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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 03:25 PM Original message |
WTC Antenna Dropped First , Indicating a Core Failure. |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 03:35 PM Response to Original message |
1. I read it twice and it says |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 04:54 PM Response to Reply #1 |
5. That's just my point. If the antenna dropped as the first visible |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 06:41 PM Response to Reply #5 |
9. So in this picture of the hat truss/core |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 08:32 PM Response to Reply #9 |
10. The truss stops where the diagonals stop. |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 08:40 PM Response to Reply #10 |
11. Thanks for the picture |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 10:06 PM Response to Reply #11 |
13. My point exactly. Please explain how fires ten stories under |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:54 AM Response to Reply #13 |
16. Punch through the hat truss? Where did you get that idea? |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:12 AM Response to Reply #16 |
18. I'm claiming it. The hat truss was built to redistribute the asymmetrical |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:32 AM Response to Reply #18 |
21. Your depiction of NIST explanation is not accurate. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:05 PM Response to Reply #21 |
40. Your quote saying the core could not support the gravity loads |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:39 PM Response to Reply #40 |
45. Oh, brother. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:16 PM Response to Reply #45 |
50. The tops of the windows were level with the ceilings, and |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:20 PM Response to Reply #50 |
52. Steady state flow of hot air... |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:00 PM Response to Reply #52 |
57. "perfectly refracted " |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 03:22 PM Response to Reply #57 |
61. Dude. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 03:47 PM Response to Reply #61 |
63. Sheets of hot air. |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 04:01 PM Response to Reply #63 |
65. I'm not talking to you about this anymore. n/t |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 05:13 PM Response to Reply #65 |
67. Here's another picture of sheets of hot air. |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:08 PM Response to Reply #13 |
41. Because the hat truss and the core |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:24 PM Response to Reply #41 |
43. The antenna dropped before the perimeter walls did. nt |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 05:17 PM Response to Reply #43 |
68. And you find this odd because ?????? (n/t) |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 05:57 PM Response to Reply #68 |
69. I find the failure of the hat truss odd because it should have |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 07:55 PM Response to Reply #69 |
70. And your qualifications to determine that |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 01:07 PM Response to Reply #70 |
72. The qualifications of an anonymous internet poster are not |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 01:31 PM Response to Reply #72 |
73. I look forward to your presentation of an argument. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 01:53 PM Response to Reply #73 |
74. Any truss functions as a bridge, and the assertion that core |
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LARED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 02:23 PM Response to Reply #74 |
75. Some advice |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 03:04 PM Response to Reply #75 |
76. I am perfectly capable of understanding the purposes and |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 03:11 PM Response to Reply #76 |
77. The south tower was designed to have an antenna. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-04-06 11:41 PM Response to Reply #77 |
83. the "downward" motion you think you're seeing is a "southward" tilt |
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dailykoff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 04:06 PM Response to Reply #75 |
79. Right. Find one dopey paragraph |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-05-06 12:46 PM Response to Reply #75 |
86. Some advice |
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dailykoff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 04:02 PM Response to Reply #70 |
78. goat your patience is an inspiration. |
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SidDithers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 03:57 PM Response to Original message |
2. You gotta stop hotlinking your images, petgoat... |
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DrDebug (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 04:09 PM Response to Reply #2 |
3. Indeed. And it's very easy |
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DoYouEverWonder (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 11:30 AM Response to Reply #3 |
89. Wouldn't that be a copyright infringment |
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file83 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 10:22 PM Response to Reply #89 |
94. People do it all the time. If the copyright owners have a problem with it |
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SidDithers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 02:12 PM Response to Reply #89 |
102. You could include a link to the original page... |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 04:27 PM Response to Original message |
4. Not quite |
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DoYouEverWonder (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 05:13 PM Response to Original message |
6. What building is that diagram supposed to be of? |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 06:15 PM Response to Reply #6 |
8. The hat truss is on the top of the building. |
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DoYouEverWonder (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 07:03 AM Response to Reply #8 |
28. That's what I'd like to know? |
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mirandapriestly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 10:15 AM Response to Reply #28 |
35. I agree, it's ridiculous that "everything" failed. It seems as though |
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Americus (279 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 04:25 PM Response to Reply #28 |
80. WTC built with STEEL? Lots of people believe that, but it's not true. |
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mirandapriestly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-03-06 10:46 PM Response to Reply #80 |
81. LOL what will they think of next? |
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RayUbinger (280 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 05:28 PM Response to Original message |
7. Antenna survived, by the way |
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file83 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-01-06 08:47 PM Response to Original message |
12. OMG - there is no way in hell that a fire caused the hat truss to |
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mirandapriestly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:18 AM Response to Original message |
14. I right clicked on the image; clicked on properties |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:25 AM Response to Reply #14 |
15. Click on the link, that will take you to the page where it's at. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:56 AM Response to Reply #15 |
17. Can You Hear Me Now? |
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mirandapriestly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:38 AM Response to Reply #17 |
19. well there is no sign of the hat truss |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:35 AM Response to Reply #17 |
23. The antenna did not go through the hat truss. |
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mirandapriestly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 10:09 AM Response to Reply #23 |
34. I think it was a rhetorical queston.nt |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 11:14 AM Response to Reply #34 |
38. What was a rhetorical question? |
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mirandapriestly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 10:25 PM Response to Reply #38 |
71. I misunderstood, sorry, never mind.nt |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:22 PM Response to Reply #23 |
42. FEMA says the antenna fell first. |
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Grateful for Hope (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:00 PM Response to Reply #42 |
47. Signed |
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KJF (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:01 PM Response to Reply #42 |
48. Thanks, I was looking for those 12 frames |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:19 PM Response to Reply #42 |
51. You're jumping to your conclusion |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:06 PM Response to Reply #51 |
58. FEMA said the antenna dropped first. The NYT says it, |
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KJF (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:57 AM Response to Original message |
20. FEMA/ASCE says antenna fell before exterior wall |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:34 AM Response to Reply #20 |
22. This initial FEMA assessment doesn't take into account |
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dailykoff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:43 AM Response to Reply #22 |
24. Lame. |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 09:18 AM Response to Reply #24 |
30. All hail the mighty pronouncer of the word Lame! |
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KJF (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 03:24 AM Response to Reply #22 |
27. Not according to Frank Greening it doesn't |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 09:54 AM Response to Reply #27 |
32. NIST report 1-6, page 146 |
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KJF (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:04 PM Response to Reply #32 |
39. Greening's eyesight is fine |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:26 PM Response to Reply #39 |
53. What incredible eyesight! |
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KJF (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:45 PM Response to Reply #53 |
56. That's maybe 2 degrees, NIST said at least 8 |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:29 PM Response to Reply #22 |
44. NIST didn't document squat. It's like the 9/11 report--they invented |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:28 PM Response to Reply #44 |
55. Documented |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:09 PM Response to Reply #55 |
59. Sorry, I meant... what evidence that the tower tilts before the |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 03:30 PM Response to Reply #59 |
62. See the above picture. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 03:50 PM Response to Reply #62 |
64. You seem to think the fact that the top of the building tilted |
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Jazz2006 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:48 AM Response to Original message |
25. Must Have Been A Concrete Core. Where's Christophera When You Need Him? |
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Grateful for Hope (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-04-06 02:45 AM Response to Reply #25 |
82. Jazz, I have a question |
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Jazz2006 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-05-06 01:58 AM Response to Reply #82 |
84. Hope ~ didn't see your question earlier. Civil and commercial litigation |
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Grateful for Hope (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-05-06 05:49 AM Response to Reply #84 |
85. Thank you, Jazz n/t |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 09:45 AM Response to Reply #84 |
88. Of course what's *really* cool about becoming an instant |
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Jazz2006 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 08:16 PM Response to Reply #88 |
92. Don't quit your day job.... |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 11:59 PM Response to Reply #92 |
96. never make it as a comedian? |
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Jazz2006 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 02:56 AM Response to Reply #96 |
98. You're right. You might actually get some traction as a comedian.... |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 03:31 AM Response to Reply #98 |
99. Thank you Jazz, I will indulge my belief that I'm better at |
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Twist_U_Up (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 04:01 AM Response to Reply #99 |
100. lol |
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Jazz2006 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 04:09 AM Response to Reply #99 |
101. I've nothing against your self indulgence... |
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Twist_U_Up (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 09:20 PM Response to Reply #88 |
93. Things must be slow in the litigation dept. |
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Jazz2006 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 12:21 AM Response to Reply #93 |
97. I wish it was. |
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dailykoff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:50 AM Response to Original message |
26. Yes, that and the fact that it stirred around before falling. |
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AZCat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 09:06 AM Response to Reply #26 |
29. Perhaps you could point out what you think is "lame" about this... |
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dailykoff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 09:28 AM Response to Reply #29 |
31. Did you ever write an essay on a book you hadn't read? |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 10:05 AM Response to Reply #31 |
33. So you're slamming a summary for not providing enough detail? |
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dailykoff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 10:23 AM Response to Reply #33 |
36. The correct term is "buckled," not "shortened," |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 11:13 AM Response to Reply #36 |
37. So why did they use the term "shortened"? |
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dailykoff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 12:58 PM Response to Reply #37 |
46. See above. (n/t) |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 04:05 PM Response to Reply #46 |
66. See above. n/t |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:07 PM Response to Reply #33 |
49. "structural steel without fireproofing " |
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Bolo Boffin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 01:27 PM Response to Reply #49 |
54. Thanks for playing. |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-02-06 02:12 PM Response to Reply #54 |
60. It was your point in post 33; how was addressing it a retreat? nt |
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AZCat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 07:23 PM Response to Reply #31 |
91. Thanks for clarifying. |
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DoYouEverWonder (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 04:06 PM Response to Reply #31 |
103. If the load was going to transfer anywhere |
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DemInDistress (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-05-06 03:55 PM Response to Original message |
87. not one reply mentions the "massive explosions" caught on tape |
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petgoat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 01:31 PM Response to Reply #87 |
90. Hi DiD. I saw Eyewitness to 911 several months ago. |
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mirandapriestly (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jun-06-06 10:48 PM Response to Reply #90 |
95. His video was taken down when he put it up after 9-11 |
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DemInDistress (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jun-07-06 04:40 PM Response to Reply #90 |
104. petgoat.. I listened to massive explosion (s) 15-20 seconds before |
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