What is the motivation at this point?

Clearly Senator Clinton has lost the race. Her campaign has now turned from trying to defeat Obama in the primaries to trying to overturn the rules and convince unpledged delegates to support her. Her strategy at this point is to acquire the vast majority of pledged delegates from Michigan and Florida, and as that is not enough to overtake Obama's lead, to also convince enough of the unpledged 'super delegates' to come over to her side to win the nomination. This is a divisive disruptive disunifying strategy that is also doomed to failure. It isn't going to work, but it is going to continue to deepen the wounds and delay the healing.

What is the motivation for this endgame strategy? I am convinced that Senator Clinton, who I would now be supporting were she in the position Obama is in, is far from stupid. She is in fact quite brilliant. So I have to assume that she is not delusional about her prospects. She knows full well that her endgame will not work. She will not get the nomination. Is this all about the VP spot? Her 20M campaign debt? Is she playing for 2012?

I don't get it. I think she could have the VP spot right now without applying any more pressure. Likewise, as distasteful as it would be, the campaign debt would be a small price to pay for unity. I am hoping she is above seeking to destroy Obama in 2008 to keep her hopes alive for 2012, but I cannot rule it out.

The remaining Clinton supporters here need to step out in front of the DU admins and recognize that it is over and that it is time to get on board and support the presumptive nominee. We have work to do. This isn't about who won or lost the nomination. Obama wasn't my first choice either. This is about ending 8 years of corrupt incompetent criminal misrule in Washington. Support Change.

Is that people involved in a conflict to which they have long dedicated themselves acquire a sort of tunnel-vision in assessing the chances they could still prevail as the fight turns against them. They see only that if a sequence of events could all break in their favor they will prevail, and convince themselves the whole string will break in their direction. They lose the capacity of assessing odds accurately, of allowing margins for error and contingencies, they forget the prophet Murphy's wisdom, and cling to maxims on the lines of "If you only hold on long enough, the other fellow will give way."

Instead my view of Clinton is that she is quite brilliant and far from delusional. But you could be right. Bunker mentality is the other explanation.

I should just step away from DU until the shit-flinging is officially over. This is doing nobody any good.

Some other explainations, such as those advanced by Mr. Waterman below, are certainly plausible as well. There are reasons other than hope for victory, but well short of the 'she's trying to ruin the Party' canard, for why she persists.

But I would not take a bet at even twenty-five for one on her victory today....

In lawsuits, they drag on and on, and then there's a trial. By the time it goes to trial, both sides are CONVINCED their storyline is golden. When that jury goes back to deliberate, both sides believe they have won the case. Their lawyers may know better, but the parties almost always think they've won. It doesn't occur to them that jurors didn't believe everything they said, or that jurors didn't see the case through the party's favored paradigm.

It's true that the longer and more heavily invested people become in something, be it a political race or a case for breach of some duty, the more they cannot separate from that goal. When the end comes, it is not accepted quickly, but is rejected as foreign and unacceptable. Hence, all the "we'll appeal it!!" Yeah, good luck with that.

I'd also add that I think Senator Clinton wishes to raise money to retire her debt. It's far easier to do so by saying I'm in it to win it than to say I need your money to pay my debts. I do not believe that Senator Clinton is staying in to hurt Obama's prospects in November.

here and use RW talking points/smears/rumors/character assasination, etc., against our presumptive nominee. No one is covering the PRIMARY any longer. Bush and McCain are openly attacking our NOMINEE.. Obama. It is all over but the declaration and reasoned people know that. This is the last place I know where Obama character/candidacy destrustion is openly allowed. That. Is. Wrong. This becomes a perfect example of appeasement.

The policy is that all Democrats are welcome, and that the contest still continues, as election officials in several states would doubtless assure you, since they are busy with preparation for voting in the upcoming weeks.

Operation Chaos gets a pass, and Obama is the enemy. These are smart Dems getting played like a fiddle by the RW smear machine, IMHO.

When people have their blood up, they do not think straight, and a calm opponent will take advantage....

...until the delegate's votes are counted.

That would be the official end of the process. Now back to reality...

Senator Obama reaches the requisite number of delegates to put him over the top. No more than a 3 weeks or so. She simply does not have the money to carry on. And she wouldn't do so over the clear will of the party.

She may actually believe she can win; she may sincerely believe that she offers the best chance for a victory in November; she might want to try to raise funds to reduce her campaign debt; she may be looking to 2012; or she may be pressing for VP.

I was told yesterday by someone I respect and trust that there is another reason: Senator Clinton believes that the best thing she can do at this point is to continue to campaign, because she has promised her supporters she would. She does not want to make it appear she is being forced out by party leaders, because that could cause a divide that would be difficult to repair this summer. The primaries are being allowed to "play out," without the Obama camp calling in a large number of super delegates at once.

Within three weeks, Senator Clinton will step aside, endorse Barack Obama, and she will begin to work hard -- very hard -- for the democratic ticket, and the democratic party on all levels.

:)

a bit schizophrenic that she kept arguing totally bogus and illogical ways that she could and would win. I understand the "unity" part, but don't get where providing delusion for supporters is healthy. :hi:

If she wanted to finish out the string and have a more graceful exit, then why is her campaign still going on about FL and MI, and attacking the DNC. It's like they want the Democrats to lose big so then they can force the Democratic Party into accepting their way of doing things.

If Senator Clinton were to drop out today, her supporters would likely continue to view the relationship between their camp and the rest of the party in terms of conflict.

When she steps aside in early June, she will have set up a more convincing way to convince her supporters to unite with the rest of the party. She understands that this is a process that will take more time to accomplish the ultimate goal.

After she drops out and endorses Obama, and is clearly invested in the campaign to win the general election, those people who refuse to join in will be easily identified as being engaged in an agenda that has nothing to do with Senator Clinton.

The older I get, the less I believe people, even individuals, act out of a single motive except at the most immediate and fundamental levels of physical survival. While Senator Clinton is surely the predominant voice in her own campaign, the motives of her backers and partners surely enter the mix. It is not, then, a matter of either-or but a matter of "who's on first?"

One thing is for certain. Since McCain became 'unopposed,' the balance of press coverage has dramaticaly (key word here) shifted to the Obama-Clinton sitcom/melodrama. Just as clearly, the media had an enormous role in the mere winnowing of the candidate field. What could be better grist for the media mill than a black versus a woman?? As any publicist will admit, any press is better than no press.

Perhaps only in a virtual sense, someone somewhere has listed the credits and debits of virtually every strategic decision in the Clinton campaign. More likely, it's several someone's and several somewhere's. The notion that Hillary has her eye on 2012 is at least supported by the 2004 election and her notable absence as a vocal and indefatiguable campaigner on behalf of Kerry/Edwards. My mind-reading machine is broken, so I'm unable to do more than speculate. That speculation is consistent with many observations regarding her behavior over the last 8 years. While she touts her "leadership," I am unable to recall a single important instance where she didn't take a position with the maximum CYA.

I add to the mix of speculation the observation that Cheney/Bush have created a mess of almost unprecedented magnitude for the incoming adminstration ... such that the chances that the next President will be a two-term President are seriously diminished. It has been aptly observed on DU many times - who the hell really wants to inherit this catastrophe? I don't think Hillary is the only one with an eye toward 2012.

I believe she wants to get her numbers up as high as possible, both for purposes of history and for the future run she plans to make for the presidency. She wants some line of telling the story so that the race sounds closer than it is.

She wants everyone to think of her as the choice in 2012 if Obama does not win this year.

Today, look at the Clinton vs. Obama wins. Clinton won just about all the traditional Democratic and swing states, such as Ohio, Florida and Texas (popular vote). Now look at the Obama states, for the most part Democrats never carry them and may not this time. The states where there was a popular vote they are equal. Obama definitely has the advantage in the caucus states but I wonder how many he would have won if they actually had a primary. Maybe he can pull it out but to me we would have the advantage with Clinton. One thing we have in our favor is Bush's record and a crazy opponent so maybe he can win, I would say it's pretty much a toss up. I think that an Obama/Clinton ticket would be unstoppable.

Period.

GE election is for electoral votes and I can't see him doing it. My goal is a Democrat in the Whitehouse and from that map it looks like Hillary has the best chance by far.

As long as she can pack a rally, there is some justification for her continuing to campaign on her own behalf.

Well that was the question. What exactly does that mean to her when it is also clear to her, as I think it is (although Magistrate points out that brilliant and bunker-mentality delusional are not contradictory), that she cannot win. I'll go with H2O's optimistic scenario as it feels better than the others on a dismal rainy saturday morning.

Terry's own mouth - "anything" could happen. :scared:

Edit: I hope he means Obama could inexplicably tank.

I think she is trying to generate as much political capital as she can, going into the convention (in terms of pledged delegates, certainly not respect and good will).

Probably most of the reasons given here have validity to one degree or another. As far as her supporters go - well, as long as she's asking for continued support they'll probably give it. When Wes Clark was running if he'd asked those of us for whom he was the first choice to vote for him in our primaries and continue to support his campaign, we probably would have. Some did anyway. I took him at his word when he said it was over and voted Kerry just for solidarity. Kerry was a foregone conclusion by the time NY voted in 2004.

I'm guessing that there's other drama going on in the background, though. It's nothing I can link to or anything. It's just kind of a hunch based on the dynamics of the party. I think the party was willing to fall in line behind Clinton when it thought it had to. When she declared we heard from pundits that she was inevitable because she'd locked up everything ahead of time - the donors and the operatives. I heard it from local Dem party insiders, too. But now I think the party is looking for a changing of the guard. I think they're so close to being free of the Clintons as the major power in the party that they can taste it and it tastes good to them. I think that Clinton is now all about holding onto that power for dear life and it goes way beyond this campaign.

Now I have to head out to the supermarket, so I won't know what anyone else thinks about that.

Besides, they have raised $23 million for the general election that I suspect they would ultimately figure out how to use to retire the debt.

I also think that as long as the Michigan and Florida situation is unresolved, she has strong motivation to stay in. After all, they are currently within 5% of the total delegate count.

And finally, it's only 3 more weeks until the last vote anyway.

They've taken that quote (Lombardi?} "Winning isn't everything..it's the only thing", to the point of obsession.

Both seem addicted to the idea of being "somebody".

is what keeps the Clinton Campaign and her ardent supporters going. I believe Senator Clinton herself mentioned the 1968 Primary Season.

If I entertain my darkest thoughts for a moment, I notice that there is a strange commonality between Sen. Clinton, Dick Cheney, and Dan Quayle: all three of them are or were excellent life insurance policies for someone else, for reasons which should be obvious.

There is of course an infinity of more benign (if improbable) scenarios which could quickly remove Obama from the race, and part of the Clinton strategy undoubtedly relies on being in position to capitalize on such a misfortune. There are only three people in the world who have a legitimate shot at being the next President, and if Sen. Clinton's chance is the smallest, it still exists. (My money, by the way, is still on Bush and Cheney to destroy American democracy entirely.)

But there is a larger picture worth considering, which is the massive benefit to the party as a whole that this extended primary season has generated. Voter registration is way up. Turnout at the primaries is the best insurance one can have against voter suppression. Tag-teaming the press has boxed out McCain and most of the usual Republican dirty tricks--the Reverend Wright excepted. Howard Dean's 50-state strategy is being implemented from the top all the way down and we've already seen a preview of the potential results in Mississippi this week. If Sen. Clinton accepts the VP slot then this primary season instantly turns into a six-month head start on the general election, while McCain still doesn't have a running mate.

And to return to those dark thoughts, Sen. Clinton is also providing a valuable and perhaps even necessary form of continuity should my worst fears be realized. The existence of that continuity is perhaps the best way to ensure that the worst won't happen. But we are dealing with the most criminal government in the history of the world, and we forget that at our peril.

"There seems to be a movement afoot by many thousands of Hillary Clinton supporters to either vote for John McCain, another presidential candidate, write Hillary’s name in, not vote for president at all, or simply stay home on election night if Hillary Clinton is not the Democratic nominee for president.

There is ample proof of this movement throughout the Internet on pro-Hillary Clinton sites and other sites where comments can be made. These Clinton supporters usually give several reasons for their adamant refusal to fall in line behind Barack Obama as the presumptive Democratic nominee - and I haven’t seen one of those reasons being because Obama is black (actually he isn’t really African-American, but instead 50% white, 43.25% Arabic and 6.25% African Negro . 12.5% is the legal threshold one must prove to claim racial status under the law).

Many of these Hillary supporters are women who firmly believe that they have been shafted by Obama and his supporters throughout the campaign. They maintain that the Obama campaign, many pro-Obama news organizations, along with many of his supporters, have overtly been sexist toward them and their candidate.

Other Hillary supporters say that Obama has run an unfair, race-baiting, nasty campaign against their candidate, and say the evidence for this charge is clear. One of their chief complaints revolves around Obama’s refusal to work out a solution to seat both Michigan and Florida delegates, or even allow a re-vote by the two states so that every vote can count.

Still others Clinton supporters say that Obama is woefully inexperienced to become POTUS at this time, and hasn’t previously demonstrated a record of bringing Republicans and Democrats and blacks and whites together. They complain that Obama is just a great orator with no actual merit to his claims of being a uniter. They believe he is not ready for prime-time.

Many others say that because of his associations with terrorists and racists, along with his previous drug use and his so-called eager willingness to to deal with rogue nations, that he is unfit to become commander-in-chief. They say Obama is not very patriotic and complain that his wife isn’t very proud of her country. They also claim that Obama is a corrupt liar and a complete fraud."
http://www.commentarymagazine.com/blogs/index.php/rubin/6261

Why are you here promoting a victory by McCain in november, post after post after post? Is that what you really want? Will you feel vindicated? Are you really that narrow?

including her loans. If she drops out, she loses that money.

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She sees the White House as HER house, not the People's.

To that end, she will go to the convention on the misguided notion that a combination of Clintonian charisma, arm twisting, and outright lies about electability will convince enough super delegates to go against the will of the rank and file voters of the Democratic party.