*** ABC NEWS OFFICIALLY DEBUNKS KANTOR SMEAR ***

Just in case any of you are still unclear. The video was doctored by a yet unknown source who fabricated the racial epithets. And the charge that he said "shit" is completely false. He said they must be "shitting," referring to the goons in the White House.

As ABC reports below, it's the very definition of a DIRTY TRICK.

Full transcript below:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/official-transc.html


Official Transcript: Kantor Never Impugned Hoosiers
May 02, 2008 6:18 PM

Forgoing for a moment the dirty trick of the doctored clip from “The War Room,” which falsely had Mickey Kantor using a racial slur, the filmmaker behind the documentary has posted the clip on his Web site to clarify that other point of confusion -- what Kantor was referring to when he cursed. (An apparent source of confusion since the movie came out and some newspaper writers thought he was cursing Indianans. See previous post for that.)

Filmmakers Chris Hegedus and D A Pennebaker write: "We would like to respond to some erroneous statements made today about our film, THE WAR ROOM. These statements alleged certain remarks to Mickey Kantor that simply are not true. The transcript of the scene in question confirms this."

The official transcript:

GEORGE AND CARVILLE: Indiana, we're ahead.

JACQUELINE: Indiana!

GEORGE: Kentucky.

CARVILLE: Kentucky is five. Michigan is eleven, New York's done.

GEORGE: Holy s---, we're pulling away in Ohio.

CARVILLE: Oklahoma we're up.

GEORGE: Tied in Texas.

CARVILLE: Tied in Texas. It looks good. Now let's just say that. I like the text here.

GEORGE: Can you beep Wendy please? Looks pretty good. Looks pretty good.

MICKEY KANTOR: Look at Indiana. Wait, wait. Look at Indiana. Forty-two, forty. It doesn't matter if we win. Those people are s----ing (oh, excuse me) in the White House. How would you like to be... Look at Texas, go down to Texas.

CARVILLE: Even.

MICKEY: Yeah. Thirty-nine, thirty-nine.

CARVILLE: Perot's kind of holding, isn't he?

GEORGE: He held.

MICKEY: Yeah, he held. His numbers held. I'm sort of surprised, frankly.

***

So Kantor was NOT insulting Hoosiers, he was experiencing a moment of schadenfreude about the Bush (Sr.) White House.

Check it out HERE
.

Now back to that other question -- who did the fake clip with Kantor saying the N word?!

It's the definition of a dirty trick -- and from what I can tell all the YouTube links have disappeared. Fingerprints gone.

There are ALWAYS fingerprints

the bold is all his reporting.

I hope they catch the guy and sue him and take his house away from him.

If he has one.

I will tell him - his IT guys (or gals) should have told him this.

:hi:

oh wait....that IS his house! :D

If not, I don't know why you are talking based solely on a Youtube clip posted by an anonymous person, which was so obviously fake that was pulled from Youtube.

to Youtube has an address out there someplace....

I suspect they also have the emails from people who sent this bullshit to the media as well.

They were ahead in Indiana and Oklahoma? Clinton lost those two states by 6 and 8 points respectively.

Thank god it was ABC :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:

:eyes:

Pathetic. I feel a defamation lawsuit coming on. Do people think there are no consequences for this shit?

He should go after Drudge and DailyKos for starters.

he went postal on the radio today

...and I would eagerly take comp time off of work to pour through those records and make cross references and connections. It's what I get paid for.

What a FUCKING surprise. :grr:

There are quite a few here with egg (or something worse) on their face.

Fortunatly the non-gullible out-numbered the gullible. (Eventually)

:dunce::dunce::dunce::dunce: :argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh:

...but in all fairness--a transcript is just someone's written interpretation of what was
said. Obviously a "transcript" won't reveal anything. The movie has been in the public
domain for years, with the captions out there, for all to see.

I'm wondering why the 1992 the Wapo article on "War Room" mentions that Kantor made disparaging
remarks about Indiana? Did the Wapo reporter misunderstand as well?

These are valid questions.

I am not trying to be incendiary here. I think it behooves all of us to know the truth.

Personally, I wish someone would come forward to reveal that a real jerk purposely did this, and that
it is not true--and that Kantor did not say these things.

I really want this to go away.

However, a transcript is from the people who made this movie--and this movie was totally sanctioned
by the Clinton camp. The producers and directors are in the Clinton camp. That's fine. Nothing
wrong with that, but I feel after everything that's been thrown around--we need professional clarification
on what exactly was said.

I listened to the audio today, on great speakers with the sound turned up and the speaker next to my ear.

I know I heard, "It doesn't matter. They're shit." Then, it gets kind of fuzzy, and I did hear the, "How'd
you like to be a white N" comment.

I know what I heard. IF someone with more sophisticated audio equipment can show me I'm wrong...I'll be happy about
that. This is a total clusterfuck.

I just would like the truth. I don't want spin from either side. Just the truth, which seems in short supply these
days. Both camps kick in their spin machines, and suddenly, there is no reality. Just two sides screeching at each
other--with two completely different versions of reality.

It's exasperating.

The only credible audio is the original copy of the movie. What was going around the net was doctored.

Did you listen to the original film on DVD?

Was that doctored?

If so, that is a huge story--and I'm sure the person who did
it will be exposed.

Has their been clarification on the fact that it was doctored.

I haven't rented the movie from Blockbuster...just viewed the You Tube clip.

I'm wondering why a 1992 Wapo article that reviewed "War Room" also mentioned
that Kantor made disparaging remarks about Indiana?

that is why it's a dirty trick. Go rent the movie, if you don't have it, and listen to it for yourself. It's black and white. This smear was entirely fabricated.

It was his INTERPRETATION of what he thought he heard in the movie. But why didn't the many other reviewers (e.g., see Rotten Tomatoes) agree with him?

..that the video was NOT doctored.

Possibly, Kantor's words are muffled and are open to interpretation. There is some
disagreement about what he said.

It seems highly unlikely that someone would hear the disparaging remarks in 1992, and then
someone else in 2008 hears the same thing----and that means the 2008 version was doctored.

It sounds like the issue is interpretation.

There are two problematic elements to the clip.

1) Desson Thomson said NOTHING about the "white *******" part (DU mods have asked us not to repeat this phrase). This is the part that was doctored. Kantor and the film director said it was never uttered. It is not in the transcript or in the original DVD that DUers own. An audio engineer here at DU has posted a thread indicating that his own analysis shows that that part was ADDED to the youtube video which he declared a fake. Go to Politico.com, MSNBC, CNN, etc. for more reasons why they agree. There is no interpretation here.

2) What Desson Thomson made interpretations about was whether Kantor was talking about people from Indiana when he referred to "those people" and "shit/shitting." No one has produced any evidence--or even a doctored tape-- of Kantor's saying directly that "Hoosiers are shit." Many other reviewers saw the film and said nothing about Kantor's disparaging people from Indiana. This is the part that can be interpreted negatively, but it's really inconsistent with other evidence, such as the fact that Kantor had just been discussing POSITIVE results for Bill Clinton and Perot (implying bad results for Bush) from Indiana, the fact that Kantor denied that he was referring to people from Indiana--and the director posted a transcript on his own site and asserted that Kantor was referring to people in the White House shitting over the results, which makes far more sense - why would you disparage people giving you what you want?

If you are putting stock in multiple parties hearing the same thing, you need to account for why DOZENS of movie reviewers and THOUSANDS of movie watchers since 1992 have not said the same thing.

just did not have enough imagination to think of an original controversy, and they were wrong in 92.

...(I)n all fairness--a transcript is just someone's written interpretation of what was said. Obviously a "transcript" won't reveal anything...
It doesn't really prove anything. And even if they hadn't been whispered, would you REALLY include those words in an "official" transcript?

I'm wondering why the 1992 the Wapo article on "War Room" mentions that Kantor made disparaging remarks about Indiana? Did the Wapo reporter misunderstand as well?
He's not alone. And if Kantor or his people read the review, why didn't they hasten to correct it?

I know what I heard. IF someone with more sophisticated audio equipment can show me I'm wrong...I'll be happy about
that...I just would like the truth.
I've listened at least twenty times to both the versions on YouTube--through my computer's speakers, through plug-in speakers, through headphones, and through headphones that were plugged into the plug-in speakers. I got the same result each time. So unless you can be convinced otherwise, judge for yourself and believe your own ears.

:headbang:
rocknation

The original and the one with the enhanced audio (which is only fair and I do not consider doctoring). I've edited my post accordingly.

:headbang:
rocknation

Go rent the movie and listen to the original.

Happy weekend to ya!

I just listened to the reloaded one and he is cutting off a word.

Can you give another listen to it and tell me if this is what you hear:

How would you like to be.... look at this one

Video at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEuNIUb3Ges

Vs this one (mp4 format http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5784225 ) and tell me if this is what you hear:

How would you like to be....look at this one...Texas

AKA Crapfest of the Century.

And I bet there are some "footprints" left in the ssand after all...

without subtitles and cranked up volume.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEuNIUb3Ges

I've been catching up here and can't believe people got so caught up in this in the first place! :crazy:

Perspective, people! We've got a war to win against the GOP!!

:thumbsup:

:hi:

Shit, they can't even get their own transcript right. Listen to it while reading the text.

I was really confused when I saw all of the posts about this, and was like "What? IS this actually being treated as a legitimate scandal?"

Jake Tapper is such a joke.

Everyone who is watching thinks it is a sport - and it's real.

Here's the best rendidtion yet:

http://www.youtube.com/v/jL76eWke5P4&hl=en

KANTOR: Look at Indiana! 42-40. It doesn't matter if we win. Those people don't know shit. Oh excuse me!
CARVER: (inaudible)
KANTOR: How would you like to be (inaudible) doing this well in Texas.
CARVER: Roger (inaudible) that
KANTOR: Look at Texas...

And not even close to any of the others.

"don't know"? I just listened to the original again and can't really pick even a hint of that up.

It looks like a really cool movie about the behind the scenes work in campaigns and I was going to buy it. They didn't have it at all -- not for sale or rent.

I have an old VHS of it. Problem is, I don't own a VCR anymore. :-)

that he said "shit" (not shitting) but it was in reference to the pollsters and not in reference to the voters of indiana...

It could go either way as to who he was talking to.

Were these internals or exit polling? I wouldn't think he would say their internals "don't know shit" but saying that about exit polling would make sense.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/02/clinton-adviser-claims-in_n_99810.html

The cropped video, which spread through the Internet like wildfire on Friday morning, shows Kantor with fellow former Bill Clinton staffers James Carville and George Stephanopoulos discussing results from the general election. In the footage, Kantor approaches the two aides and says, "Look at Indiana -- wait, wait, look at Indiana. 42-40. It doesn't matter if we win, those people are shit." That much seems true, though Pennebaker says Kantor was referring to the George H.W. Bush White House. The alleged "white n****r" line followed.

Kantor, on Friday, insisted that the latter part of his statement never took place and that it made no sense for him to use such language.

"Indiana was not even on our radar screen," he said, "And I was talking about the polling and not the people... If you look at The War Room, this is not the way Carville or George interpreted my statement. This is frankly libelous."

I was just suggesting that he was "misremembering" (as that seems to be a campaign theme for HRC & Surrogates this year).

Thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5781518&mesg_id=5781518

and their new documentary efforts - War Room +15

http://www.thefutoncritic.com/news.aspx?id=20080402sundance02

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5782886&mesg_id=5782886

I'm not saying the youtube is accurate, I am saying that the folks that have said it is not correct have a vested interest in the youtube being wrong.

Also, Kantor did not deny saying "those people are shit" - his explanation has been that he said was referring to pollsters while the director, who has a vested interest in this, said Kantor was saying that the White House is shitting.

Good or bad, you can't keep the truth out for long..........

can't have him go down in this video.