET.xml&src=rss&rpc=22

GAZA (Reuters) - A spokesman for gunmen in the Gaza Strip said they had fired a rocket tipped with a chemical warhead at Israel early on Thursday.

The Israeli army had no immediate comment on the claim by the spokesman from the al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, an armed wing of Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas's Fatah movement.

How is this possibly Israeli propaganda? This is from the SPOKESMAN of the al-Aqsa group! Can you possibly bury your head in the sand any further? It seems that you are being so one-sided in this matter that you will refuse to believe ANYTHING that doesn't match up with what you think it should be.

i am sure the reporter worked with the spokesperson on numerous occasions in the past and has complete confidence in his report :eyes:

after reading so much bs in the press i have learned to be very skeptical of reports coming out of war zones especially when israel is on the war path.

:hi:

Of course - there's no way that a group like al-Aksa Martyr's Brigade would want to further inflame tensions, or bring about a full-scale war with Israel. The video footage I saw of Palestinian militants laying land mines and arming themselves to the teeth was all fake footage. Groups like al-Aksa just want peace, they're just being sorely misunderstood.

by the way the book I just recommended to you was written by a war reporter, Peter Hedges and he makes some important points about war and how it changes people

You are exhibiting one of the signs, aka the Iaraelis are not human... and they lie... after I read that book I got two insignts you may, or may not like

Ultimately BOTH the Israelis and the Palesitinians will HAVE to recognize that THE OTHER is human... and that BOTH have created enormous ammount of damage to each other. Yes BOTH sides have been rather brutal with each other...

The second is that ultimately the conflict will only end when the enablers of BOTH sides, stop enabling them... You are

At this point I am taking the report at face value, for I know what it may uneash. I also know, another point Hedges makes, that the Palestinians, whether they have the WMDS or not, or whether they fired them or not, just crossed a line... from victim hood to soemthing else... and Europe in particular will not bat an eye...

Now the Arab countries may, and taking the report at face value, if it is true and it did NOT hit its target, and the evidence is found... for all the collective sakes of all involved I hope this ends up in a very hot UN Security Council Meeting... for everybody's sakes.

i never said 'the Israelis are not human...' do you often but words in other peoples mouth to make your point?

i think people have the right to self defense especially when confronted by a force far superior than their own.

all this talk of massive and brutal retaliation against the Palestinians from one newspaper report of one supposed chemical weapon is nuts.

by the way, they started making such claims on the 25th, from published reports across the web.

Yuo are tellimg me that this is a Shin Beit Operation?

By the way, everybody lies in war, but if, and this is the big IF the Al Aqsah brigades did this, and this is for real... I personally do hope for a measured response

That said, go and read that book... Peter Hedges takes no sides... and his insights might be good for you

Stop enabling them... for in the end the end of the conflict is NOT in your hands, or mine... but both parties, funny, ain't it?

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

to accept the obvious is quite interesting.

after all we've been through in the past 6 years you'd think the M$M would have 0 credibility especially in matters of war and WMDs.

:shrug:

What report are you talking about? This is a Reuters report, and it's the SPOKESMAN for the group that made the claim! It's not the IDF who is claiming that Palestinians fired a chemical warhead, it's the group itself!

and this would be great cover for israel's collective punishment.

what, you think thats outside the realm of possibility?

especially Nukes will trigger a massive response, called the Samsom Option.

For you this may be a game, for the IDF general staff this is not a game... they have wargamed this many a times...

Now do give me a shred of evidence that this is Shin Beit counter intelligence operation... to use a technical term.

Gee, who else do we know who has been using that tactic lately? :patriot:

what do I get?

whoever doesn't recognize the lies that spew daily from the M$M to prop up the status quo, especially in matters of war are blind or working for the man, imho.

However, irrational skepticism isn't good. Do I believe that this group actually fired a chemical warhead? Hard to say. Do I believe their claim to have over a dozen chemical and biological weapons? Again, hard to say. It's not unusual for a group to make inflated claims in an attempt to intimidate another group, or make themselves look more powerful to their constituents. Maybe they are bluffing, hoping the Israelis will back off their attacks at the risk of having a biological weapon unleashed in Tel Aviv. However, it's quite a dangerous bluffing game they're doing, IMHO - if indeed it is a bluff.

and a very dangerous one

So nothing's wrong with the media now? All because of Bush' attack of the NYT?

The gist of that article:

"An Israeli military spokeswoman said the army had not detected that any such rocket was fired, nor was there any report of such a weapon hitting Israel."

Nuff said.

A spokesman for Al-Aqsa made the claim to the media. Not just today, but claimed they had these weapons a couple of days ago and made the threat to use them if Israeli forces entered the Gaza Strip Now I suppose one could climb into a clumsy conspiracy theory and make a wild claim that Israel somehow coerced AQ or infilitrated it or whatever, but don't you think that would be just a bit silly?

NEWS ITEM that coudl make the ME explode into WW III is just juvenile and stupid.. just my opinion, ok... but this is more than just the dungeon

Why THIS thread, I post alot, I see NO good reason for this

I, am a little pissed

DMAN IT, this is a real news item, have you seen if this has been posted in the LBN? And what is more... did you notice they removed one with an explanatiion of arty shells?

I think this is about to blow sky high... and on a related note, if what you just posted is true... the IDF will employ Operation Samsom or a modified version of it.

Damn quite bad timing for my brother to have gone over there.

That is another matter

And you should too.

That's what I did.

before it's too late!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

but while the M.E crisis continues at GAZA, I'd love it if the automatic removal of threads to the Dungeon (Israeli \ Palestinian board) be suspended. I mean what is going on right now belongs in all forii, well maybe not gaming, unless we are discussing Future Nexus (grin), but you get my point I think. The actions and counter reactions are very serious and will affect all, quite possibly, even US Troops in the area.

skinner@democraticunderground.com

http://www.democraticunderground.com/contact.html

I was just trying to figure out why all the LBN threads on this very important story were being funneled to this forum. Totally baffling--this is a HUGE story, is it not??

and speaking of effects... the bombing of the Fatah office might very well be tied to this... oh and that actually is a measured response.

and propaganda to me

Hello, WWIII. If this is even CLOSE to true,
the proverbial shit has hit the fan. Israel
WILL NOT tolerate chem or bio weapons possessed
by militant terrorists. Whether bluff or true, these
idiots have sealed the fate of all Palestinians.

May God have mercy on their souls.

I am fairly sure that they can wipe out the Palestinians in Gaza in a matter of a couple weeks time. And that is without resorting to their nuclear weapons.

they will be meassured (yes there will be a refugee crisis to quite possibly rival 1967)... but that they will keep this to oh... the militants... who ARE combatants, lawful or not... but if the brigades deployed WMDs nobody will bat an eye if the IDF goes overboard here... well maybe the Arab countries... and if we are lucky it will remain at this point, and not expand to a regional war....

the big bad IDF is gonna show everyone they ain't afraid of no primitive Palestinians, again!

got it now? Good

Is war different in one part of the world than another?
War is war, people are people.
Are we taking sides?
Why can we talk about war in one part of the world and not another on any particular forum?

fyi

shadows of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion

wonder why?

instead of putting words in my mouth.

thank you

FYI

You are implying that somehow they control the media... they have a GOOD, in fact extremely solid PR operation, but it is far from controlling the media

i said they don't like it. they apply pressure, most times it works, sometimes it doesn't.

or the implicatiions will bee clear, and if you did not mean it, my apologies. Boards are interesting beasts in that respect

for clarification if you are not sure.

i accept your apology, thank you :toast:

at a board dealing with a board game... and partly it was my fault... use full English sentences, it will save you agravation

:hi:

I can't.

If it is true that this group fired a chemical warhead at Israel, it won't just stop there. I seriously doubt this group manufactured WMDs all by themselves. That sort of stuff usually takes quite a bit of money, scientific skill, etc. The focus will be on *where* did they obtain these weapons from? Syria and Iran would be the logical candidates, but there's any number of sources in the Middle East where it could have come from. I'm pretty sure that there are quite a few Middle Eastern countries with WMD capabilities (which raises the question even *if* Iraq had them, why did we single them out, but nobody else - but that's another topic).

the Israelis overflew Assad's summer palace but 24 hours ago... not that I think Sadamn's toys were in Syria...

FYI some WMDs such as mustard gas are relatively easy to make by soembody with a good understanding of chemistry... also the chemical signatures don't remain that long. I used to be a HAZMAT tech... in another life...

That feels a bit stifling.

aka: BS

and the spokesperson is truly an Israeli Spy?

By the way, they do have PR people... that was one of the things that both the Irgun ben Leumi and Fatah learned early, controlling your image.

could be... think about the past 6 years

that popped out today... do a google search.

Oh never mind...

And yes I am thinking of the last six years... and also have written IF the story is true.

But as I said, even if the rep came to your house and told you, WE FIRED IT, you would still doubt it...

:hi:

You have not provided one shred of evidence or info to back up your claim that somehow Israel manufactured the Al-Aksa claim. All you have is your irrational hatred of Israel, so much so that you would almost have us believe that they actually infiltrated a Palestinian organization for the sole purpose of having a phony spokesperson make such a claim.

par for the course on these matters and some wonder why this kind of post gets sent to the basement :shakeshead:

I don't know about other threads, but I haven't seen any name calling on this thread. I've seen an overwhelming reaction to your hypothesis that this is somehow an Israeli propaganda move, which not very many people are buying. But I haven't really seen any personal attacks against you perse.

Protocols of the Elders of Zion, and somehow control of our media since the Israelis do not like open criticism of Israel... they don't they have a wonderful PR operation, but to imply control of the media is going a tad far... now do the media don't openly critize Israel? Absolutely, partly due to the PR abilities they have, but partly bcuase our Government does not do it, and whatever the governmetn does, especially the last five years, our Media promply salutes and goes along.

shin Bet, we just read what you wrote...

By the way, nations (and peoples) have a right to self defense, but due to a minor thing called WW I, the use of WMDs is collectively frowned upon... for all the sakes of all involved I do hope it is bluster, the IDF does not find a thing, and they choose to go for a measured response, and yes I know what I am talking about, and how far worst this could go, if they find even a shred of evidence. You think collective punishment is bad right now, just wait... and the worst part is... most nations will turn a blind eye because today it is Israel, the southern border, tomorrow it will be London. Mark my words, this is the way most will react. Ypres and Flanders Field are what is driving this irrational fear... for if they had no help in producing them, then they would be easy to deal with (the militants that is). If they had help from ANY arab nation, or Al Qa ida (doubtful) a regional war is in the offing.

Oh and asymetrical warfare, the day it includes WMDs we have crossed another dangerous threshhold.

in a war zone and WMDs, especially initial reports.

why can't i express an opposing opinion without being jumped on like i am crazy?

Al Aqsah made their first claims that they had this shit on the 25th, today it is the 28th, and ONLY NOW is Reuters picking it up... so hardly an initial report.

especially by the largely unarmed - in comparison to the IDF - palestinians.

and if this is old news why is everyone freaking out then?

if they had those weapons and could do any harm they would have used them long ago, just like saddam.

i find most of the 'news' coming out against the palestinians to be mostly inflated hyperbole and propaganda so please forgive me for being skeptical.

"largely unarmed"?

So when Israel launches a military offensive against Palestinians, it's newsworthy, and a horrible offense. But when Palestinians launch an offensive against Israel, carry out suicide bombings, etc - that is "mostly inflated hypberbole and propaganda"?

Can you be any more one-sided? We've acknowledged that BOTH sides are particularly brutal against each other.

and forced to live in ghettos.

please don't use the M$M tactic of being fair-n-balanced to stifle debate and opinions from being expressed.

by the way the danger is that they claimed in the last few hours that they fired a missile. Granted I will not take World Net Daily at face value, but the Reuters wire has a little more credible, actually a lot more.

Personally this is a game of chicken... and if they used one and it MISSED its target, a chem team is looking for it right now. Pray, if you are into that of course, that they don't find it, and they conclude that this is a very dangerous game of chicken. For if they find it, it is time to freak out, for a regional war is NOT out of the equation. You may also want to read the following article on this from the Cleveland Plain Dealer for it reveals just how serious this is... for regional parties are now involved (Egypt)

http://www.cleveland.com/politics/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/opinion/1151483743148220.xml&coll=2

Do a damn google search, by the way... what you should ask is why is Al Aqsah making these claims?

This is a June 27th article

http://www.nysun.com/article/35148

and I do hope the scientists are right and whoever is making them claims is full of it.

of one people oppressing another people for their own gain in the guise of peace, prosperity and security, imo.

due to a stupid game of chicken.

By the way, Einstein said it best, I have no idea how WW III will be fought but WW IV will be fought with stones and sticks

:eyes:

if you do, recommend you read about the Cuban Missile Crisis... another stupid game of chicken, except that one included bonna fide WMDs

and that has what to do with the price of tea in china or a brutal, decades old occupation and the current aggression against these oppressed people :shrug:

by the way... the palestinians have been quite brutal as well...but hey if taking sides in this soccer match suits your taste fine.

But you need to stop posting and let other people discuss.

You have totally hijacked this discussion with your endlessly repeated doubts about the accuracy of this story, and we heard you the first time. I, for one, am going to ignore you henceforth, but I simply have to say that you are acting in a way that I interpret as extremely selfish.

i am not preventing anyone from posting their opinions, but you would like to just that and have the nerve to call me 'selfish' :eyes:

cya

We keep going round and round over the same thing, and not getting anywhere. You keep repeating your belief that this is Israeli propaganda, with nothing to back up such a claim other than "M$M lies all the time". We respond by pointing out that it was a Al-Aksa spokesperson who made the claim, and you come back with the "Israeli propaganda" argument again.

a discussion doesn't mean everyone must agree.

read on the rules of debate

If the al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades are bluffing, is that any different from them telling the truth about this in terms of the probably IDF reaction?

Personally I don't think so. Israeli citizens react very strongly to the idea of being gassed (and who could blame them).

I think this was the most stupid thing the al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades could do, unless they are determined to be Martyrs themselves.

this reminds me of the BS excuse we tried to use in attacking iraq.

i think this and other BS reports will be used as an excuse for all israel's aggression.

and so it goes...

You were the one complaining about everyone trying to shut you down, and belittling your arguments. Yet whenever you get the chance, you dismiss the entire report as "BS". Can you see how it's impossible to have a rational discussion when the ONLY thing you bring to the table is the exact same thing you've said repeatedly?

ignore

...since Hitler's decision to invade Russia. As I've postulated, they probably thought that Israel would back down in the face of such a threat. Now that Israel has invaded the Gaza Strip, they've essentially called the bluff. So it's put-up-or-shut-up time for al-Aksa. If they have the weapons, they pretty much have to use them, or risk undermining themselves. In the world of Palestinian militants, and the ongoing power struggles, that's something they can't afford. If they don't have them, then they have to claim to have used them.

Either way, it's a very bone-headed move for them to make.

"As I've postulated..." the arm chair generals around here kill me :rofl:

ever been under fire?

Earlier, you complained about people calling you names. Now you're calling ME names because I know how to use vocabulary?

but... if this is a game of chicken, the IDF has war gamed these scenarios for years... for once I expect a measured response from them, as measured as it can be...

My gut tells me the brigades came out with this one... they also tell me this might be the biggest game of chicken we have ever seen, with the highest stakes since oh the Cuban Missile Crisis

Although, with the murder of the Israeli young man, after that group claimed he was alive, there may be heightened tension at whether to take them at their word or not.

What will happen is a major suicide attack within Tel-Aviv, Hafia, and/or Netyana; then, we will see an 'impressive' Israeli reaction.

:eyes:

welcome to my ignore list

guess i've struck a nerve in criticizing israel, oh well... i'm sure you'll get over it ;->

cya

I can actually hear the debate.

it is amusing watching the arm chair warriors postulate though :rofl:

I think you just showed your true maturity level with your earlier comment.

I got no further use for this witness, Your Honor.

George will be so happy. It's all the Democrats fault you know.

Want to be the RW blowers will be on that point tomorrow AM?

:shake:

They will say it just leaked out or something before it reached it's target. Keep in mind your pandering to folks who aren't real critical thinkers or anything. I mean after all today their based is all riled up about the treason of the NYT for publishing information that is widely available from many different sources.

the neoCONs and their ilk will do anything to justify their aggression, especially tell big LIES.

after all, the IAF buzzed assad's palace yesterday...

we know that the Syrians are backing at least one of the factions... no, not Al Aqsah,

We also know this story started to develop on the 25th

The OFFICIAL reason why the IAF buzzed Assad's palace was to overtly put pressure since it was NOT Al Aqsah who claimed to have taken hostages, prisoners, what have you but rather Hammas... this is truly a what if the Mosad believes the old story of WMDs trounced out by the Right Wing? Oh never mind about reality... but if they do, they just sent a message to Assad covering multiple things.

reaching for that history book... WW I started over a Duke at Sarajevo... how many mutual defense pacts will be triggered by this if this should go regional? What is more? how bad will it get?

And that is my question as on the surface this doesn't look good. Could this be the beginning of the U.S. using Israel to begin a wider conflict in the M.E. After all the election is coming up and in today's America war sells the best.

in the diplomatic effort... to be honest I am sure even Mubarak is not happy. If there is a regional war and he does not play... his term in office will be fairly short, if he does... wost case Samsom option will be in place... hey on the bright side all them right wingers will get to see nuclear winter in the flesh...

:sarcasm:

Moreover, Mubark doesn't want a "Palestinian problem" of his own (thus the closing of Rafah and the massive Egyptian buildup on the Gaza border). I don't see Egypt getting involved militarily, unless there is something major.

as Al Aksah has claimed, we will see how good of a control Mubarak has over the army. He does not want one of these falling into the hands of the Muslim Brotherhood in Cairo either.

They are getting more powerful in Egypt. I am sure he is VERY nervous right now.

when the Egyptian army goes crazy in Gaza looking for this crap... hell if they find it is for real, it wuold not shock me to see a binational team going after them.

...I think, if true, that Egypt will be the one to initiate an international intervention, including military. Mubark is not as strong as he once was....the opposition must be licking their chops.

of the accounting here, and if they do... that might finally force blue helmets in a DMZ... ironically in the long run they may have done a favor to everybody.

They'd be creaming their pants if they saw blue helmets patrolling the Gaza Strip. That's one of their "signs" that the End Times is about to happen.

What if some super-fanatical fundie group supplied some low-level chemical weapon agents to the Palestinians, in order to foster an all-out war? You've got all these fanatical groups out there - Christian, Jewish, and Muslim - who feel the end times are due anytime now. Extremist Christian and Jewish groups would love nothing more than to tear down the Dome of the Rock, and rebuild Solomon's Temple on the same spot. In order for that to happen, you'd probably need an all-out war. Then some anti-christ comes along and brings peace to the region.

Not saying I think this is what happened, but it's no secret that many groups would love to see an all-out war break out.

has anybody found the Cyanide that went missing close to three years ago in Mexico?

I know one boy scout in texas was arrested building a cyanide bomb... but hey that is an unexpected and sadly likely if distant option, mostly due to the logistics of moving this crap across international borders... then again if you know a good gun runner....

I think they would just be sitting ducks.

also in the DMZ between Syria and Israel... that said... many of the militant groups ON BOTH SIDES will have an obvious problem with this... so those troops will NOT have an easy time, not until one of the two sides looses its will to fight... which by definition is the end of any war.

Because we all know that NO other country in the Middle East has been producing biological and chemical weapons over the past few decades. While Georgie boy preoccupied himself with a country that we've had sanctions on and UN inspectors inside for 12 years, all these other countries have been hard at work.

Heck, who's to say that if they DO have some WMDs, that they didn't steal them from Israel itself?

though Isreal officially does not have chemical or bio agents, that said, who has the means and the motives to develop this shit?

They have always hated Israel and have played different ME leaders off one another. It wouldn't surprise me if that is where the chemicals came from, if the claim is true.

Russia, well yes...

N.Korea, to take the US eyes off this ball

Iran... though it would be suicidal at this stage, so they are a very distant candidate, like VERY distant.

and yes this one will be strange.... to some, China... a regional ME war will allow it to keep US very distracted while they retake taiwan... and the Isrelis have sold them technology, but they are truly not allies.

By the by, I have discounted other obvious targets from the POV of the right wing cought Syria cough

Now if you want to go for a strange candidate... a faction in Lebanon.

My money is on Russia. North Korea is an isolationist country and could care less about the outside world. Iran. I just don't think they have anything like that...guns and weapons...sure, but chemical weapons like that, I am sure they are keeping for themselves. I really doubt China because they are kind of sitting high on the hog right now because everyone is so distracted, plus they really don't care. I also doubt Syria is involved...kidnappings and low-level warfare, yes. I feel the same with Lebanon. This has the making of a big power like Russia.

Even with the old KGB head honcho in charge, I just can't see Russia supplying terrorist groups with chemical and biological weapons. AK-47s maybe, but not WMDs. The repurcussions would be just too severe. Eventually the source would become known. I doubt that Israel would take military action against Russia, but there could be severe economic actions taken against Russia, and Russia desperately needs economic aid, not economic sanctions.

Now is it possible that some former ex-Soviet scientists were bought off? That's been one of the biggest fears since the downfall of the Soviet Union. You don't actually have to smuggle nukes or other WMDs out of Russia. Just hire some of their out-of-work scientists to teach you how to build them yourself.

Now if we play a game of what iff and Russia is behind this (and this does not explode into WW III)... sanctiions are in order, if it does not and evidence comes out... it will get uggly

Now as I said well above, the claim is chemical, the big secret is that Ricin and Mustard Gas are quite easy to produce... now weaponizing Ricin is a problem... but Mustard is not, and very low grade is at times a fear in certain HAZMAT situations

So I will take them at their claim that they were LOCALLY produced.

...see, I don't think these are WMD's like we think of them. These are probably very low-level, although still deadly. It wouldn't be the first time that Russia has supplied weapons against Israel. I don't think they would give them the big stuff because they KNOW Israel would respond. As for low-level, well, it will be a guessing game.

http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a/hamas-leaders-arrested-israeli-executed/20060627171109990004?cid=2194

The militant Al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades said it fired a rocket with a chemical warhead at the Israeli town of Sderot Wednesday night, the first such claim. The Israeli military said it did not detect a rocket fired then. Al Aqsa is linked to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas' Fatah faction.

will look at. And it can't be voted to the Greatest Page.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=124x129576#129587
We gotta get this news out there, the MSM certainly isn't.

The Dungeon has it's moments, and this the biggie.

the Palestinians are well and truly fucked. They will be wiped off the map, and the rest of the ME will be on Israel like stink on shit.

And of course, the US will get in on the defense of Israel.

I always thought it would start with Iran messing with Israel, guess that would be too obvious.

the death warrant for their people. The rest of the ME will be microwaved
by Israeli nukes. Hence, WWIII, or, to the Bushies, Armageddon-call it what
you want, it's still hell.

BTW, Israel could wipe out Iranian nuke ambitions with the press of a button.
Ain't geopolitics fun?? NOT!!!!

but in the article posted,isn't Israel saying there was no evidence that anything occurred?

If you think our gov't is secretive, you ain't see nothing.

Not trying to do the "conspiracy theory" thing, but Mosad(sp)
keeps their hand close to their chest.

We'll see. And pray.

So your right about your thoughts that it would start with Iran messing with Israel....It is obvious then after all if this happens....

All it took was one asshole to shoot an archduke to start WW One...

And I have credentials that will put my ass back in that mix, despite my retired status and the fact that I am a geezer.

I remain concerned.

I do hope this is truly a game of chicken... for all our collective sakes... a bad game of chicken,

This hilarious comedian gives a quite different reason as why WW1 started.

I strongly recommend to use some time and watch this :

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7374585792978336967&q=history+of+oil

He does a great job explaining some extremely serious matters while simultaneously injecting some humor. He has a gift that I wish more had.

relevant threads until the crisis resolves itself one way or the other

Best case scenario, this is a HUGE game of chicken, the IDF will find NOTHING to confirm it and life will go on... sadly as it does with that cycle of violence

Worst case, they find it... you can bet your sweet assess that a regional war is in the cards... now if they used WMDs... Al Aqsah just crossed an invisible line in the sand... so on THAT account we might avoid WW III... but it won't be pretty kids.

links, for everbody's enjoyment.

Aparently this story has been developing since at least the 25th

by the way the danger is that they claimed in the last few hours that they fired a missile. Granted I will not take World Net Daily at face value, but the Reuters wire has a little more credible, actually a lot more.

Personally this is a game of chicken... and if they used one and it MISSED its target, a chem team is looking for it right now. Pray, if you are into that of course, that they don't find it, and they conclude that this is a very dangerous game of chicken. For if they find it, it is time to freak out, for a regional war is NOT out of the equation. You may also want to read the following article on this from the Cleveland Plain Dealer for it reveals just how serious this is... for regional parties are now involved (Egypt)

http://www.cleveland.com/politics/plaindealer/index.ssf...

Do a damn google search, by the way... what you should ask is why is Al Aqsah making these claims?

This is a June 27th article

http://www.nysun.com/article/35148

and I do hope the scientists are right and whoever is making them claims is full of it.

Your link to the Cleveland Plain Dealer is to an index page, not an article.

"Proliferation of peril
Wednesday, June 28, 2006"

I usually avoid the dungeons, but this one is THAT IMPORTANT... there is more on google if you choose to go for it by the way

It is sad.

sigh.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2006/06/27/international/i071655D41.DTL

The Palestinians captured an Israeli soldier. Israeli rightists are going ballistic. They are afraid he will be tortured.

but the problem is that this they used WMDs claim by al Aqsah hit the wires (via reuters) oh five hours ago now. The story started to develop oh two days ago and we have heard nothing about it...

Now this is the big IF...this is true.... all bets are off

As to torture, yes it is a fact of war. I feel sorry for the victim, whether they wear a uniform or not... for it is not pleasant... and I don't apreciate anybody doing it... but giving the history of the area this is actually a valid concern. Now to them going nuts, not mroe than our RW... the difference is... for teh most part all of them have served in the armed forces, so at least they are not chickenhawks. Little comfort I know, but crazy fundies are bad, regardless of where you find them

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They know he might be treated in the same way they treat their prisoners.

50+% of Israelis disapprove of the treatment of Palestinians. For good reason.

http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a/hamas-leaders-arrested-israeli-executed/20060627171109990004?cid=2194

The militant Al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades said it fired a rocket with a chemical warhead at the Israeli town of Sderot Wednesday night, the first such claim. The Israeli military said it did not detect a rocket fired then. Al Aqsa is linked to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas' Fatah faction.

Let's hope this isn't true, or the may be the beginning of the end.

or as I keep saying a damn bad game of chicken...

That made me giggle! I needed a good giggle tonight...thanks! :hi:

http://www.warwicksiege.com/siege_machines.asp


Pleeeze! This nothing new.


Romani Etae Domum....

nice distraction from the collective punishment israel is brutally pursuing in defiance of international laws.

:puke: