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dfgrbac Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:10 PM
Original message
NBC tries to block democracy in MSNBC debate!
Edited on Tue Oct-23-07 03:28 PM by dfgrbac
Former Senator Mike Gravel has been the only Democrat in the Presidential debates to openly and consistently challenge the top tier candidates on America's Imperial Wars. If you missed it, hear what he had to say to Hillary about her vote on the Lieberman Bill.

It seems NBC and the DNC are getting upset with Senator Gravel exposing the truth. They are trying to exclude Gravel from the upcoming MSNBC debate October 30th. If we truly want democracy in America, we should not let them get away with this. All declared candidates should be included in all debates - always!

If you agree, please contact MSNBC about this. You can sign a petition here.
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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. What about these declared candidates?
Dal LaMagna, Founder of Tweezerman, Inc

Danny M. Francis, Retired Marine Corps officer; two tours of Vietnam combat duty; Retired Department of Defense Civilian; Professional Educator

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Democratic_presidential_candidates,_2008#Other_candidates

Why aren't they included?
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Rhythm and Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
2. No, they have blocked a non-candidate
Edited on Tue Oct-23-07 03:14 PM by Rhythm and Blue
with less than 1% of the vote, no fundraising ability, and who has been a rambling, disjointed embarrassment to himself, the party, and the debate each time the mic was given to him.

There are literally dozens and dozens of declared candidates, in this party and others. You can't include 'em all. You just include the ones who have some support.
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Mojorabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. I so totally disagree
he brings up topics that need discussing.
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Rhythm and Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. You can't argue that he doesn't bring in supporters or funds.
He doesn't even really campaign.
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dfgrbac Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Since April 2006
Mike Gravel has been campaigning for President since April 2006! But the media refuses to cover him.

One of the less corporate connected media (PBS) recently did an interview with Gravel.
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itsrobert Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Less than one percent of the "vote"?
Who actually voted? I must of missed that.
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dfgrbac Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. The media and their CEOs - that's who!
Who voted to make Gravel less than 1%? The media and their CEOs - that's who!

The military-industrial-media complex wants nothing to do with him. He burnt them when he stopped the draft and exposed the Viet Nam era Pentagon Papers.
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #2
13. Who died and made you (MSNBC) the arbiter? My vote goes to him - debate or no debate
and your candidate and your corporate money and MSM blessings can go f* themselves!
yet another time I see on DU cheers for stifling democracy...:puke:
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #2
17. why can't you include everyone who is running?
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. because dozens of people are running
most of whom have absolutely no chance.

If you could get on a national debate simply by filing to run, there'd be thousands of candidates.

That would be a fruitless debate.
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. thus sayeth the supporter of the alleged frontrunner
easy to claim and insist upon, in your position.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Huh?
What part do you disagree with?

There ARE dozens of people running.

Do you think there wouldn't be hundreds or thousands if they knew they could get on a national debate just by filing some papers?

Do you think a debate with thousands of participants would be fruitful?
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-01-07 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. Well then
How about garaunteeing some measure of equal time and access to questions for the eight main candidates?

Or would you rather it all be determined by a dollar meter and a telephone poll?

I mean sure that seems fair, we will only let those into the debate (or on television) if they can get a certain amount of money donated to their campaigns.
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. Blocking Democracy? Geez... I'm not going to be on the stage and I have roughly the
same right to be there as Mike Gravel. Neither of us are seriously seeking the office.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:22 PM
Response to Original message
6. He is they only one asking the honest and hard questions
of the others like Hillary. The rest of the questions are poll tested softballs from the M$M! What a loss. :(


Thank you for the links!
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #6
15. Also, the one who voted as he speaks - the man who ended the draft!
Edited on Tue Oct-23-07 04:28 PM by The Count
You prefer candidates who run against their own record? And that, in the name of sanity! :eyes:
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. I saw this in an earilier post.
Couldn't bring myself to point out the obvious.

NBC is sponsoring the debate, and inviting who they want.

NBC is broadcasting the debate.

It is NBC's debate. NBC's space. NBC's party. It's odd that they feel they need a CYA excuse to not invite somebody, when there are so many millions of people that they make it a rule not to invite.


They don't get pissed when you don't invite them onto your tv, do they? Ok, maybe they do, if they're monitoring you that closely. But they surely wouldn't complain to you about it. I think. :crazy:
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SaveElmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
8. How's that blocking democracy...?
There are dozens of declared candidates...why aren't they included...?

Some of them more sane sounding than Mike...

There is no fundamental right to be included in every Presidential debate
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dfgrbac Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. There are only 8 declared Democratic candidates for President.
If you know of more, list them! The eight candidates declared at the DNC winter meeting.
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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. These are also declared candidates — according to the FEC:
Dal LaMagna, Founder of Tweezerman, Inc

Danny M. Francis, Retired Marine Corps officer; two tours of Vietnam combat duty; Retired Department of Defense Civilian; Professional Educator


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Democratic_presidential_candidates%2C_2008#Other_candidates
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NoPasaran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #18
27. You scoff at Tweezerman
But why are the "front runners" silent on the Moustache Scissors issue?
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TheWraith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. Okay, I'm declaring my candidacy.
Do I now have the right to full participation in the debate? How about Steven Colbert, or the two guys mentioned upthread, LaMagna and Francis?

If I were MSNBC, I'd be doing the same thing. Having fewer people on stage means that the people who are there get more time, and there's more opportunity for actual discussion instead of having to give each person 20 seconds then move to the next. I'd be trying to push out Chris Dodd, too. For that matter, as much as I like Dennis Kucinich, he's not exactly rising in the polls either.
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SaveElmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #12
23. There are dozens...
Take a look at the FEC website...
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #12
24. No
Edited on Tue Oct-23-07 05:39 PM by MonkeyFunk
there are far more than 8.

Roland Aranjo
Warren R. Ashe
Christina Gerasimos Billings-Elias
Robert E. "Bob" Boyer
Willie F. Carter
Randolph W. "Randy" Crow
Laura Davis-Aaron
Phil Epstein
Michael K. Forrester
Danny M. "Dan" Francis
Wrendo J.P. Godwin
Albert "Big Al" Hamburg
Alfonzo Jones
John Joseph Kennedy
Karl E. Krueger
Dal A. "Tweezerman" LaMagna
R. Frank Lynch
Lee L. Mercer Jr.
Sal Mohamed
Oloveuse O. "Ole" Savior
Jeffrey C. "Jeff" Thomas


http://www.politics1.com/p2008-dems.htm
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:26 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. You are the sanity arbiter now? Suporting a candidate who voted for this war?
I beg to differ.
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 04:29 PM
Response to Original message
16. He should be included until he says otherwise. . or until
The People have Spoken!
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
20. Not the only Democrat to consistently challenge the 'top tier'...
Dennis has as well.

I do agree that Mike should be included.

-Hoot
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dfgrbac Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #20
28. I voted for Dennis in 2004.
But I support Mike Gravel for his National Initiative. Once the people are empowered, it won't matter so much who is President! The people will be able to "refresh" the office any time - not just every four years.
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Rowdyboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
21. Good start, NBC.....keep up the good work
The "debates" as they presently exist are a joke.
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dfgrbac Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. Actually, Tim Russert did a good job on the last debate.
And eight candidates have participated in all Democratic debates so far. None of them should be forced out unless they decide to quite.
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