For those of you wondering why

the MSM is calling Clinton's victory in Indiana a 2% victory, even though the actual spread is less than 2%, here's why:

First, see CNN's website: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/state/#IN

Second, note that with 99% reporting, Clinton got 641,734 votes and Obama got 623,294 votes out of 1,265,028 counted. The difference is 18,440 votes.

Divide that 18,440 votes by the total 1,265,028 counted votes, and you get 1.45767%. This is closer to 1%, you say, but if you do, you're ignoring a basic rule of arithmetic, which requires that in order to reach a whole number, one must round up any fractional number that is 5 or greater to the next highest number in a string of numbers like that. Thus the 1.45767 is rounded up to 1.4577. And 1,4577 is rounded up to 1.458. And 1.458 is rounded up to 1.46. And 1.46 is rounded up to 1.5. Finally, 1.5 is rounded up to 2%.

Get it?

That sounds much better

1.458 is actually closer to 1.5 than to 1.4.

about which one is "right". They serve different purposes.

Let it be 2 points. Sheesh.

:crazy:

lmao lmao

:evilgrin:

You have to choose how many digits you're rounding to, and then round it once. You cannot round 1.4577 to 1.5 and then turn around and round that up to 2. You stop at 1.5 or, if you need to get the nearest whole number, you round down to 1. That's it.

Look, any programmers out there?

printf("%1.0f\n", 1.4577);

That outputs 1, because I'm telling the computer to round 1.4577 to a single digit with no decimal places using floating-point math. Change the number to 1.5 and you get 2.

And yes, before any ubergeeks tell me that printf is buggy because of irregularities in representing decimal floating-point numbers in binary, I am aware of that. But it is not buggy in this case, and any rounding function you care to use will give you the same result. Hell, round it in a spreadsheet even.)

But 1.47 rounds to 1.

The cut-off is 1.5000000.....
Therefore: 1.50000001 would round up to 2
1.499999999999...... rounds Down to 1.

You DO NOT round each decimal place!

Limaugh's call to caste a mischevious vote in Indiana?

:rofl:

and he comes back for more

They're the gift that just keeps on giving!

click on the OPs profile and read his comment


Warning please have no drinks near the keyboard and no serious meetings for the next 5 hours.

I figured it was less than 2% but it rounds that way. I was mad when they were calling PA a double-digit victory, but I don't care what they call Indiana. Either way it was a narrow victory for Clinton when consensus seems to be she needed a bigger victory.

lol

Thead from yesterday ended up being all that far off.




:rofl: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5847583 :rofl:

Maybe you should be working for Hillary? She needs someone who can use a calculator. :evilgrin:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rounding#Common_method

You round a number once, not once per column!

Someone gives $3 million to you and me, and allows us to split it.

I'll give you $1.4577 million of it.... and since you think that rounds to $2 million, that means you got more money than me! You should be happy!


:eyes:

I was a math major in college. after the decimal point, you move left in rounding up, not right.

1.4577 rounds to 1

If you want one more significant digit, it rounds to 1.5

If you want two more significant digits, it rounds to 1.46

If you want three more signigicant digits, it rounds to 1.458

The bottom line is, rounding moves left to right, not right to left.

If you have $1.45.... it rounds to $1, not $2. EVERY TIME. Under no mathematical circumstances does it round to 2. NEVER.

The problem is not that they did arithmetic and rounded the numbers to get to 51% and 49%. Then they did arithmetic on 51-49 instead of 50.7-49.3 or whatever it really came out to be before they rounded the numbers. Perhaps we should start rounding off the number of votes in each county to the nearest hundred, then add them up, then round that to the nearest thousand, then find out percentages like that, then round them to the nearest 10%, then find out what the difference is that way :crazy:

it's not a 2 percent victory by rounding that number. It's 51-49=2 that makes the difference. Now it's how they come up with 51 & 49. Well, take that 1.4% number, divide it by two (for each candidate's separation from 50%) and it's 0.7% that rounds to 1% up to 51 and 1% down to 49.

I think that maybe you are trying to be sarcastic in your approach and use Hillary math, but just in case you weren't, I wanted to make things clear. Sometimes on GD-P I can't tell :(

You apparently never learned about the "rounding up" rule in grade school, eh?

Neither approach is "Hillary math". Both lead to the same result.

Or are you just being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative?

you are rounding rounded numbers if you are doing what you do in the OP. You only round a numbers ONCE, and that is to give your final answer. If someone uses a rounded number to do arithmetic, well that should just be trash unless the # of sig figs is negligible. Let me guess, you never learned sig figs?

What I stated in the OP is absolutely the correct approach.

If you don't know that you're just full of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rounding

I'm not being argumentative, I'm just trying to help set aside any confusion. The pundits use 51 and 49 and don't look at any other number, that's how they get their 2% win. Your rounding shit in the OP is just... completely ******

The method used in my OP was the method taught in my schools - both in elementary, junior high, and first year algebra in high school. The first year algebra teacher also taught my classes in Alebra II, Trigonometry, and Probability and Statistics. My courses in Geometry, Calculus, Physics and Advanced Physics were tought by other teachers.

But this isn't physics or advanced mathematics. It's very basic mathematics.

That was a long time ago, so maybe the "new math" since then changed the approach.

Get off your high condescending horse.

You appear to be nothing but a flamer.

were presented with that problem on a job interview and you answered the way YOU did, you would be laughed out of the building.


ROUNDING IS ONLY DONE ONCE... THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS "COMPOUND ROUNDING".


You pick the digit that you want to round to (i.e. the "significant digit") and you look at the digit IMMEDIATELY to the right of it ... and you GO NO FURTHER.


Are you REALLY this dense? Do you REALLY think that $1.45 rounds to $2? Is it possible for a grown adult to be THAT bad at math?

I don't want to kick this thread again, but I think that term is hilarious.

My HS chem teacher would have yelled at you.

He had a massive hang up on sig figs

I hope your job doesn't involve numbers.

Double rounding is a no-no.

In fact, it's all the way wrong.

Completely wrong. And I challenge you to find any resource anywhere that describes that as a proper way of rounding.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rounding

You start with the significant digit that you want to round to, and you move right one.

1.45678 rounds to:

1
1.5
1.46
1.457
1.4568


But NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER to 2.


Seriously.... where did you go to school? Because you failed grade-school math.

Very sorry, don't want to be mean but I don't want others misled by what you are posting. It's a common misunderstanding and you will know for the next time. Its no big thing. Happens to the best of us.

(btw I was Math/CS double major in college in case you need my resume ^^)

I"d say your credibility is suspect.

number and then substract:

For Clinton: 50.73 % or 51 %

For Obama : 49.27 % or 49 %

51-49=2 rather than 50.73-49.27= 1.46 %

Not that it matters!

:rofl:

man am I kicking myself I had him on ignore for a couple of months

However if I were him I'd hide out for a week and change my avatar....hoping people would forget.

warning no liquids near keyboard and no serious meetings in next 5 hours

Why we are focusing on something soo unimportant? Clinton won a great race, it was tight and she pulled off a victory. But in the grand scheme of things, does this "decimal thing" really matter?

to cause mischief by voting for her then you are as dense as a famous race horse.


This thread has nothing to do with rounding it has to do with the hilarious thread this guy started last night

http://edition.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/epolls/#INDEM

If the question is between McCain and Clinton in november - 16% overall will pick McCain.
Hillary has 41% of those. Thats about 83.000 of Hillarys voters that will vote for McCain even if Hillary is the nominee.

For Obama his number is about 27.500.

That gives Hillary an advantage in the voters that would never vote democratic under any circumstances of over 50.000.

If such voters hadn't voted Obama would have won Indiana.

It ALWAYS works in Hillary's favor!

You really shouldn't be lecturing folks on arithmetic.

The actual figure is (ObamaVotes-ClintonVotes)/TotalVotes. The decimal approximation of that ratio is just that - an approximation; the actual ratio is closer to 1 than it is to 2. Your adventurous and creative effort to make the 'real' number comply with with your desires is understandable, but incorrect.

If you need a visual aid, draw the number line from 0 to 3, put, 1 and 2 on the line, then locate the point on the line that most closely approximates the value of interest. Note whether it is closer to 1, or to 2.

0.........1.........2.........3
              ^
              |

Is the arrow closer to 1 or to 2?


According to Seabiscuit. The answer is "2". Seabiscuit would be a great person to share a pizza with - give him a little less than half and tell him he got twice as much as you. Then pay a little less than half the bill and tell him you paid twice as much as him.

...but you topped it.


You absolutely are making a fool of yourself.... and rather than admit your error, you are digging the hole deeper.


Tell ya what.... I'll bet you $2 that you're wrong about how to round up.



Math is NOT SUBJECTIVE. There is a absolute right and wrong in math. You're wrong. So very wrong.

endure in order to try and get the nomination.

He emailed me back a two words: blue dress


We have reached the blue dress level in this thread


click the OP profile read the comment for a real treat.

This whole argument is because the news organizations think American's are too dumb to understand decimals, so they have to round to whole numbers. Because an American can grok 2 percent, but not 1.5 percent?

That's just sad.

:spray:

This is what we're up against people.... the dumbing down of America.

:rofl:

:shrug:

losing is rounded up to winning.

Whatever. She won by just a bit. Congratulations. Did she end up with a 4 or 6 delegate margin in IN?

They "rounded up" all of their donations so that it appeared they had more money than they actually had.:rofl:

their finance director.

Who gives a shit?

Your clowning last night makes this all worth it, though. :rofl:

That means Hillary did twice as well as needed to win! That's a HUGE victory for her. Next stop, White House!

holy moly.

If thats how you do rounding, I hope you are not in charge of other peoples money.

53.7 MPH. At the same exact time train "B" leaves Houston at 2:06 PM and travels an average of 55.8 MPH. If the distance between the two cities is 1200 miles, at what time will the trains collide, killing everyone on board?

True?

Hydrogen?

:shrug:

It looks like they rounded down his win in NC from 56.6 to 56 making a 15 point win look like a 14 point win.

still a 1

decimal place.

Lets say three decimals to the right
50.444 = 50
50.445 = 51

Now lets say two decimals to the right
50.444 = 50
50.445 = 50 because 50.44 = 50

Because this is so spectacularly weird, it must be seen to be believed.

On to the White House!!111!!

:wtf:

I felt bad after I recommended your now infamous thread last night.
This morning, I wished I had just let it lie instead of contributing to the pecking party.
But after witnessing your performance on this thread, I'm going to recommend it.

You are absolutely wrong.
You did NOT learn this method of rounding in ANY school.
Like Hillary and her IWR vote, repeatedly insisting you are right won't help you.
The facts and Mathematics exist outside your ego. They can't conform themselves to you desires no matter how much you insist they do so.

Dude!

Keep 'em coming.

hip bone connects to the foot bone

Wrong. As wrong as can be. :shrug:

Elitist.

I think "very funny" is worth AT LEAST a D-, though. :rofl:

Less than 2%

I knew you folks were familiar with imaginary numbers, but perhaps you should revisit irrational numbers.

That ain't how you round off numbers, but A+ for employing math in a wholly new and Hillaryous manner.

They only want to report whole percentiles and the only alternative to 51/49 is 50/50.


Guess which one they picked.

Only on DU! :grouphug:

And gotta agree, however, that the OP couldn't round a decimal correctly to save his life. :rofl: