Anyone here still love Howard Dean?

I sure do. :) He's still my main political dog.

But Al Gore and Hackett are up there, too.

I wasn't a big fan during the 2004 primaries, but really like what he's doing now. And yes, he is doing a damn good job.

why not?....why wouldn't we....we have 4 new field organizers here in Wisconsin who are on the ground, rallying the troops every day...that's thanks to Howard....we have a chance to make a difference....

Love them both!

And of course, I'm excited about Ned Lamont challenging George Bush's favorite Dem, Joe Lieberman.

:bounce:

But I still believe he has done more in a year as leader of the DNC in the direction of rebuilding the Party in all 50 states from the grassroots up than any of the recent priors. But the proof will be told in November.

this past year than it has since 1997.

Love is not the right emotion. I respect what he's doing and support him 100%.

I enjoy good teachers.

there's a long thread on dKos right now. They're all cheering him on for telling Reid and Pelosi off.

Reid and Pelosi somehow, evilly, imagined that he would use the DNC to help win a majority in Congress this year.

Wouldn't they would have supported Paul Hackett, if that was the case?

Seems to me those two want a couple of other Dem insider losers to get more money, and Dean wants to spread the money out to people with decent ideas that actually know how to win.

except when he doesn't.

I don't know where you get the idea that Paul Hackett was going to win anything. He had no money, his advisors were crap or Republicans, he's never won an election before or even held public office. But instead of shooting for a House seat or state House or state Senate seat, he tries to run for the tier of office just below President. All on posture, more or less. Not that that's inherently wrong, but it might not be enough to achieve credibility.

Dean has a 50-state strategy- except it doesn't seem to have any manifestation on the ground in the states in which the '06 elections are going to be won or lost.

If you're really cynical, you could be tempted to believe that Dean is just setting up the DNC for himself and winning the '08 primaries. Not that I believe that (yet), but there isn't obvious evidence otherwise.

Why don't you do the tally of ~25 most winnable House seats and the 7-8 Senate seats we want/need. And the 4-6 Red States to challenge for in '08. Then look at where they are and who is doing the funding and organizing for them. Then compare that to what Dean is emphasizing. I don't hear any good news from the Ohio state party, or of revitalizing of the Florida state party, or anything much happening in the Southwest. Where exactly does Dean think Congress will be won back, or the '08 elections?

of the strongest Republican congressional districts in our country- recently.

Hackett connects across party lines. He speaks with common sense and conviction- and people actually *like* him, believe it or not. They trust him. And he was quite acceptable to even the solid progressives in our party.

Hackett had that seat in the bag. Now, according to the Brown supporters on this board, we have a far-left, Kucinich-style candidate running for the seat. And our party leaders made that happen, deliberately. You think that was wise?

Honestly, we haven't seen "wisdom" from our leadership in quite awhile. It's about time somebody with some kind of sway- i.e., hands on the pursestrings- did something about this stupid shit that we've been seeing for 12+ years.

Hackett did not have that seat in the bag. He ran in Ohio's equivalent of Alabama, and Jean Schmidt pissed off the local Republican "establishment". His near-election was to a substantial extent that of being a pawn in a game of two Republican factions facing off against each other. If he won they both figured they'd get the seat back this November.

No, Brown is a liberal, not 'far Left' or Kucinich wing. Hackett is/was a typical hard Left guy and no liberal. What "progressive" means I have not been able to figure out in 5 years on DU- I think it's code for Left people who don't want to admit being Left, but who can tell.

If Kerry could got to 48% in Ohio, Brown can clear 50% and, as a liberal, actually be a useful Democrat in the Senate. I think what is confusing you is that you lump the moderate wing- the leaders until recently, and I agree that they were timid and often stupid- with the liberal wing, recently ascendant and far more insightful than you give them credit for, and you do have a contempt for both that blinds you to the distinctions and priorities and the mechanics the other wings work by.

At the end of long social rights conflict, which is what the present Culture War is, there is a brief period in which hardcore liberals are given control of government. Liberals expend their power on making the necessary changes to the social laws and making dysfunctional government effective and ethical again; no other faction ever does either. Then the liberals get kicked down again and Leftists and moderates use government to incrementally adjust economic rights to fit the social order and needs. It was that away after the Revolution, after the Civil War, after the fight for universal sufferage, and now it will be that way after the Culture War now reaching its end. There is a window in time in which liberals are more electable than Leftists. I think we are at the edge of such a window.

Are you really truly that cynical? Are you not aware that it is the job of the DNC to build the party? Dean is doing it from the ground up.

The DSCC and DCCC do NOT want any of us taking part except to vote for the people they choose in many cases. I have seen 5, maybe 6 good candidates being asked to drop out after they proved a district was competitive.

They are supposed to be supporting the candidates, and as Cook says, Dean is doing what he is supposed to be doing.

"Hot Dean Love Action" hardly describes the Kos thread. Most of it is simply appreciative that someone is trying to include people in the party again.

Are you really truly that cynical?

No. But it's an angle good faith believers would have a factual (as opposed to a faith-based/subjective) defense to.

Are you not aware that it is the job of the DNC to build the party?

And isn't the purpose of building party apparatus to serve campaigns and win elections? Or is it just supposed to sit there and look nice?

Dean is doing it from the ground up.

How's it looking on the ground where you are? Has the Florida Democratic Party even really begun to clean up its act, get competent and competitive, get fresh blood and new donors? Or is DfA starting to run some significant campaigns?

I don't mean to be crudely skeptical. And I do think Rahm Emmanuel is doing a botch job in all those 45% Kerry-voting House districts- but the 20-25 districts that are more favorable and have locally picked good people are going to decide the House election outcome.

No, that dKos thread is 95% people who grotesquely assert everything Dean touches turns to gold and everything Reid and Pelosi touch is sh-t. That's people with Hackett Syndrome- in it for the vicarious power rush, and petulant idiots when denied that. Reid and Pelosi don't give them that fix and don't let them in on everything.

"And isn't the purpose of building party apparatus to serve campaigns and win elections? Or is it just supposed to sit there and look nice?"

He is not just sitting there and looking nice, as you so snidely say. He is traveling most of the time, working with state groups, meeting with big donors, small ones, etc.

I find it actually insulting you would say that, or even imply that.

The DSCC and DCCC are supposed to be supporting the candidates. He is supposed to run the presidential campaign in 08, and build the party.
His vision is different, he is restructuring, but to infer hijacking for an 08 campaign is really unreal.

And we are giving the Florida party a run for their money about answering to us. I know of several DFAers who have gotten state and county level positions. Karen Thurman hears from many of us frequently. She and Bill Nelson still feel entitled to run things, but they are getting over it quickly.

We have an impressive director, Luis Navarro, and my friends who work with him are very impressed.

I never thought Dean would run in 08, and I don't think so now. He loves the gritty stuff of fighting to change things. He enjoys doing it.

So rest easy, he would not do that. Though a lot of us wish it, it won't happen.

After all- what politician doesn't have "sitting there and looking nice" as part of their job description?

With that sentence I didn't actually mean to impugn Dean personally. I simply meant that the work he does is not an end in itself.

But that you- two of you- would immediately read a personal insult into it and really hanker for one in the carefully toned qualification I gave earlier about being cynical, that troubles me. Is there any critique of Dean you would take as impersonal???

That's actually the first positive news I've heard about the FDP in, well, years. Thank you for sharing. It's a beginning, which is good, and it's just a beginning, which is not so good.

Oh, well, maybe you can apologize again.

It did come across as insulting that you would think he would use the DNC that way. He has a passion for changing things. He wants it rebuilt with smaller donors and not have to rely so totally on lobbyists and corporate donors.

As to Florida, yes, it is slow but there is change. They think we are like little gnats and prefet to swat away. It is not working though.

nice of you to jump in at the beginning of the thread to try and piss on dean.

right on cue, to.

since reid and pelosi have done SOOOO well these last few elections getting all those new democrats elected into the house and the senate, i sure see no reason why dean shouldn't step aside and let them continue their tried and proven election winning strategeries. :sarcasm:

NOT!!!

:rofl:

And I mean that!

:kick: for Dean!

I recorded him literally a couple feet away last July 13, 2005 in Madison. He says many great relevant things. Enjoy!

QuickTime 7

Windows Media

...being right too soon is worse than being wrong.

America is the poorer for it.

And I honestly not envy the hard work he is doing trying to bring the Democratic Party back from being a token opposition. It also angers me that many of the D.C. Dems are just screwing Dean over at every turn. I used to think that having Dean as DNC would be a good idea but now I think the DLC Vichy Democrats pulled one over on Howard Dean by letting him have the DNC so he won't run for office again and by making him look bad.

John

Always!

We need a few dozen more of him!

I am completely on board with the 50 state strategy, and although I wish he would think before he speaks sometimes...that complaint is minor compared to the good work he is doing!!!

I'm an original Dean fan and have never stopped thinking we need many more like him. I've had the privilege of meeting him four or five different times now, starting when no one had even heard of him in 2003. In fact, when I ran for the Kansas State House two years ago, his organization gave me my largest single donation.

We need more like him.

Have since June of 2003, and my admiration for him has only grown. He says what no other Dem dares say, and it's TRUE.

He had such momentum going that it looked for sure like he was going to be the next Dem president, and then some strange things happened.

It even depresses me that he got side-swiped by the mainstream media and certain so-called "Democrats". I am still convinced he was the right man to take on Bush. He would have cleaned his clock.


John

I like Reid and Pelosi too.

:thumbsup:

2008 should be all ours! I hope that Dean will start a draft Gore for re-election campaign! I hope he asks the Carter center to supervise the 2008 elections.

more or less in favor of the Common Peep and work toward that end...

I was a Deaniac until the Press fucked him over and I had to support Kerry....But I still think that boy got plenty fight in him...

He's our only hope for waking up the Dem party in DC.

He's a good guy.

TC

I think he's doing a wonderful job. Good radio address yesterday.


:patriot:

I :loveya: Howard Dean!

I think he is doing a great job, and he is on-target.

He would have made one Hell of a president if I may add. :thumbsup:

Grassroots funding.. Bottom up instead of Top Down. It might not be noticeable now..but it will be in the future.