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bigdarryl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 06:54 PM
Original message
Obama DON'T do it its a setup
The fucking media ass wipes keep harping on the fact the Obama should go after Hillary full force negatively. they are setting him up for the fall plain and simple you watch. as soon as he start going after her he will be bashed viciously by this stinking ass media who are trying to help get her elected. In fact he will not be going personal on her but pointing out the fact that they have some differences but the media will frame it as him going negitive on her YOU WATCH thats my perdiction.
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. Obama got caught, now his supporters:
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 06:59 PM
Response to Original message
2. It's Obama, not "fucking media ass wipes" saying it's time to go negative.
He's said so himself.
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. He is not "going negative"; he is pointing out where he disagrees
with Senator Clinton.
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cuke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. So he'll outline the differences and say "Hillary's right. I'm wrong"?
Or will it be the other way around?

And how is "Hillary is wrong" not "going negative"?
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mark414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. highlighting half-truths and policy differences isn't going negative,
it's called telling the truth
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cuke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. So saying "Hillary is telling half-truths" isn't negative
Your candidates a liar!!

You don't have to thank me for being positive about your candidate
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mark414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. my candidate?
i don't have a candidate, yet, though admittedly i am leaning towards obama.

truthfully calling somebody out for lying or being deceptive is the point of a campaign, as well as to highlight differences between you and other candidates.

'going negative' is personal attacks and purposely distorting someone's record to make them look bad.

what obama is doing is highlighting policy differences and legitimately pointing out instances where hillary clinton's record does not match her public positions and where she is being less than forthcoming on details of what she really stands for.

i like hillary and think she would make an alright president. however it is true that she has been very vague on certain issues that would make her less than popular with the Democratic base and if me voicing that concern is me going negative than so be it. i'm a terrible negative mudslinger who is abandoning my politics of hope to throw punches and bruise egos.

"i don't give em hell; i tell the truth and they think it's hell"
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cuke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. Sorry for being unclear about "my candidate"
Edited on Sat Oct-27-07 11:08 PM by cuke
I was referring to a generic candidate. If I knew who you were supporting (which I obviously can't know) I would have used that name. In hindsight, I should have put it in quotes

I have to concede you make a good point about how "going negative" isn't merely criticizing or saying your position is better than anothers. I prefer that words not be watered down. It should be reserved for less honorable practices like personal attacks and outright lies. I'm not sure about distortions because that can be very subjective and could be the result of honest misunderstanding.

I think that, for the most part, Obama is not going negative. He's raising legitimate issues that deserve the public's attention. However, he does need to be careful. It's not hard (nor inaccurate) to portray "She tells half-truths" as going negative.

It could be a big plus for him if Obama can thread the needle and keep up an offense without going negative. It would be a great way to demonstrate both how his "New Politics" works and his political skills. Finally, it would emphasize his theme of Unity. It will be Hillary's task to knock him off balance and drag him back into the old politics.

And I don't think pointing her vagueness out (to the extent that it's true) is negative when it's phrased that way. For Obama, a lot is going to depend, not on what he says, but how he says it. He needs to avoid phrases like "half truths"
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bigdarryl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. he didn't say NEGATIVE the media will say its NEGATIVE do you understand the difference
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Right... I forgot you people think he poops perfume...
As he rides down from the rainbow on his unicorn with free ice cream and puppies for everyone...















:eyes:
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. ....
:spray:
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
5. obama and clinton ought to remember dean vs gephardt....in 2003
when they went negative on each other and john kerry leapt past them on his way to losing to bush(now many believe kerry did not actually lose the election, but bush is prez and kerry is not).

then again at the time in 2003 dean and gephardt were reasonably close to each other in popularity and that does not seem to be the case for clinton and obama.

Msongs
www.msongs.com

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bigdarryl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. I think they should go after each other on issues because its preparing them for the onslaught that.
is sure to take place by the republicans in the general election. all this bull that the voters don't want the candidates to go after each another is crazy how else are you supposed to get you message out
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:09 PM
Response to Original message
6. this is a disaster for the democrat party! nt.
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 07:12 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. It'll screw him out of the VP spot he's been dreaming of, that's certain.
Too bad. A Clinton/Pre-McClurkinPositiveObama ticket would've been a winner.
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Froward69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. "Democrat-"ic"
please get it correct. Dmocratic... and no the democratic party will survive the great loss of '08
Future AP...
The Hillary Obama ticket drew record numbers of voters that over whelmingly voted for "the Republican" as the Democrats have clearly lost their minds. voters nationwide repeated over and over why couldent we have BIDEN/Ritchardson. and so the United states got sold out.:sarcasm:
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 11:08 PM
Response to Reply #12
21. (He was being sarcastic)
The OPer is notorious for using the phrase "democrat party."
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
13. They also want a fight now because it will help the Rethugs in the general.
And of course, because fights sell more copies.
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
15. Yeah don't do it Obama
don't associate yourself with known bigots.
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
17. If today's any indication, he'll go about it the right way
Press her for more specifics on issues that he has stuck his neck out on, such as eliminating the income cap on the SS tax. He can also point to his record as an ethics and lobbyist reformer and compare it with her penchant for secrecy and insider politics as well as IWR, Kyl/Lieberman and her continued inability and/or unwillingness to avoid obvious strategic foreign policy traps that BushCo lays out for her. In the process, he comes down off the ivory tower and energizes existing and potential supporters. If all Hillary keeps doing in response is ask, "whatever happened to the politics of hope?" the media will tire of her and start pressing for better and more specific answers.

This was the campaign's plan all along; I like the timing. It's basically two months until Iowa, plenty of time to make the sale.
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NovemberRain Donating Member (11 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
19. I Agree...
That's exactly what people expect, but I think that Obama will try to focus more on the issues. Of course, he will go after Hillary somewhat, but that's politics, right?
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BenDavid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-28-07 01:44 AM
Response to Original message
22. Excuse me but Obama has tried this twice and
in both instances HRC handed him his ass and he had to drop back.....The only problem with Obama going negative means he has nothing further to add positively to his campaign....plus, HRC has already said when your opponent attacks you, then you " hit back and deck your opponent"......But she will have respect for Obama and not deck him as she will save that for the general and deck whomever attacks her....

Ben David
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Arkana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-28-07 10:01 AM
Response to Original message
23. In the words of Admiral Ackbar,
"IT'S A TRAP!"
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