FACTS on "illegals"

I literally spent MINUTES reading and collecting this information.

No, it isn't 100% complete but if you post something you are looking for I will do my best to find the FACT on it for you as best as I can (meaning I will tell you how much I trust it and you can make your own decision).

This issue is one with many "facts" to it but I trust what I am about to post.

Much thanks to suffragette.

For round numbers there appear to be about 10 Million "illegal immigrants" or "undocumented workers". Not to parse words here, they both mean basically the same thing.

Of undocumented/illegals--> 60-75% entered illegally. The other 25-40% entered legally and overstayed their visas or otherwise violated the terms of their admission.
-Of those 57% are Mexican, 23% are from other Latin American countries, 10% are Asian, 5% are European or Canadian, and 5% are from everywhere else.

Of the Foreign Born Population (~ 35 Million) in the US 25% are illegal/undocumented-- 30% are Legal, 30% Naturalized, 8% Refugees, 5% Temporary legal.

40% of illegals are women. 54% live in married families or other families. Fewer then half are single men and unattached.

According to the US Social Security Administration 75% pay payroll taxes and will contribute $6-7 BILLION in Social Security funds that they will never claim.

Okay here is where it gets fuzzy.

90-96% are employed (I saw both numbers)

AND NOW the big question

Do they drain social service resources MORE than they contribute?

The CATO Institute (yes them) says:

Myth number four: Immigrants impose a financial burden on taxpayers. Immigrants do make somewhat heavier use of means-tested welfare programs than natives. There have been especially flagrant abuses by immigrants of particular welfare programs, such as Supplemental Security Income. But because immigrants tend to come to the United States during the start of their working years --between the ages of 18 and 35 -- they make very large net contributions to the two largest income transfer programs: Social Security and Medicare. When the payroll tax contributions of immigrants are taken into account, the Urban Institute found that the foreign born constitute a net fiscal windfall to the public sector of some $20 billion a year. To the extent that welfare use by immigrants is a problem, this can be addressed by restricting the welfare eligibility of immigrants, not by keeping immigrants out.
http://www.cato.org/dailys/4-22-97.html

PBS (yes THEM) says

Immigrants pay more in taxes than they receive in public services in their lifetime?

REALITY: Welfare use among non-refugee immigrants is lower than among U.S. native-born citizens in the same age group (15-64). The 1990 census reported that 20.4 percent of immigrants were on welfare, compared with 26.2 percent of U.S. native-born citizens. In 1997, immigrants paid an estimated $133 billion in federal, state and local taxes. A typical immigrant and his or her offspring pay an estimated $80,000 more in taxes than they will receive in federal, state and local benefits over the course of their lifetimes.

http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thecity/immigration1.html

And Finally Jesus-is-Savior (with hypnotic music) says:

5. Illegal aliens absolutely do not contribute more than they cost. Certainly the millions in prison and on welfare aren't contributing a dime to our economy, and the ones who are working often are paid in cash with no deductions for taxes at all. The ones who use fraudulent social security numbers and qualify to pay taxes and social security have so many deductions for dependents that they pay little if any taxes. We have seen them pay less than $100 in taxes and get back $4,000 refunds (thanks to earned income tax credits and multiple dependents). The Center for Immigration Studies estimates that the average Mexican illegal alien costs U.S. taxpayers a whopping $55,000 each. Some bargain, eh?
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils%20in%20Government/Open%20Borders/myths_and_lies-illegal_immigration.htm
and adds


3. Illegal aliens are NOT necessarily coming here to work. Lou Dobbs recently reported that 33 percent of our prison population is now comprised of non-citizens. Plus, 36 to 42 percent of illegal aliens are on welfare. So, for a good proportion of these people, the American dream is crime and welfare, not coming here to work.

Okay I threw that one in.

Well so far that is what I have found. If you want me to go searching for any other specific questions please post them.

They entered the country with documentation and passports.

correct?

That is why, for the purposes of this thread, both mean the same.

Would it be fair for the remaining indigenous locals to reclaim the land? Considering what we've done to it, I say "yes".

The recent film "The New World" was obviously biased on this matter but is still a good window into the difference between cultures and how they treat the land.

the statistics quoted by "Immigration" groups is that they lump both Legal and Illegal immigrants together. I have worked with Illegals in the fields picking flowers in Florida. They were paid in cash (so was I for the first couple of weeks.).

You will not convince me that your stats are accurate unless you can make a distinction between Legal and Illegal.

By the way, you just bought into the Bush* Myth. He doesn't make a distinction between Illegal or Legal either. But then he doesn't enforce the current immigration laws either (you know he just ignores laws that he doesn't like. He's the pResident after all). If he did enforce the immigration laws, his support would dry up.

Or at least show their relative size of each. That is what I intended to do anyway.

Of the Foreign Born Population (~ 35 Million) in the US 25% are illegal/undocumented-- 30% are Legal, 30% Naturalized, 8% Refugees, 5% Temporary legal.

NOw as far as your personal experience-I am obviously not in any position to argue about that but I will say that you seem to fall into the same trap that others do. Look at the raw numbers again, 10 MILLION illegal/undocumented (3/4 of whom apparently pay taxes) you worked with what a hundred? Was it that many? 25% of 10 Million is 2 1/2 MILLION people. Your experience (many people do this so I am not pointing you out personally) does not necessarily extrapolate out to the entire population that we are talking about. Also, as you point out, some personal experiences themselves may lump legal and illegals together assuming that every one in a workplace or setting are all one or another.