16 year old boy murdered by Israeli soldiers at Huwarra checkpoint

Both sides are lying. Both the PA and Israel have some very angry, very amoral soldiers in their ranks. Both sides will say or do anything.

Who's lying, the criminal army or the taxi drivers? One never really does know for sure. I normally lean towards trusting the every day common person over militants and armies, but that's just me.

Don't you find it odd that, according to this ISM report, Nablus residents claim that the idea of a 16 year-old boy having explosives is "ludicrous"?

Just four years ago, there was an attempted suicide attack by a 15 year-old boy that was thwarted at this very checkpoint.

The young man was interviewed by the BBC.

Here is an excerpt:

JR: When you went out with your bomb belt what was your target?

Hussam: They told me to go to a checkpoint. They told me you blow yourself up at the checkpoint.

They showed me a videotape of it.

JR: When you put on that belt did you really know - as a 15-year-old - that you were going to go and murder people, that you were going to go and cause great suffering to mothers and fathers, that you were going to be a mass murderer? Did you really know that?

Hussam: Yes. Just like they came and caused our parents sadness and suffering they too should feel this. Just like we feel this - they should also feel it.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3899015.stm

Not the boy's death which was tragic . . no matter the circumstances.

The concocted story published at the ISM website is where the laughs can be found. The first part of the story recounts how " . . Fihme kept his hands in the air while soldiers aimed at him, and then fired approximately 5-7 bullets, one by one, hitting Fihme in the neck, face, back, chest and abdomen. “He died with his hands in the air.”

Then a couple of paragraphs later we find, " . . that at the same moment an ambulance arrived at the checkpoint, but that paramedics were also prevented from attending to the boy and potentially saving his life. Another driver on the scene, Samer Abu Mustafa, corroborates this statement, claiming that the soldiers wouldn’t allow ambulance workers to take the body and save the boy."

Oh, those cruel Israel soldiers. Wouldn't even allow paramedics to save the poor boy - who was already dead according to their own story of 5-7 bullets hitting him in the " neck, face, back, chest and abdomen". I'd be ashamed to post crap like that.

Female corporal prevents suicide attack at checkpoint

Corporal Michal Ya'akov of the Israel Military Police's Teuz Battalion was responsible for preventing a suicide attack at the Hawara checkpoint in Nablus Monday evening.

"The entire incident lasted maybe 30 seconds," Ya'akov related. "I was about two feet away from him and asked him to go through the metal detector.

"It beeped, and I asked him to raise his hands, and then I saw the explosive devices under his shirt, near his pants. I yelled 'bomb at the checkpoint,' and the entire force went into action, perfectly. We called him to lie down so the shockwaves from the explosion would be closer to the ground, but he refused.

"Then I saw him lower his arms suddenly and the checkpoint commander shot him several times. I assume he was trying to activate the bombs in order to blow himself up," she said.


http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/985054.html

A 20-year-old Palestinian carrying four pipe bombs was shot dead Monday evening at an IDF checkpoint located south of Nablus in the West Bank.

At around 7 pm soldiers manning the Hawara checkpoint spotted the Palestinian as he was making his way toward them in a suspicious manner with wires protruding from underneath his clothes.

Corporal Michal Ya'akov of the military police recounted the incident: "A young Palestinian who seemed confused arrived at the checkpoint. When he reached the turnstile I stopped him and asked that he pass through the metal detector. The apparatus beeped when he went through. I asked him what it was that he had on his body."

According to Ya'akov, the Palestinian responded by saying 'nothing' in Arabic while lifting his shirt and exposing the pipe bombs, which were strapped to the right part of his body.

"I identified the explosive devices and yelled 'explosives in the checkpoint' and cocked my rifle. Everyone (soldiers) aimed at Palestinian's head and neck so as not to set off the explosive device," she said.

Ya'akov said she then ordered him to lift his shirt up. "The Palestinian raised his arms up for two seconds, then pulled them down and reached for the explosive device," she said. At this point the checkpoint commander shot the man dead.

An IDF source told Ynet that "we definitely thwarted a terror attack. The Palestinian constantly 'played' with the explosive devices in order to activate them and harm the soldiers at the site."

Sappers who were dispatched to the scene removed the explosive devices from the Palestinian's body.
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3545368,00.html

An IDF source told Ynet that "we definitely thwarted a terror attack. The Palestinian constantly 'played' with the explosive devices in order to activate them and harm the soldiers at the site."

Attacks on military targets aren't terror attacks. Plus the IDF have been known to be lax with the truth in the past when it comes to civilian deaths. ...

which saves the lives of dozens or more dead innocents, killed by this "martyr".

Very good move on the part of hte IDF.

...checkpoint earlier this year:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=jjILGMWUp3A

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:crazy:

a murder. Why "these people" insist on ever newer Al-Dura fantasies is beyond me.

If they had their way, they would kill as many people as possible, whether that was a dozen, a hundred, a thousand, or many thousands.

There is no love of life.

Suicide bombers and their supporters celebrate death.

They are held up as heros and their parents are paid handsome sums for their "martyrdom".

Killing off a suicide bomber saves the lives of potentially dozens, hundreds, or thousands of innocent people.

of Hamas who seem to think the lives of Palestinian children are only worth a dime a dozen.
Evil bastards that they are.
Does the end justify the means?

And do you also think the IDF are evil bastards coz they've used Palestinian children as human shields in the past?

anyone who places a child in harm's way is an evil bastard period.

Nablus – Ma'an – The Palestinian teenager shot dead on Monday at Huwwara checkpoint south of Nablus in the northern West Bank was carrying explosives to attack Israeli soldiers at the checkpoint, a little known group calling themselves the "Struggle and Return Brigades" announced on Tuesday afternoon.

The group, who are affiliated to Fatah's Al-Aqsa Brigades, said in a statement that 16-year-old Fahmi Ad-Dardouk was in possession of three explosive devices.

http://maannews.net/en/index.php?opr=ShowDetails&Do=Print&ID=29395

Also, I noticed that there is no byline for that report. Who wrote it? How did they happen to be at the checkpoint at that time?

Methinks someone's been watching too many Hollywood flicks. Shooting a suicide bomber does not necessarily set off whatever explosives he's carrying. For example



Then she apparently isn't very observant:

Incident 1
Incident 2
Incident 3
The article doesn't say so explicitly, but this happened at the same checkpoint
So did this.

seeing as how you felt the need to post this on 2 different threads both containing the same article
Or perhaps it is Jews acting as watchers over the IDF you have a problem with, sort of "biting the hand"?


"I doubt very much that he had a bomb on him," Yehudit Bloch, 63, an Israeli woman from Tel Aviv and member of Machsom Watch, told The Middle East Times. "I have been coming to Huwara once a week for years and the Palestinians have never tried to smuggle a bomb through this checkpoint.

"They have taken bombs through other ways where it is less easy for them to be spotted," she explained. Eyewitnesses said that Fahmi had already passed through the metal detector machine without incident.

"This is why I am here," explained Bloch, a mother of four children, and "so that we can never say we never knew what is happening in our name."

You post several incidents going back years, and of course the one in Dimona, was that for drama or could you not find any others that fit?

It was another take on the incident and yes I know on this thread any suggestion that the IDF soldier had "over reacted" was soundly quashed with the usual insults, how dare anyone suggest other wise, except that in none of your other examples did a soldier simply see a cell phone and open fire

According to the officer:

"The entire incident lasted maybe 30 seconds," Ya'akov related. "I was about two feet away from him and asked him to go through the metal detector.

"It beeped, and I asked him to raise his hands, and then I saw the explosive devices under his shirt, near his pants. I yelled 'bomb at the checkpoint,' and the entire force went into action, perfectly. We called him to lie down so the shockwaves from the explosion would be closer to the ground, but he refused.

"Then I saw him lower his arms suddenly and the checkpoint commander shot him several times. I assume he was trying to activate the bombs in order to blow himself up," she said.

Also:

An IDF investigation revealed that the man had been carrying three pipe bombs. The IDF spokeswoman said army sappers later detonated the pipe bombs at the scene in a controlled explosion.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/985054.html

And this from the Palestinian Ma'an News agency:

Nablus – Ma'an – The Palestinian teenager shot dead on Monday at Huwwara checkpoint south of Nablus in the northern West Bank was carrying explosives to attack Israeli soldiers at the checkpoint, a little known group calling themselves the "Struggle and Return Brigades" announced on Tuesday afternoon.

http://maannews.net/en/index.php?opr=ShowDetails&Do=Print&ID=29395

and I'm the one with a problem?

Since apparently you either don't read or don't comprehend what you post*, let me break it down for you:



The witness you cite explicitly stated that the Palestinians have never tried to smuggle a bomb through the Hawara checkpoint - and instead, use alternate routes. I supplied you with several examples of incidents where the Palestinians did try to smuggle explosives or suicide bombers through that checkpoint

As for the Dimona incident - did you bother looking in response to what I was posting it? It was a counterexample to Bloch's claim that the Palestinian in question could not have been carrying a bomb because it would have detonated when shot - the Dimona incient is an example here a suicide bomber wearing an explosive vest did not explode when shot.

Given that Bloch did not witness the incident in question, her only value to the issue is as an "expert witness" to support the claim that it wasn't an attempted suicide attack. Yet as I've just shown, her claims are simply incorrect and therefore her claim that it could not have been an attack - a claim which you brought in to the discussion - is worthless.

*Frankly you don't usually strike me as this obtuse, so are you having a bad day or just a problem admitting you're wrong?

You either missed or choose to ignore this part

"They have taken bombs through other ways where it is less easy for them to be spotted," she explained. Eyewitnesses said that Fahmi had already passed through the metal detector machine without incident.

she says it has happened

you do not like the message so you attack me instead? I posted an eye witness account I did not say whether it was factual or not, I said it was a different take, you pursue me on not one but two threads making accusations that unless you were there and also an eyewitness have no real bearing on this account, except in that it has happened in the past and happened in other locations, so is this yet another if one did they all do statement or what. You say admit I was wrong, what was wrong posting something different from the consensus on thread from a source you seem to disagree with?
I am sorry you can not agree to disagree or are so outraged at another account of what happened.
that you feel you must personally attack me. Are you saying it should not have been posted at all? What then about the thread I took it from does your rule go there too?
According to the account by a women who was there as a witness the soldier saw two cell phones on the kid and opened fire.
I simply posted that account and oh yeah I said a cell phone my error before you seize on that having little else it was two cell phones

If you have such a problem I suggest you take it up with Machsom Watch, be sure to keep us posted.

No one's disputing that - but how is what happens at other checkpoints relevant? The operative point is that she says it's unlikely there was an attack because they never brought them through Huwara - which, as I've shown, is incorrect.

For that matter, given the way the article is structured I'm not certain Bloch is an eyewitness, but just someone they brought to support their case by describing what happens at Hawara.

As for the cell phones - I notice the article you posted does not say who told them he was carrying two cellphones - it's just stated as a fact without attribution. You'll notice Bloch is only introduced several paragraphs after that assertion and it is not attributed to her. And oberliner has given you Palestinian accounts according to which te youth was armed.

I really do not like having to be a snot twice

So what if they sometimes brought explosives through other checkpoints?

That is quite plainly not what the women said

"They have taken bombs through other ways where it is less easy for them to be spotted," she explained. Eyewitnesses said that Fahmi had already passed through the metal detector machine without incident".

As to the cell phones

Last week a female soldier shot dead a 15-year-old boy, Fahmi Abdel Jawaad al-Darduk, whom she suspected of concealing a bomb after she spotted a wire from a headphone hanging out from under his shirt. When asked to lift his shirt she spotted two mobile phones clipped to his belt and proceeded to open fire.

Now as to whether the women was there the article seems to say she but does not say so explicitly enough, so I will let you go on that one.