Hillary is an insult to my departed mother. My mother graduated from law school in 1944.

She was the only woman in her class.Her law professors forced her to read out loud all the salacious details of rape cases for the edification of her snickering male classmates. She was jeered at and had filthy kotex thrown at her as she walked to class. When she passed the bar, on the first try, I might add, she had a hard time getting work because she was told, like Sandra Day O'Connor, that males needed the job to support their families. She was once told in the seventies, when we were supposedly "beyond this" that she was not going to be allowed to work with the DA's office because the DA's "wife" didn't approve of him working with a "woman". She was also the first woman to collect disability benefits from the NY Bar Assoc.for maternity leave. They didn't have "maternity leave" because lawyers didn't get pregnant.But she had to "prove " she was "disabled" to a board of males and explain her history of miscarriage.She was on bed rest for 9 months.Males did not have to "prove " their ailments at that time.The doctors note was sufficient. My mother knew what it was like to be "piled on" by men.
She never played "victim" She said to acknowledge that they can victimize you is to validate weakness and insults all women who are fighting to be accepted as "equals". My mother was a feminist before her time.

Hillary Clinton betrayed my mother and all those like her by allowing her campaign to play the "victim".She just threw generations of women who fought to be perceived as equals under the bus. And she didn't even do it for a valid reason.She just didn't like the questions she was asked or the reactions of her opponents. Character does count and this action does not display the character and integrity that the first female president should have.

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2007/11/02/playing_th...


Aides to Sen. Hillary Clinton told the Associated Press that there is "a clear and long-planned strategy to fend off attacks by accusing her male rivals of gathering against her. The idea is to change the subject while making Clinton a sympathetic figure, especially among female voters who often feel outnumbered and bullied on the job."

Until I saw the author.

this OP either has way, w-a-y too much time on their hands, is easily offended (smelling salts and fainting couch anyone?) or has an unfortunate amount of limitless hate.

In any case, this is just same ol', same ol' from this OP and nothing really of substance to see. Eventually, the OP is gonna have to change tactics 'cause this spittle-laced, hateful, vindictive shit is getting mighty boring. Something one can hear out of the mouth of any petulant, condescending, deeply unhappy high school cheerleader any day of the week.

:evilgrin:

I don't know what in the hell is wrong with the supporters of a certain candidate. Some of the most hideous stuff I've ever seen posted at DU and I really don't know why they get away with it.

saracat is always so sweet and generous and kind. a wonderful, reasonable, level-headed addition to any conversation and always open and supportive of everyone with nary a harsh word to share. it's very mean of me to be, you know, mean to someone who only brings light and love and laughter with her posts to DU

Do I really need the :sarcasm: thingy-ma-bob here?

Whatever happened to those two? :rofl::rofl::rofl:

do I really care? :evilgrin:

This is the poster who ranted about how "ugly" Hillary looked on Letterman. Some of the crap that the OP posts is such a waste of server space.

and it's our Right to call her on her tiresome b.s. Isn't that what Freedom of Speech is all about?

Oh, I almost forgot: Go Edwards!

Apparently one can never even comment on Hillary and she is always a Goddess. Sheesh.

I read the first few lines....then glanced over at the name....and didn't bother reading any further.

Her use her gender as a tool against her opponents is revolting.

and YOUR PERCEPTION sure doesn't make it reality. I'm not a Hillary supporter, but geez, get over it!

Once again, we see Hillary willing to use any tactic to get ahead, even if it means hurting women in general.

How many of you still believe she'll appoint strong pro-choice judges, especially if the 2012 election looks to be close?

Hillary will appoint pro-choice judges. How you can leap from calling the boys club on their stuff to questioning her pro-choice stance is, indeed, incredible.

Did they pick on a poor widdle girl? Awwww...those meanies.

Wasn't Hillary supposed to be tough? Or was that last week's talking point?

Female students. About being a woman in politics.

And people took those quotes and insisted this was part of her "defense". It was not.

and they have nothing in common with working class women.

Hillary's "Investor Class Express" means nothing to people that live paycheck to paycheck, often holding more than one job, and with little or no benefits.

I'm a woman, and I think her candidacy, whether she wins or loses the nomination, is great for "women in general". How is she "hurting women"???? You folks have been watching/listening/reading too much MSM.

It may be hard to believe, being a Hillary supporter and all, but some of us don't actually need to be told what to think.

and your comment about her not appointing pro-choice justices is just crap - a figment of your imagination.

Her word on it? Has she even committed to this basic tenet of the Democratic party? :rofl:

past 7 years should suffice. Her rating from NARAL and every other organization that looks at choice and other issues of importance to women, could also help. Her history is staunchly pro-choice.

She wouldn't stick her neck out on Robets, Alito or Gonzales. How do you know she'll do it when she's president?

though some argue that Kerry did, I don't think that's true. Her history on choice is really quite clear. She hasn't compromised on that one inch. As I said, this is a dead end route to criticizing Clinton. I'm not sure why you'd be so stubborn as to pursue it.

I'm criticizing her record on truth and principle. How do we know that choice is the one issue she won't throw under the bus in order to win a swing state?

grow wings and fly into the White House? We're just going to have to agree to disagree here. I'm confident, based on her votes and history on this issue, that she'll nominate pro-choice judges who are moderate/liberal- and not just on choice. You're convinced due to her history of triangulation on other issues, that that may not be true. It's fruitless to keep running around the mulberry bush on this one.

I've seen her jump around a couple of times, but that's about it.



:P

if you think hillary's achievement is an insult to your mom, then all i can say is, i am sorry your mom is no longer w. us because i bet she would set you straight real fast!

my mom went thru much of what you describe (well obviously not in the legal field, this would never have been possible for a woman of her class, but just trying to get a career at all), she does not hate hillary, she knows exactly how every time a woman raises her voice how the media and how society STILL treat us -- she's shrill, he's forceful

a quick look at stats shows that women still earn less than men, and a quick look at our lives show that women still face a glass ceiling and plenty of challenges, and to pretend it has all been rosebuds and flowers scattered under hillary's feet is pretty damn hilarious

this whisper campaign of how some "aides" claim it's hillary's strategy to whine and play the gender card is just that, more of the same crap, women can't even tell the truth about their own stories without being accused of whining, it disgusts me, anyway she does NOT whine

She had no respect for her.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

this is an awfully personal comment and it coming close to crossing the line. I have the right to bash Hillary until after the primary.If she wins, I can no longer do so on DU. You have the right not to like it. You do not have the right at any point to personally attack me or attempt to analyze my family.

because of your vindicative posts. You've said some hateful things about Hillary so expect to get some of it back.

You don't have the right to use personal attacks on Hillary either but that hasn't stopped you, has it?

Grow up and stop whining when you get negative responses. Your posts are offensive and I don't read them anyway because when I see who the OP is I know it's going to be just another crazy rant about Hillary.

Before we have a nominee I can say what I wish about Hillary.She is a public figure. I find her using the gender card "offensive". And I am not alone.

she attacks you with one hand while instructing you not to attack her with the other. It's kinda her MO. Just fyi.

Just sayin'

n/t

...but that it was about being the frontrunner. Whether or not we like her politics (I'm about 50/50 when it comes to her positions) ~ every woman in the United States has good reason to be proud of Hillary.

Frankly, it makes me sick to see the way women begrudge other women their successes ~ it's no wonder that it's taken so long for us to get this far.

In order to prove that your Mother would never allow herself to be portrayed as a victim, you choose to portray your mother as a victim?

Do I have that right?

about in contrast.

for portraying her as one.

It is not what one experiences that make a victim it is how one reacts to the treatment.Hillary accuse "7 men on "piling on". But takes credit for being a "strong woman".She reacts by playing the victim of a "pile on".

I'm a Kucinich person with an Edwards as my failsafe.

When Dean was the front runner, he also accused the other's of "piling on". Your concept that Hill is saying this because she's a woman is very telling. I suspect you feel you are a victim because of your gender.
You certainly took pains to make your mother out as a victim based on gender while lambasting Hillary for it.

Fact: Hill is the front-runner.

Fact. Front runners get piled on.

I thought she played the "I'm top dog and the puppies are yelping at my feet" card.

She was right too. That's how it went down.

:eyes:

all depends upon her dining companions

Hillary is not playing victim. Hillary's a strong woman who has had to put up with and overcome her share of male chauvinism. She's calling it as she sees it.

a confusing brand of hatred from those of her own sex. She gets blasted if she does and if she doesn't by both men and women.

Truth be told, Hillary has a sense of self and an inner strength that allows her to withstand the assault of stupid people and the criticism of angry busy-bees that this OP can only dream of.

And, by contrast, this OP gets angry and goes on the defensive if you dare disagree with her. Go figure.

I'm sure her guy Edwards would be proud.

I have no doubt with the likes of Chuck Schumer and Rahm Emmanuel giving her monumental support and twisting arms for money Hillary WILL have NO problem "having it her way!" I mean, after all according to many of you who support her, think she's such a STRONG WOMAN!!

You others can't have it both ways either!! Poor baby gets attacked, but by God there is no other woman who can stand toe to toe with her!! She makes my skin crawl!! I don't like her, I don't trust her and I most certainly think she's making EVERY effort to play "Southern Belle" and a "Iron Jawed Woman" at the same time! And there's a name for doing that... UH maybe "triangulation!"

As a woman, she's can't hold a candle to so many others who actually started the feminist movement and "actually" took and stand and stood their ground while working for "our equality!" All the while taking the real "heat" so people like Clinton could crawl in bed with so many Corporatist and Lobbyist who have "given" her an easy ride by patting her butt on the way up!!! And THAT kind of massage is repugnant to me!!

:wtf:

you'd be yawning by this point. A lot of same ol', same ol'.

pointing and turn it back on yourself! Since you're unable or simply DON'T want to understand the real meaning of the OP, all you can do is revert to "personal" slime attacks on the OP!

Shows a lot of class! NOT!!!

:rofl:

I have some land for sale in the swamp. Interested?

no SWAMP!!
:silly:

when I start using my dead mother as a springboard to further my pathetic, hate-filled agenda against a Candidate, then we can discuss who has class and who doesn't.

Just sayin'.

My mom will be ninety years old on February 7th, God willing...She has stage 3 colon cancer and is an amputee...I have been taking care of her since 1996 while running a small business from my home..
She never saw her father or remembered him because he died when she was nine moths old during The Great Influenza Of 1918.Her mother was a Russian immigrant who had been in this country for eight years and had three children to raise; my mom and her brother and sister...She had an 151 IQ and skipped two grades and graduated high school at sixteen years old. But she couldn't go to college because someone had to help support my grandmother...Her first boyfriend was one of those soft socialists who used to proselytize on street corners...He went on to be a comptroller in the Lindsay administration...

My mom has always been active in Democratic politics... She walked precincts in 1960 for John Kennedy...She took me to the front of a rope line in 1964 to shake RFK's hand when he was running for senator from New York...She caucused for Ted Kennedy in the 1980 Florida straw poll...She has met Al and Tipper Gore and even Joe Lieberman...

I won't use her story to bash another Democrat but I will say the one thing she hopes and prays for is to make it another year so we can she can vote for Hillary Clinton...

PEACE
DSB

Thanks.

I have a 76 yr old mom, physically debilitated, mentally sharp mom, who was the first woman to serve on the city council in the city in which I grew up.

She was the target of much vitriol, for daring to break that gender barrier. And, I couldn't be more proud of her.

Sen. Clinton's historic run is beyond edifying for her.

Thanks for your post, it brought tears to my eyes. MKJ

worthwhile to read.

before that it was just another tiresome, desperate for any kind of attention-type of rant. Now it's worthy of reading again. Well, your Post anyway.

I wish I could have the privilege of meeting her.

She sounds like a lovely woman.

is 95 and has Severe Alzheimer's related "many" stories to me from the past too! While she may not have "skipped" two grades in school and perhaps her IQ wasn't as high as your mother's, still she was a very hard working woman!! But I'd bet HER IQ was higher than The Idiot, Decider's!

But she did have ONE thing... it's called "common sense" and she too was a very strong Democrat! So we all have common "stories" we could tell! Gee, I never got to meet any of MY GRAND-PARENTS because they all died before I was born! Might have had something to do with living under the conditions of the Robber Barons and were subjected to a very low standard of living!! I've been a life long Democrat myself, but I'm NOT going to let the likes of Hillary AND all her money "spin" my head like Linda Blair!!!

I don't "get" your story about who your mother met, or how many people she met either, what does that have to do with supporting Hillary??? Some people weren't able to have that opportunity because maybe their husband was in the Army and the family was ordered to "move" every three years or so!

I KNOW that's what happened in MY family! I'm an Army brat and my father introduced me to politics when I was 11, so because of that I'm supposed to support Hillary??

I'm not going to go into THEIR extended stories either, but my parents are dead now... died at a relatively young age, and my father-in-law died too! CANCER you know?? But I DOUBT they would vote for HILLARY! They were Liberals but I guess they don't count!

Or was it a "woe is me post"

Thankfully , that point doesn't escape others...

And since we are getting out the dueling violins my father died when I was fourteen and left my mom and I with a $3,500.00 CD and a green 1972 Gran Torino that neither of us could drive...He had a massive heart attack when I was twelve and could no longer work...

Oh, and since we are discussing military records my dad was a Golden Gloves boxer with aspirations of going pro...His brother was the National Guard Champ and was a ranked pro until he lost his eye in the ring...He wore a glass one...My dad was drafted into WW 11 and got shrapnel in his eye and contacted malaria fighting in North Africa...He spent six months in Walter Reed Hospital and had several surgeries on his eye but they couldn't save the sight...They were able to save the eye "cosmetically"...When he was finally discharged he was a broken man...

He was a saint though...Despite having a ninth grade education he taught me to take care of myself, and to respect others regardless of their color or station in life...The most poignant story that stays with me to this day is thus...When we moved to Florida in 1970 my dad got a job working for Mackle Brothers... He instinctively gravitated toward the African Americans who worked there rather than the white workers...His first day on the job he sat down to have lunch with them... The African American guys told him not to because he would get shunned by the white workers... My dad didn't give a rip...

also!! He suffered a Myocardial Infarct at 50, had a stroke and then contracted cancer!

So "label" away, my post wasn't a "woe is me" post, it was simply a reply about differences in "life's experiences" and apparently I don't have as many "credits" to put behind my parents names, but THEY were SUPER and raised SIX daughters who ALL grew up to be "independent" hard working women!

I went to work as soon as I turned 14 simply to pay for any extras for myself! But, that WAS a plus for me, I learned early about LIFE and HARD WORK!! The Army "retired" my father after his heart attack and only wanted to pay him 50% and I road with him to Bremerton when he fought for his 100% pay! He reached the highest possible rank E-9 as an enlisted man, never wanting to be an Officer for reasons I won't explain here! And he always brought the men he supervised home for dinner, regardless of race which taught me a great deal about "civil rights" for all! I lived in the South when it ALL started, even if I didn't FULLY understand at the time! But I do remember a lot of Black/White issues and it STUNK!

If YOU want to define what I said to fit your definition, GO RIGHT AHEAD!

This is getting to the point of absurdity... You're the one who turned into a swearing match... The chronology is what it is....

Now, I have to go and work out...

Adios...

..for Hillary Clinton to imply she was piled on during a debate.

Your mother had it worse. Hillary Clinton never claimed otherwise.

Both were lifelong Democrats.

any lengths to riducle a candidate. I am a feminist and Clinton spoke the truth.

She is leading in the polls, what is she expecting. What does she expect if she has to face republicans. I will be so glad when the primaries are over, other wise we might loose the election on our own.

Clinton's enemies are as dumb as they are. It makes me happy.

So whats your point?

Wow. I wish I had met your mother. All the best to you and yours.

Molly called Hillary a skirt defender of the patriarchy. When Hillary said "I'm your girl," she was appealing to the males that see women in a subservient role. Hillary's defense that she was piled on ignores the fact that all front runners go through the same ringer, yet Hillary hides behind her gender by saying "treat me differently because I am a woman." You can't have it both ways. Equality means precisely that, get the same treatment as everyone else, particularly in the rough and tumble of politics. Piling on is what Gephardt did to Dean. Hillary has gotten nowhere near the same level of treatment that Dean got from the DLC types.

gender card? It was a man. A newscaster...The ad was what i call a throw away ad. Made for one purpse to poke fun at the other candidates who happen to be all men, repeating Hillary, Hillary.....I thought it was perfect...

Ben David

I would suggest you get your head out of the sand and you'll realize that although most of the cruder aspects are not there, women still have a long way to go before equality.I don't have the stats at hand but I read not too long ago about the huge gap still existing between men and women in the workplace particularly at senior levels.And that's not because of a lack of qualified candidates.I have female family members who are clearly kept in "second place" all other things being equal.The difference nowadays is that it's more subtle.By criticizing Hillary for stating the obvious you're not helping the cause.Just because women have fought for generations "to be percieved as equals" does'nt mean they've the war,there are still a lot of victims out there.And by the way I'm definitely not a Hillary Clinton fan!

:thumbsup:

I also find it disconcerting that HRC uses the terms "my husband" and "Bill" at seemingly every given opportunity. There's nothing independent nor feminist about this shameless namedropping behavior nor the concept of political royal families rotating in turnstile fashion into and out of OUR Country's Executive Branch. :(

I would love to hear all about your convoluted logic that can bash Hillary all the while bowing down to the OP for doing the very same exact thing.

:popcorn:

Not because of the op statements but because of some of responses.


I was brought up in the Lutheran Tradition....

Unfortunately my father elected to become a member of the Church of The Lutheran Confession (CLC) in the early 1960's.

At that point in time the CLC did not allow women to vote on any church matters; but a 13 year old male could vote as a member of the congregation.

Women were not allowed to teach; they were however allowed to teach culinary arts (e.g. how to cook a good dinner for their husband)

I personally reject this teaching....

I find it repulsive.

Kudos to the OP's mother....

She has displayed more courage than the Necon Nutbags ruining this country...

The OP's post was more than a little tasteless.

You spend an enormous amount of time attacking other candidates (and anyone who supports or defends them) in the most vicious and petty manner.

It seems that it would be much more productive for you to direct your considerable energies toward trying to convince people to vote FOR John Edwards, rather than AGAINST everyone else.

(Although you hardly ever mention Edwards in your posts, your avatar of Elizabeth, combined with the fact that he seems to be the ONLY candidate you don't trash leads me to assume that he is your candidate. Kind of hard to tell, though.)

that the OP -- much like Edwards now -- can offer little but an attack on the Front Runner. Although I think John is a bit too classy to start digging up dead relatives and throw them around to attempt to make a point.

This OP? Not so much.

the trash and name-calling of the Dem. candidates. Agree or disagree with positions, strategy, ethics, etc. But to out and out insult and degrade any of the candidates doesn't do anything but alienate those who would consider the insulter's candidate. Who does this poster support, BTW?

weLL pLayed.

I won't bother you with the details of women in 1944 - - you need to do your own homework and study up on your history before you use your poor mother as a piñata.

Your fake feminist pomp is not realistic. Like how did you know she was jeered at; how did you know the DA's wife didn't approve of him working with a woman; and how on earth do you know that your mother was piled on by men?

Oh - she told you?

You mean she actually talked about it as Hillary is doing?

Your OP is superficially deceptive, at best. But it can be added to your long long list of OPs bashing Hillary.

and more than a little sad. At some point, one begins to feel pity for the OP. I mean, isn't there something else she can spend her time doing? Something constructive to convince us her darlin' Edwards is the candidate to support? Something that doesn't make the OP an object of derision, rolled eyes and a sense of tedious patience on DU?

Oh wait ... the OP's candidate is now doing what the OP does. I guess if your issues don't fly with the American People, it's time to crank up the fog machine and start shoveling the b.s. Before you know it, Edwards will haul out his dead mother (or other deceased relative) and try and bash Hillary over the head with her (or them), too!

R-e-a-l classy.

Perhaps we can attribute it to not-so-quite desperation. But that's just so republican, isn't it?

you see the OP and just breeze on by knowing there won't be anything of substance, anything to further one's knowledge or to base an adult conversation on. Despite my natural sense of optimism and of giving people second chances, one just eventually learns not to waste one's time with this OP.

This is a bit over the top, you know.

listening to the male media too much.

Yes, I know that's out there. Yes, I know that Chris Matthews thinks that. But then he plays the supposed "statements" by Clinton that show that...only those statements don't show that at all. Not at all. One of his male guests even pointed that out (which was great, because for a minute there, I thought I was in surreal land, where everyone was looking at the sky and saying it was green, but I could clearly see that it was blue!). Chris just played the video of her statement again, and said, "See?" But the gender victim thing is just not there in that statement. He and some others are seeing something that maybe they want to see, but which is not there.

I was rooting for her to kick his a$$ to the curb. I wasn't crazy about her to begin with, but she lost me totally when she stayed with him after he humiliated her so.

Take a look at the current Republican candidates and their checkered marital histories. Jeez, Giuliani switches wives the way other men switch shoes. I can remember Limbaugh predicting that the Clinton's marriage would break up---he was practically licking his lips over it; it would have been a source of filthy material for him to this very day (with several busted marriages of his own, to his discredit).

I believe that most women (and men) who are in a marriage or relationship realize how tough it is to keep things together at times. And I believe they admire Hillary Clinton for keeping her marriage intact....