Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Handy Guide to Obama being consistently against the Iraq War invasion

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:02 PM
Original message
Handy Guide to Obama being consistently against the Iraq War invasion
Edited on Fri Jan-18-08 02:06 PM by zulchzulu
There are attempts to marginalize Barack Obama's consistent position against the Iraq War invasion that keep popping up as talking points. Essentially, those points are flawed and lack an honest injection of using the full quotes that Obama made. Cherry-picking quotes can make what someone said completely be something else. This article will present what some say Obama said with the counterpoint showing what Obama actually said. When someone says his consistent position is a "fairy tale", ask yourself why that person has a history of being a liar and truth contortionist.

In 2002, Barack Obama gave his famous speech regarding how he did not support the Iraq War invasion. Here is a segment of that speech that shows his leadership to see what has exactly happened:

I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda.

I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars.

http://www.barackobama.com/2002/10/02/remarks_of_illinois_state_sen.php


In July of 2004, Obama stated his position on the Iraq War in the New York Times:

"I'm not privy to Senate intelligence reports. ... 'What would I have done? I don't know. What I know is that from my vantage point the case was not made."
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9407E2DF153DF935A15754C0A9629C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2


Oddly, the Clintons and others have painted Obama as not being sure how he would have voted by slicing integral parts of his statement by using the ruse:

"What would I have done? I don't know."

I'm sure they think they are clever with editing out key parts of Obama's statement, but it is clearly dishonest and manipulative.

In July of 2004, Obama stated his consistent position on the Iraq War in the Chicago Tribune:

"There's not that much difference between my position and George Bush's position at this stage. The difference, in my mind, is who's in a position to execute."

(snip)

"How do you stabilize a country that is made up of three different religious and in some cases ethnic groups, with minimal loss of life and minimum burden to the taxpayers?" Obama said. "I am skeptical that the Bush administration, given baggage from the past three years, not just on Iraq. . . . I don't see them having the credibility to be able to execute. I mean, you have to have a new administration to execute what the Bush administration acknowledges has to happen."

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:rNt7Xamx0oYJ:www.chicagotribune.com/news/specials/elections/chi-0407270351jul27,1,1339453.story?coll=chi-electionsprint-hed+%22said+he+believes+the+Bush+administration+has+lost+too+much+credibility+in+the+world+comm


Again, the Clintons and others on a mission to distort Obama's position on the Iraq War simply shave off the critical points he made by saying:
"There's not that much difference between my position and George Bush's position at this stage."

Media Matters, which goes into how Tim Russert and the Clintons have misrepresented Obama's position by slicing off critical points in his statements on the Iraq War, points out how Obama told Wolf Blitzer his consistent position against the Iraq War:

On July 24, 2004, interview on CNN's Late Edition with Wolf Blitzer, Obama said that while he "didn't have the information that was available to senators," he would have voted against the Iraq war authorization:

BLITZER: Had you been in the Senate when they had a vote on whether to give the president the authority to go to war, how would you have voted?

OBAMA: You know, I didn't have the information that was available to senators. I know that, as somebody who was thinking about a U.S. Senate race, I think it was a mistake, and I think I would have voted no.

BLITZER: You would have voted no at the time?

OBAMA: That's correct.

BLITZER: Kerry, of course, and Edwards both voted yes.

OBAMA: But keep in mind, I think this is a tough question and a tough call. What I do think is that if you're going to make these tough calls, you have to do so in a transparent way, in an honest way, talk to the American people, trust their judgment.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200711110004?f=i_related


When it comes to funding for the troops who now are in harm's way in Iraq due to those who voted for the Iraq War Resolution, which Senator Byrd called a "free pass" for Bush to invade Iraq, Obama has made statements which back up his consistent claim:

"I have been very clear even as a candidate that, once we were in, that we were going to have some responsibility to make it work as best we could, and more importantly that our troops had the best resources they needed to get home safely," Obama, an Illinois Democrat, told reporters in a conference call. "So I don't think there is any contradiction there."

(snip)

"When I was asked, 'Would I have voted for the $87 billion,' I said 'no,' " Obama said in a speech before a Democratic community group in suburban Chicago in November 2003. "I said 'no' unequivocally because, at a certain point, we have to say no to George Bush. If we keep on getting steamrolled, we're not going to stand a chance."

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/03/22/obama_defends_votes_in_favor_of_iraq_funding/


More information on Barack Obama's stance and positions on the Iraq War can be viewed here:
http://action.barackobama.com/page/content/iraq/

If you want to see Obama's position on the Iraq War in 2002, there are a couple video links.

Interview:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXzmXy226po

Segment of 2002 speech:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUV69LZbCNQ

For the full speech in 2002 in text version:
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Barack_Obama's_Iraq_Speech









Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. Another Smoke and Mirrors tale from Zulu!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dawgs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Do you care to explain why?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Zulu has NO credibility...he's been caught in too many LIES!
But he fits right in with Chicago Barry's paradigm!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. Thanks for kicking. Now you can explain where the links are not correct
You are out of ammo.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. You never had any ammo...just like the faked video you posted yesterday as your own..
take a hike!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. You don't think I could do that video?
That shows just how good I am. You need the native Flash file? The ProTools files?

Is this over your little head?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. If you did it, you'd claim it... you didn't..but you took credit for it..
same ole, same ole... from zooch!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. I should thank you
Thinking that I took credit for a video that I did and somehow thinking that I couldn't be capable of producing such a video is actually a complement coming from you.

Tell me what you liked about it. Ask me anything. Oh heck. Here's how it was done.

I started off with the text for the music soundtrack. Then I recorded the tracks in ProTools (I have a ProTools studio). I found the Presidential "Hail To The Chief" theme as well as "Taps" and integrated those tracks with some effects and added some synthesizer tracks (I have 5 keyboards and other instruments) and then my voice, which I applied some filters to.

Then the soundtrack was brought into Flash, where I painstakingly synced the text to the soundtrack "points" after add ing Reagan quote (The bombing in 5 minutes) at the beginning. Once that was done and tweaked, I made it a Flash file and have that online (www.awolcowboy.com/reagan) with an MP3 audio of the song.

Then I exported the Flash file as an MP4 file to upload to YouTube. I have several other animations online as well using the similar production sequence.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. mutter, sputter, mutter, sputter... thats all you ever post...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Hehehe
Out of ammo again, I see...

:rofl:

Have a good weekend.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
gmudem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-19-08 02:02 AM
Response to Reply #18
24. I have to say
You pretty much owned tellurian there. Well done sir. :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JeffR Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-19-08 03:25 AM
Response to Reply #16
27. Kick ass, zulch!
I don't know who Ignored is in this sub-thread, but s/he sounds like a dick.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. You expect an "honest" explanation from... ah, nevermind...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
semndem Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #1
23. If you can prove
that his links are wrong and don't support Baracks statements, I'm perfectly willing to look at them. Hillary has been sound biting what Barack and Edwards both say by the way. The whole Reagan thing is sound bited. How nice and fair is that?!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-19-08 07:13 AM
Response to Reply #23
28. Welcome to DU!
Enjoy the beverages down the hall. Flak jackets are in the armor room.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-21-08 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #1
33. Zulu BUSTER: 7/24/07 Obama told Chicago Tribune his position on the war not much different than Bush
Edited on Mon Jan-21-08 10:43 AM by avaistheone1
In 2004, Sen. Obama said he didn’t know how he would have voted on the Iraq War resolution.
‘When asked about Senators Kerry and Edwards' votes on the Iraq war, Obama said, "I'm not privy to Senate intelligence reports,’ Mr. Obama said. ‘What would I have done? I don't know. What I know is that from my vantage point the case was not made.’
In 2004, Sen. Obama also said there was little difference between his position and George Bush’s position on Iraq -

In a meeting with Chicago Tribune reporters at the Democratic National Convention, Obama said, "On Iraq, on paper, there's not as much difference, I think, between the Bush administration and a Kerry administration as there would have been a year ago. <...> There's not much of a difference between my position and George Bush's position at this stage." (Chicago Tribune, 07/27/04)

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/1/11/22132/7237/851/435436




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
arewenotdemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:05 PM
Response to Original message
2. excellent! thanks, zz!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dawgs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:05 PM
Response to Original message
3. Great post!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DJ13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:07 PM
Response to Original message
6. Get Real!
We know that Hillary and Edwards votes for Bush to go to war are unimportant now that Obama has said he wanted to be a Reagan while he was growing up.

Get your priorities straight!
:sarcasm:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:07 PM
Response to Original message
7. Actions speak louder than words.
Has he voted for or against the add-ons to the original $87 billion?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TwilightGardener Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
9. Good stuff! Here's how Hillary explains her support for the invasion:
"It's all Bush's and Chuck Hagel's fault".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
11. I guess the more he sounds like republicans, the more this will be hammered on.
Fair enough.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:14 PM
Response to Original message
13. the actual words spoken...
Edited on Fri Jan-18-08 02:21 PM by stillcool47
are not nearly as important as the interpretations posted here by many. Isn't it funny? So much for a 'reality based community'.
thanks for all the links. I'm sure they will come in handy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
19. Thanks, Z.
I was just reading an ad by Ron Paul in our local community rag that claims Hillary and Obama voted to go to war and that Obama coauthored the Patriot Act.

I know our boy is gifted and has skills but, damn, he wasn't even in the Senate when that sh*t went down.

The truth is out there if people are inclined to consider it. Thanks for making that endeavor a little easier. Others are welcome to believe the fairy tale de jour propagated by detractors.

To the Greatest Page. ;)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Thank you AK
The truth is like a hammer. I think I have a few in my basement as backup.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
21. Why did you skip his voting with Clinton on EVERY IRAQ WAR BILL since he enterd the Senate?
To his credit, he didn't vote Present, even though he skipped out on many votes.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-18-08 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. Do you have a list of votes on the Iraq War funding that he missed?
OK. So people are saying he "voted exactly the same" as Hillary Clinton, yet you are alluding to the "fact" that he never voted?

Put down the pipe.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ArkySue Donating Member (647 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-19-08 03:19 AM
Response to Original message
25. OK, so what's he doing about it?
He's continually voted to continue funding the Iraq war.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-19-08 03:23 AM
Response to Original message
26. Why does he try to defend his comments instead of challenging the quesiton? HERE:
It's not just once, it's three times, in this exchange. He doesn't clarify or challenge Russert on the quotes, he tries to excuse them as political-based maneuvering.

--------------------------
MR. RUSSERT: You were not in the Senate in October of 2002. You did give a speech opposing the war. But Senator Clinton’s campaign will say since you’ve been a senator there’s been no difference in your record. And other critics will say that you’ve not been a leader against the war, and they point to this: In July of ‘04, Barack Obama, “I’m not privy to Senate intelligence reports. What would I have done? I don’t know,” in terms of how you would have voted on the war. And then this: “There’s not much of a difference between my position on Iraq and George Bush’s position at this stage.” That was July of ‘04. And this: “I think” there’s “some room for disagreement in that initial decision to vote for authorization of the war.” It doesn’t seem that you are firmly wedded against the war, and that you left some wiggle room that, if you had been in the Senate, you may have voted for it.

SEN. OBAMA: Now, Tim, that first quote was made with an interview with a guy named Tim Russert on MEET THE PRESS during the convention when we had a nominee for the presidency and a vice president, both of whom had voted for the war. And so it, it probably was the wrong time for me to be making a strong case against our party’s nominees’ decisions when it came to Iraq.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. Again, look at the point of my post
The issue is precisely what Russert and others have done to cherry-pick the quotes to distort his record.

Perhaps Obama could have answered the question by throwing Russert's tricks back at him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
30. needed now....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-21-08 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. Kick to counter Hillary's continued distortion of Obama's record n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 08:12 PM
Response to Original message
31. Thanks, ZZ..I know Obama
was against the misbegotten War ON Iraq from the beginning ..that's why I like him. And why I don't like hillary.

That was the beginning of why I don't like hillary but the way she and her ass of a spouse have degraded themselves further than I thought possible, in retrospect..and her surrogates on DU have consistently undermined her campaign with feeble attacks and blatant lies..I know those thoughts I had about hilary in 2002 were dead on.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu May 16th 2024, 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC