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Mr_King Donating Member (354 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 04:35 AM
Original message
Any word on who Jimmy Carter is supporting?
President Carter's name has been absent in the discussion around here and in the media. Anybody heard anything about who he supports since Georgia is a Super Tuesday state?
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lurky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 04:49 AM
Response to Original message
1. He wanted Gore to run.
But he hasn't endorsed.
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ngant17 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:21 AM
Response to Original message
2. I'd have to guess Obama
but Georgia will have a strong Obama lead with or without a Carter endorsement, it should be similar to SC results, or more. Demographics are similar to SC, I think.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:34 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. But I thought demographics had nothing to do with SC's outcome?
Keep your talking points straights Obamites. :P On a serious note, enjoy the win. He will get momentum out of it and your candidate winning a primary is a great feeling (or so I am told :( ).
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:32 AM
Response to Original message
3. Why not his wife? She is more qualified than Hillary, and less divisive.
Why not?

Bill is pushing his wife, and we could have an open convention.

If one ex-President is going to push his wife for the nomination, why shouldn't the other do the same?
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:33 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. When did Rosalynn serve in the Senate?
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:34 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. When did Hillary attend cabinet meetings? n/t
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:35 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. dunno
But you think that's more experience than Hillary Clinton has? How stupid.
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:38 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Stupid is as stupid does, and voting for the IWR was at best stupid.
Edited on Sun Jan-27-08 05:39 AM by Hart2008
Maybe if Hillary had attended the cabinet meetings should might have gotten the IWR vote right.

:dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce:
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:39 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. That's not the issue we're discussing
the issue is whether Rosalynn Carter has more experience than Hillary Clinton.

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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:43 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. So then how much experience does Hillary have with the workings of the Pres's cabinet?
Or are you simply saying that Hillary has bad judgment?

:popcorn:
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:47 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. I don't know if she attended cabinet meetings at all
she might have - I don't know.

But if you think attending cabinet meetings is experience, you're just wrong. Cabinet meetings are highly-formalized monthly meetings where little gets done.

Both Mrs. Carter and Mrs. Clinton were involved in policy in their husband's administrations - except Mrs. Clinton did it twice as long as Mrs. Carter. Then she got elected to the Senate twice.

So the claim that attending cabinet meetings gives her more experience is just stupid. Why not just admit you made a dumb, hyperbolic claim rather than try to defend it?
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:55 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. So the answer is that you don't know. Maybe you should look it up!
Considering that the Senate, and Hillary Clinton in particular, screwed up royally by delegating the Constitutional power to declare war to a lying tyrant, there is nothing impressive about that record.

Historically, Presidents are seldom elected from the Senate.

You can look that up too!

:hi:
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:57 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. It doesn't matter
attendng cabinet meetings as an observer doesn't even begin to equal, much less surpass, Clinton's experience.

You're being stubborn. You made a stupid claim, and I can see you intend to stick with it come hell or high water. Oh well, that's nothing new on DU.
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:30 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. Rosalynn Carter did more than attend cabinet meetings as an observer.
Since you posted the same inaccuracies below, I will address them there.
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:45 AM
Response to Reply #3
14. Now, that's just silly
Hillary's a US Senator.
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:49 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Who never attended a cabinet meeting and got the most important vote of her career, the IWR, wrong!
The needless death and destruction of Bush's Iraq policy is not silly.

You mock those who have lost limbs or made the ultimate sacrifice for their county.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:51 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. How do you know she never attended a cabinet meeting?
And as explained above, cabinet meetings are ultimately unimportant.

Why not just make your complaints against Clinton without making stupid statements about Carter's experience vs. Clinton's?
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:57 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. Saying Rosalynn Carter has more experience than Clinton is silly
Edited on Sun Jan-27-08 05:58 AM by tammywammy
"Why not his wife? She is more qualified than Hillary, and less divisive.

Why not?

Bill is pushing his wife, and we could have an open convention.

If one ex-President is going to push his wife for the nomination, why shouldn't the other do the same?"

That's what you said. Nothing about IWR, etc.

And I expect an apology for this saying this, "You mock those who have lost limbs or made the ultimate sacrifice for their county."

And look I'm not a Hillary support by any stretch of imagination. But seriously, that's a ridiculous comparison. Hillary is a US Senator.

edited to add: If you have a problem with Clinton then make it, but don't expect to make stupid arguments and not to be called on it.
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. The Senate is full of pork barrel politicians. Sitting in the Senate is not executive experience.
Edited on Sun Jan-27-08 06:11 AM by Hart2008
By your argument Rick Santorum would be qualified to be President.

Being a Senator, in and of itself, does not equate to executive experience. The American public has recognized this time after time and rarely elects people directly from the U.S. Senate to the White House. Our distinguished group of Senators gave us the IWR. It shows how little their judgment should be trusted. So don't throw that "She's a Senator" stuff around like we should be impressed by the title. The respect comes from, What has she done with the office?

She played politics with war and peace and now young men and women are coming back in caskets.

My point was that Rosalynn Carter was more involved in the workings of the President's cabinet, the heart of the Executive Branch of government, than Hillary.

My second point is that she is less divisive, and no one is challenging me on that.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:13 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. She's 81 years old
she worked as an accountant in a peanut operation.

Hillary Clinton was very involved in policy in her husband's administration. Attending cabinet meetings, which are bureaucratic check-ins, doesn't compare to Clinton's experience.

Again, make your complaints against Clinton without making stupid comparisons. It diminishes any point you're actually trying to make.
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:39 AM
Response to Reply #22
25. self delete-misplaced!
Edited on Sun Jan-27-08 06:46 AM by Hart2008
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:48 AM
Response to Reply #22
28. Ageist! Your ignorance is showing again. She did a hell of a lot more than manage a peanut farm!
Rosalynn Carter was a political activist First Lady who publicly disclosed the fact that the President consulted her and sought her advice on his domestic and foreign affairs decisions, speeches and appointments. Traveling the nation at length, Rosalynn Carter also served as a liaison of current information between the President and the American public she encountered, providing him with reaction to Administration policy from the citizenry and providing them with explanations of that policy. A consequence of this was her unprecedented attendance at Cabinet meetings where she heard policy discussion first-hand and took notes on issues that she would subsequently carry to the public. She and the President maintained a Wednesday business lunch in the Oval Office to discuss Administration policy on issues that she had taken on as a spokesperson or on legislative matters of concern to her. She was also not averse to disagreeing with the President's final decisions; most often her bone of contention was that Carter did not make decisions or announcements with a sense of timing that always served the Administration's political purposes including issues such as New York City budget cuts, the Panama Canal treaties, and Middle East negotiations.

Rosalynn Carter was the first First Lady to maintain her office in the East Wing, the traditional office space reserved for the social, correspondence, scheduling and projects staff of the presidential spouse. She would often walk outside the mansion to avoid tourists going through the White House, carrying her briefcase with her. Frequently, the First Lady worked directly with Cabinet members, including the Secretary of Housing and Urban Development Patricia Harris and Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare Joseph Califano. In 1979, during her tenure, the federal government more formally recognized the role of First Lady as a bona fide federal position, albeit undefined by the U.S. Constitution, when automatic congressional appropriation was enacted for a staff for the First Lady on the premise that the "spouse assists the president" in fulfilling his duties.

Rosalynn Carter assumed an active role in the Administration's response and initiative on behalf of several domestic and foreign issues. The largest and most important was her work as the Active Honorary Chair of the President's Commission on Mental Health, which began on February 17, 1977. The First Lady oversaw an advisory board of twenty commissioners composed of social workers, medical experts, lobbyists and psychiatrists who toured the nation, holding public hearings, consulting hundreds of community activists, doctors, legislators, and former mental health patients, while also developing thirty task forces, staffed by over 450 volunteers, concentrating on specialized issues and holding their conference gathering in the White House State Dining Room. The commission prepared recommendations in a final report, suggesting that a 1963 act be overhauled to strengthen community center services, erase state-federal overlaps and create changes to health insurance coverage, public housing, Medicaid and Medicare and state support for the most chronically mentally ill. There was also an advocacy recommendation for a bill of rights protecting the mentally ill from discrimination; such clauses were enacted within the federal bureaucracy immediately by presidential proclamation. After touring the National Institute of Mental Health, the First Lady was also able to initiate increases in federal grants to continue research which often lagged because the previous grants were short-term and too low.
...
In June of 1977, Rosalynn Carter undertook one of the most overtly political international missions ever assumed by a First Lady; she visited Jamaica, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Peru, Brazil, Colombia, and Venezuela as the President's personal representative, holding substantive meetings with Central and South American policy leaders on issues that included human rights, arms reduction, demilitarization, beef exports, pilot training, drug trafficking, nuclear energy and weaponry. After each day's talks, she filed a report with the U.S. State Department. At many of her meetings the First Lady spoke in Spanish, having just previously completed an intensive language course. Throughout the breaks of the "Camp David Accords," peace talks negotiated by the President between Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin and Egyptian president Anwar Sadat, Rosalynn Carter was present to provide support and advice as her husband asked of her. As a representative of the President, she attended the inaugurations of new Bolivian and Ecuadorian presidents, as well as the funeral of Pope Paul VI. The First Lady was also the American representative who greeted Pope John Paul II when he made his first visit to the U.S. in 1979. The First Lady frequently sat in on the daily National Security Council briefings held for the president and senior staff. In November of 1979, she learned the details of the Cambodian refugee crisis; starvation and extermination had killed almost half the population of Cambodia and millions of homeless refugees were flocking to the Thailand border to seek food and medicine in large camps set up for them. She flew to see the conditions for herself and successfully urged the United Nations creation of a world relief coordinator. Her influence further prompted the creation of the National Cambodian Crisis Committee and CambodianCrisis Center, which became the clearinghouse for all donated aid; she raised millions of dollars for the cause in the U.S. and got the president to increase U.S. quotas for refugees, permit food delivery directly into Cambodia and to accelerate Peace Corps efforts. With the November 4, 1979 taking of American hostages in Iran, the First Lady urged the President to immediately enact an oil embargo from that nation.


http://www.firstladies.org/biographies/firstladies.aspx?biography=40

It is a much more substantive list of achievements than raising money from corporations, testifying in front of grand juries, and misplacing documents.

Clinton's Senate experience is war mongering. It is not something to be proud.
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:23 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. Actually I would say Rick Santorum is qualified to run
I detest him and what he stands for, but he was a Senator for 12 years and a Representative for 4.

I agree with Monkey Funk "make your complaints against Clinton without making stupid comparisons. It diminishes any point you're actually trying to make."
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:42 AM
Response to Reply #23
26. Senators can shake the money tree and raise money, but is doesn't mean much.
Senator's don't win the Presidency much.

Comparing Hillary to Rosalynn Carter is not a stupid comparison.

Again, you are not disputing that Rosalynn Carter is a less divisive person.
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:46 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. Why would I dispute it
Edited on Sun Jan-27-08 06:48 AM by tammywammy
She is a less divisive person. She's 81 years old and hasn't been First Lady in over 20 years. The point is moot.

But Rosalynn Carter isn't more experienced than Hillary. You're making a stupid comparison. You don't like Hillary and you think she's a war monger. I get it. You'd be better off not making a silly comparison and just stating what you don't like about Hillary.
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. Rosalynn Carter's achievements as first lady are very substantial.
See the above listing of her accomplishments and how she changed the role of the First Lady.

But she wasn't raising money and misplacing documents.
She didn't write feel good books about the family's pets.

You can have your opinion, and I can have mine.

Her age isn't relevant.

She was the last truly great First Lady we had.

:patriot:
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 06:59 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. Yes she did have a lot of substantial achievements
and she's a wonderful woman. But to think she's more qualified than Clinton to be President is just pure idiocy.

You're not sincere in this argument - you're just fighting for the sake of fighting, and that's just dickish. So we're done.
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 07:07 AM
Response to Reply #30
31. "Dickish"? Calling people names is very childish, and a substitute for real debate. n/t
Edited on Sun Jan-27-08 07:08 AM by Hart2008
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GalleryGod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 07:31 AM
Response to Reply #19
34. Libby Dole,Nancy Pelosi, Maddy Albright,Boxer, Feinstein...
ALL are more qualified to be the 1st woman president than HRC...sorry.

Above available at "Uncle Ted's Buttons, Box 2008 ,Hyannis, Mass"
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #19
36. Sorry, but is too late for me to edit that.
I shouldn't have written that you were mocking people who died or lost limbs.

But I stand by my original point, which is that Rosalynn Carter is more experienced in the Executive Branch of the federal government, and that is not a stupid argument.

I'm sure her judgment is also better.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:32 AM
Response to Original message
4. He sang Edwards' praises at an event in Georgia
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Azathoth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:34 AM
Response to Original message
8. Carter is probably split between Obama and Edwards
Edited on Sun Jan-27-08 05:35 AM by Azathoth
And after tonight, I'm guessing he's leaning towards Obama.
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Tweed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:35 AM
Response to Original message
10. No, but in terms of GAs, the mayor of Atlanta is for Obama
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jasmine621 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 07:18 AM
Response to Original message
32. Actually, Carter really dislikes Clinton because of his adultry. nt
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Hart2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 07:24 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. Well the Carter's have morals...n/t
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GalleryGod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #32
35. That's been clear for years...
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ngant17 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #32
37. I think JC would withhold a judgement on Hillary
and I don't see him having any substantial problems with supporting Edwards, either.

But if he wanted to support a candidate based on purely on the pacifist ideas, Obama is the only real choice. The other two have put the military options ahead of the peace-based approach, which is counter to JC's style from what I know about the man.
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Mr_King Donating Member (354 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-27-08 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. The Clintons and the Carters...
have a very odd relationship to say the least.
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