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DaLittle Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:13 AM
Original message
Why Barack Obama Lied Last Night in South Carolina......

From Daily Kos... http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/1/22/277/50113/463/440933

Story Updated.
Daily Kos
Why Barack Obama Lied Tonight in South Carolina Hotlist
by Shipjack
Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 12:24:01 AM PST

Barack Obama Lied Tonight

Perhaps this is a good thing. Perhaps this is a 'teaching moment'.

Obama did not tell the truth about a KEY ISSUE, predatory lending, at a time when the economy is crashing due in large part to this very fact. This is unacceptable. Barack Obama challenges other candidates on their votes. I have actually heard them apologize. However, I haven't heard a lie like this in a while.. told with such a straight face.

For that reason, I'm coming down HARD on Barack Obama. You will scream 'hit'! But, if Obama just distanced himself, 'no comment', or apologized... no hit. He didn't distance himself or apologize, like he forces upon others. No. Instead, he lied straight. Unacceptable. I often write on banking and bank-influence issues. I know that Barack Obama does not come as advertised. I've known that for a while. I just never thought he'd be so completely disingenuous about the truth of his own actions.

* Shipjack's diary :: ::
*

Obama Supported the Bank's Effort to Kill the Usury Law

TONIGHT, at the Democratic Debate in South Carolina, Obama said he voted against the 30% usury amendment because 30% was 'too high'. This implies that he supported consumers. This drew cat-calls (some knew). Obama would have you believe he wanted a federal cap, just much lower, yet he voted against the only cap offered. He killed the cap, which is exactly what his bank donors wanted. Now, banks can charge upward of 30-100% plus. But, why did he lie about it so boldly tonight?

Did Barack Obama Make the Bankers Laugh Tonight?

Yes. There were a few bankers who likely laughed out loud at Obama's comments. While the economy crashes because of banking practice, I don't want bankers laughing out-loud with one of our leading 'progressive' candidates. This is cause for deep concern and commentary. Even the usually non-interruptive Edwards couldn't sit still and absorb the comment. I couldn't either. Let's see why...

I'm jumping straight to the Colbert 'nut meat'...

Most were minor technical matters, but he also opposed an important amendment, which was defeated, that would have capped credit-card interest rates at 30 percent. "He studied the issue," Williams said. "Some assumed he would just go along with consumer advocates, but he voted with us on several points. He understood the issue. He wasn’t closed-minded. A lot of people found that very refreshing."

http://www.harpers.org/...

This is a DIRECT quote. Williams knows Barack Obama well. They have a long history as you will see. Williams asserts and supports the fact that Obama did NOT 'go along with consumer advocates' and it was refreshing. Tonight, Obama said he was such a big consumer advocate he had to vote against a cap because it wasn't low enough. Now, no cap at all. Besides the humor of that statement, it is false. This is first-person testimony and there's more..It's also over a year old and far removed from this debate tonight. It's from the Bond Market Association's VP for legislative affairs. We all know what that means. Next...

Williams says 'a lot of people' found Obama's position 'refreshing'. A lot of people means bankers. I don't like that bankers find a progressive Democrat 'so refreshing'. Not now especially.

I don't know what's more disconcerting.

1. Barack Obama helped kill a key consumer amendment on a bill he knew would pass, thus helping 'clean it' for his banking friends. Then, knowing the overall bill would pass without the need to give two 'yes' votes, he votes against the overall bill to preserve the bridging. A vote for the banks on their key amendment, and a follow-up "no", already knowing the bill would pass. This is pure politics...the Potomac two-step.

or..

2. That Obama disclaimed tonight, completely, the truth that he helped kill the consumer amendment on behalf of his banking friends. Obama's half-baked excuse should have been your first gut-instinct and glimpse into the real truth.

Let's jump back to the same Harpers article written long before tonight.

First rule in politics, follow the money... So, who was this 'Bond Market' fellow quoted above and how well does he know Obama? Same article...

Mike Williams, vice president for legislative affairs at The Bond Market Association and a member of an African-American lobbying association, had been following the race in Illinois and was introduced to Obama through acquaintances in Washington who had known him at Harvard Law School. "We represent Wall Street firms," Williams said in recounting his first conversation with Obama. "A big issue for us since 2000 is predatory lending. He worked on that issue in Illinois; he was the lead sponsor of a bill there. I talked to him about that. He had a different position from ours. There’s a perception out there that the Democrats are anti-business, and I talked to him about that directly. I said, There’s a perception that you’re coming at this from the angle of consumers. He was forthright, which I appreciated. He said, I tried to broker the best deal I could." Williams still had his differences with Obama, but the conversation convinced him that the two could work together. "He’s not a political novice and he’s smart enough not to say things cast in stone, but you can have a conversation with him," Williams said. "He’s a straight shooter. As a lobbyist, that’s something you value. You don’t need a yes every time, but you want to be able to count the votes. That’s what we do."

This is the early Illinois days, 2000. So, what does Williams do for Obama?

Williams subsequently set up a conference call between Obama and a group of financial-industry lobbyists. That, too, went well, and in June of 2004, Williams helped organize "a little fund-raiser" for Obama at The Bond Market Association. "It wasn’t just the financial community. There was a broad cross-section," he said of the 200 or so people who turned out. "There was overwhelming support, not just people from associations giving $2,000 but from individuals who just wanted to meet him, giving smaller contributions."

The Bond Association fundraiser grows...

Robert Harmala, also a big player in Democratic circles and a colleague of Quinn’s at Venable, attended the association’s event as well. He had been invited by Larry Duncan—an African-American lobbyist for Lockheed Martin, a Venable client—who helped Williams organize the affair. Harmala liked what he saw and continued to be impressed by Obama. "There’s a reasonableness about him," he said. "I don’t see him as being on the liberal fringe. He’s not going to be a parrot for the party line."

Obama shows early promise...

In one of his earliest votes, Obama joined a bloc of mostly conservative and moderate Senate Democrats who helped pass a G.O.P.-driven class-action "reform" bill. The bill had been long sought by a coalition of business groups and was lobbied for aggressively by financial firms, which constitute Obama’s second biggest single bloc of donors.

Williams, of the bond market, declares Obama has character, because...

Although The Bond Market Association didn’t lobby directly on the legislation, Williams took note of Obama’s vote. "He’s a Democrat, and some people thought he’d do whatever the trial lawyers wanted, but he didn’t do that," he said. "That’s a testament to his character."

Then, the story goes full circle to the present and the vote helping banks avoid a 30% interest ceiling nationwide. Back to the nutmeat and Williams' (Bond Market Association) pleasure with Obama's vote on the 30% cap restrictions on banks. For those of you that don't understand interest caps, this means that banks can charge anything now, 40%, 60%, 100%. On PBS' Bill Moyer show last Friday, his guest offered evidence of banks and payday lenders charging upwards of 100% interest to the poorest of the poor. So, let's not mix facts or make allegations that this amendment would not have helped people in credit trouble. Usury rates far above 30% are widely sourced and available online. The Congress had an amendment to cap the top rate at 30%. This was a start. It was less than 100% and less that 50%. Obama voted with the banks and helped kill the amendment.

Thanks twice, Barack.
Once for the vote and once for the story tonight.

I urge everyone to read the article written over a year ago, long before Obama's statement tonight and somewhat removed in time, for added perspective. This year-old article was not created to hit Obama's statement at the debate tonight. Obama hit himself by contesting what his closest donors are saying, in direct quotes. I knew it the moment Obama said it. I simply put the two together and presented it. I'm just the messenger. I believe Obama 'hit' himself.

Barack Obama Inc.
The birth of a Washington machine
BY Ken Silverstein
PUBLISHED November 2006

http://www.harpers.org/...

Update: To be honest, I'm fairly depressed that this happened in South Carolina on this night for plenty of reasons. Really. He could win the nomination. If he wins, I only want him to win under truth-in-advertising principals to Democrats and Progressives. I also hope his supporters challenge him, making him a better candidate, rather than spreading banking propaganda to support their candiate Talk about ends justifying banking means. In the meanwhile, I'll support real progressives who actually run on it and appear to be more honest about their past mistakes.

Update II:Credit card companies do not have to follow state law caps on credit cards outside their base state. That's was the entire RATIONALE of this amendment. Many of you are unaware of that quoting state caps. This is false logic. Read this. The banks always win. Don't help by spreading misinformation about successful state caps on credit cards.

http://www.bankrate.com/...

Tags: Barack Obama, predatory lending, 30%, credit cards, John Edwards, Hillary Clinton, recommended (all tags) :: Previous Tag Versions

Permalink | 235 comments | Post A Comment | Autorefresh
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Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:23 AM
Response to Original message
1. Obama is NOT who people think he is
Finally some daylight is being shone on Obama. Maybe his supporters will realize he is NOT the "progressive" they think he is. This is exactly why Obama talks about things like "change" and "hope" and a lot of other nebulous stuff that contains nothing specific. Then, he screams foul when attacked to divert attention when he's caught.
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JackORoses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. Hillary IS who everybody thinks she is. A Manipulative Liar and so much more
What do you make of that, piGman?
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
2. B.S. Slime. Guess we'd rather have a board member of WalMart?
Wake up and smell the Dirty Tricks. :grr:
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. Wake up and smell your dirty candidate.
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Andy823 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #2
15. Last night
Obama stood on stage and said how "important" it was to be honest in this race. Then he proceeded to prove that he was "not" being honest! What should this tell you?

You can't attack everyone else and expect a "free ride". Obama's days of the "free ride" may be over. It may not make much difference to the loyalist Obama followers, but it will to the rest of America. If he did win the nomination, all of these things, and more, will be brought out by the republicans, and it will be a disaster! :nuke:

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Inuca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
3. If we are quoting DKos
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dkf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:27 AM
Response to Original message
4. Also from DKos, 30% cap feared to overrule lower % state usury laws.
"While reasonable sounding, 19 Democrats voted against this amendment; we will be charitable and assume the amendment was poorly written. There was some concern that the amendment would supercede any State usury laws. Sen. Kerry was among those voting against it."

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/3/6/63144/06015

Dems voting against:

Alexander (R-TN)
Baucus (D-MT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carper (D-DE)
Durbin (D-IL)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Obama (D-IL)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Wyden (D-OR)
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Kerry will fill you in on this if you ask him
I don't think the whole story is being given here!
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. Leahy voted against it, too, I see nt
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #8
23. Leahy also voted for the bankruptcy bill in 2001 but Obamites NEVER mentioned Leahy's vote on that
Edited on Tue Jan-22-08 01:57 PM by jackson_dem
Oh, and he also voted for the Patriot Act. Obamites never mention that either when swiftboating Edwards and/or Hillary.
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Andy823 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #4
16. So let's see now
It's all "OK" because these other people voted the same way? I don't think so. My senator is in there, and she is a big time "corporate" supporter! Face it, he is not different than the other "corporate" puppets in D.C.!
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dkf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. Looks to me like there were two groups of people opposing the bill
1st were the people who don't want a cap on predatory lending

2nd group was afraid protections are already there would be lessened.

Obama and Kerry were part of the second group. I'm guessing Leahy too cuz he seems an upstanding guy.

I don't know what your senator's arguments were.
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Andy823 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. And you know
Obama was in the "second" group because?
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #4
25. That's baloney
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4155217&mesg_id=4156427

Those 19 Dems were sell-outs to the credit card company, pure & simple. As was Obama
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kurth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:35 AM
Response to Original message
5. Obama has been given a pass for too long
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GalleryGod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. So has Bret Favre.......
*





*from my personal collection
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Andy823 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
21. Yep
But those days may be over. I think after last nights little one on one with Clinton, things may be about to change. I think Hillary is going to start being a lot tougher after the remarks that were made.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 08:56 AM
Response to Original message
7. psst -- obama -- your halo is slipping.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 09:17 AM
Response to Original message
9. I am happy to see this..
Edited on Tue Jan-22-08 09:18 AM by indimuse
finally get the exposure it deserves! Obama is NOT what he and the MSM have described him to be.."honest"...time for DU fans to come to terms with it.:)
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GalleryGod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
11. Wasting posting space again...Cut N Pasters everywhere.
Try writing on your own...form your own words and conclusions, come to this fight with your own original ideas...that is what DU has been about for the past 7 years...Cut N Pasting a supportive news service or blog is, quite frankly, sum and substance of FreeRepublic NOT DU.



You can SMEAR him,too, after he endorses Obama
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Andy823 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #11
17. It's seems that it's always
A "waste of space" when someone posts about the "other" side of Obama. We need to know everything about him "before" he wins the nomination and the republicans tear him apart. Do you want to vote for someone who can take back the whitehouse, or vote for someone that has a past that will insure a republican win in November?
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
13. BS, Senator Clinton
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GalleryGod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Clintons must have one heckuva garden in upstate N.Y.
with ALL the bullshiite they truck in to the Primaries.

BC, "I'm not making this up"

Yes you are, congenital liar.
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dkf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
19. In summary, I can see why people concerned about predatory lending could vote for or against this
bill.

The first group is ok if some state protections were lifted and all states cap at 30%. This would mean a possible rate increase for some people and reductions to 30% for some (are people really paying over 30%?)

Others did not want to jeopardize state protections for a 30% cap. This would keep things status quo.

Hillary was in the first group...Obama was in the second.

Seems there is no right or wrong answer for progressives here.
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. That's not what the amendment said
The amendment specifically protected state laws from pre-emption if they had caps lower than 30%.
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lisainmilo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
22. WHAT DID OBAMA ACTUALLY SAY IN RGJ INTERVIEW?
Obama said "The republicans were the party of ideas for a pretty long chunk of time ther over the last 10-15 years, in the sense they challenging convention wisdom ". There is NO mistaking that this was a positive and uplifting remark for THE REPUBLICAN PARTY! The trajecteory statement is just before this statement.

Here is the interview:http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080115/VIDEO/80115026

At about 17:30 minutes into this interview to about 22:00 minutes.

He is not the man I thought he was AT ALL!

This time Clinton got it right!
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