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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:55 PM
Original message
Poll question: Is it sexist to call a woman a witch?
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terrya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
1. Unless we're talking about Samantha Stevens from "Bewitched"...
the word "witch" does have a negative connotation.

*I* see it as sexist.
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
21. No Obama or Edwards supporter will vote Yes in this poll.
No matter what they really think.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. What about Glenda & Samantha. I know a lot of unabashed, 'out' witches.
BTW, over at a website not to be named (where tombstoned DU'ers go when they die) one poster called me a Crone.

I actually took it as a compliment.

As a sexist slur, witch has almost NO power.
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
2. No, it's sexist to ask. nt
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Joe the Revelator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
3. It Rhymes with a sexest word...
but it is not sexest. When did the email go out asking this to be the topic of the day?
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asthmaticeog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Sex, sexer, sexest?
:shrug:
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
4. you're asking the same group of people that think gays are whining about getting civil rights. nt.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #4
39. You're sounding like the sensitivity police again.
Lighten up.
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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #4
42. Good point.
In one of the groups, there's a post basically stating that demeaning depictions of women are demeaning to women, and damned if there aren't people arguing that demeaning depictions of women aren't demeaning at all.

You could probably start a poll asking if being sexist is sexist, and about half of DU would scratch their heads and dodge the question, kinda like that waterboarding question.
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ret5hd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
5. Is it sexist to call a man a warlock?
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. "Warlock" doesn't carry the same negativity as "witch" does
Edited on Sun Nov-04-07 02:59 PM by Lirwin2
And how many men have been discriminated against on the basis of their gender, on the level that women have?
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #5
29. Warlock means "oathbreaker" and can be VERY insulting...
doesn't carry a sexist connotation though.
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ret5hd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. Well, i was thinking more like THIS guy:
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. TV isn't reality, I'm a male Wiccan, the acceptable labels to use would be Witch or Wiccan...
Never Warlock, its a linguistic mistake by some people who saw a word that "looked cool" and co-opted it for their own purposes, without bothering looking up its proper Scottish meaning.
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ret5hd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. I think you should continue to take me seriously.
I wish you would.
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. I'm not talking about you, but the producers of shows like "BeWitched". n/t
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
8. Most of the witches I know are men.
and it's been a pretty even gender split in the Wiccan gatherings I've been to.

Gender aside, it's offensive to use it as an insult, period.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
9. well, uppity women thru history have been accused of being witches, but then
so were men, when they went against the grain of society.
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kdmorris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
10. Do you have nothing better to do than spam GD:P with polls all day?
Do you think that will win people over for Hilary Clinton or are you just trying to annoy the crap out of every body?
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. waaa. nt.
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kdmorris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. HAHA
That's rather amusing.
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. Cry me a river
Your candidate is homophobic and sexist.
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kdmorris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Pardon me??
How the hell do you have any idea who "my" candidate is? I've never stated that I had an opinion one way or another.

But it damn sure isn't Obama, who, as far as I can tell is the only homophobic person running on the ticket.

So, anytime someone responds to you about Hilary Clinton, they are automatically an Obama supporter? That's amazing and almost amusing.
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The Velveteen Ocelot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
12. Depends on the context.
Some women identify themselves as witches, in a positive way. And when I went out trick-or-treating as a witch, was I self-hatingly identifying with the oppressive male hegemony by my choice of an intrinsically sexist costume?
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sakabatou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. Yep, context
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undercoverduer Donating Member (344 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
13. Not if you put it into the context of Halloween and a costume party on SNL
Think about it.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. So it would have been OK to call Obama a "spook" as long as it was in the context of Halloween?
Okie dokie.
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. that analogy is dead on. nt.
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undercoverduer Donating Member (344 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #15
26. WOuld the spook have been a GOD DAMNED GHOST?
If so no problem. I have never seen a "SPOOK" as it relates to the racially insensitive term you want to use here be considered an acceptable costume. A Casper costumer would be fine. In all of the years of GOD DAMNED HALLOWEEN I have never seen a witch costume deemed politically incorrect.
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #26
45. She wasn't wearing a witch costume
She was wearing a bride costume, and was mistaken as a "witch." What was so offensive, was Barack Obama (APPEARING AS HIMSELF), joining in on sexist jokes like that.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:11 PM
Response to Original message
20. The Hypocrisy On This Board Is Fucking Appalling
When was the last time a man was referred to as a witch in the real world?
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Mojorabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. I am a witch
and hang with witches so it is pretty common in my real world.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. Respectfully
Edited on Sun Nov-04-07 03:31 PM by DemocratSinceBirth
Most Americans are not wiccans...

Go to you local Publix in Orlando, and call the meanest,baddest looking young woman you see a witch and see what happens...
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #28
36. "meanest, baddest, looking young woman"...
Actually, in a case like that, there is probably a 50/50 chance she really is a Witch, though it would probably be nicer to ASK her if she's one. Using your words as a description, I'm assuming you mean self-confident woman with a self-assured look about her. Granted I'm attracted to that, unlike most guys.

Chances are she's most likely a Wiccan, probably eclectic, though she could just as likely be a Cermonial, Eclectic Magician of sorts, a generic Witch, if you will, or of some other Pagan path. If you really want to get slapped in the face though, you should ask her if she has time for a "Great Rite" that night.
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dipsydoodle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
22. Depends
on whether or not she's made of wood.
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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
23. it is just wrong on so many levels.wrong wrong wrong..attempting slander is ineffective and immature
Edited on Sun Nov-04-07 03:16 PM by sam sarrha
if the persons behavior is not a response to your own abysmal behavior.. then they are expressing their own frustration and suffering.

because they lack the skillful means to become happy on their own.. they may have a chemical ballance...your own unskillful response to her suffering only makes the situation worse and perpetuates the suffering of 'Both of you'.


say a prayer for her to be happy,that has worked for me many times.. be helpful, maybe the only thing you can do is try not to make it worse.. and that is a good thing.

learn to meditate and it will quit bothering you.. and you will quit bothering them.. that is an extraordinary improvement for all involved
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
27. The term "witch" is encoded with sexism and misogyny...
I can't imagine how anyone could question that?:shrug:





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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:35 PM
Response to Original message
30. Unless its referring to their religion, or costume, yes...
Edited on Sun Nov-04-07 03:37 PM by Solon
There are no absolutes here, so the yes/no question is invalid.
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fenriswolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 03:57 PM
Response to Original message
35. is it sexist to call a man a bastard?
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #35
50. You missed that poll.
The answer, of course was no because we deserve it, apparently.

... but she's not a man-hater, of course.
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HockeyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
37. It's synonymous with calling her a BITCH
In fact the majority who call a particular woman a witch even state that witch rhymes with bitch.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 04:29 PM
Response to Original message
38. To me it's just being used instead of "bitch".
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
40. technically, the term "witch" is supposed to be genderless
so it would have to depend on the context and the intent.

here's one for you: is "looney" supposed to be derisive and insulting when used to refer to a left-leaning liberal?
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Tom Rinaldo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 04:59 PM
Response to Original message
41. Wiccan women - followers of a traditional nature based religion...
...self describe as witches much the same as a minister in a Christian Church might call him or herself a pastor. The meaning of the word "witch" was infused with very negative associations during the Inquisition in particular and led to more recent outrages against humanity such as the Salem Witch Trials.

I never use the word witch to refer to someone unless I am referring to a genuine Wicca practioner or am referring to a fictional figure such as "the wicked witch of the piece of fiction.

It really isn't a word that should be played around with. Sometimes it is fine sure, sometimes calling someone a "fag" is not taken as offensive in context either, but fag too has roots in the Inquisition.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 06:05 PM
Response to Original message
43. unless she's a neopagan or tradtionalist who uses the term, it's simply incorrect
:shrug:
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rufus dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 06:05 PM
Response to Original message
44. is it sexist to call Cheney Dick? n/t
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
46. No
It's better than "bitch."

I just can't get all excited about it. It's sexist to claim a woman can't do certain things or claim to be able to say she wants certain things just on account of being a woman, and that's way worse than mere name-calling.
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
47. You left off..
...who the fuck cares?

The world is full of sexist language that targets men and women, compared to the real problems in the worlds you might as well complain about mildew.
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 08:10 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. Discimination against minorities isnt a "real problem"?
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. Not of the verbal variety....
.... no it isn't. People who get upset over stuff like that amaze me. And I'm damn sure not alone.

Clue for the overly sensitive on behalf of others mostly who don't give a damn crowd - find something real to get exercised about.

Want a list?

Our constitution is in shambles.

The middle east could break into chaos at any time.

The people who REALLY run our country want to pick a fight with Iran.

Our economy is months or at most a few years away from crumbling.

Our political system is so broken that, not just in the Republican party, the crap rises to the top and then we wonder why everything is so messed up.

And your concern is what MIGHT be sexist language depending on how you see it. Your a real rocket scientist.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-04-07 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. Yes, but discrimination against men isn't a real solution. n/t
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