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PHILADELPHIA INQUIRER states that Hillary is winning the popular vote

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pathansen Donating Member (696 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 07:40 AM
Original message
PHILADELPHIA INQUIRER states that Hillary is winning the popular vote
Edited on Sun May-25-08 08:16 AM by pathansen
The Philadelphia Inquirer reports about Tuesday night’s contests: “Hillary Clinton netted approximately 150,000 votes and is now poised to finish the primary season as the popular-vote leader. In some quaint circles, presumably, these things still matter…If you believe that the most important precept in democratic politics is to ‘count every vote,’ then…Clinton leads Obama by 71,301 votes.
See:
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/opinion/20080523_In_most_inclusive_count__Clinton_has_the_numbers.html

The POPULAR VOTE will matter in the general election, esp. with the swing states such as Florida,
Ohio and Pennsyvania.
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 07:42 AM
Response to Original message
1. The only way she wins the popular vote is to counts votes that didn't count
Edited on Sun May-25-08 07:45 AM by IWantAnyDem
and ignore votes that did count.
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ruby slippers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. and to recount votes that were counted before.....
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pathansen Donating Member (696 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 08:23 AM
Response to Reply #1
8. They claim she's winning the popular vote even without FL & MI
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. They're lying. n/t
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pathansen Donating Member (696 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #9
26. Then why did someone on Meet the Press say the same thing?
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. Because they are lying too.
What about caucus states?

Fuck them I guess.
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TheWraith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #26
36. Probably because they're lying too.
The only way Clinton is "winning the popular vote," if there were such a thing in this primary, is if first you include Florida and the Soviet Union-style Michigan election, and then throw out the caucus states that don't report specific vote totals, most of which Obama won. So hey, as long as she's the only name on the ballot, and can throw out the elections she doesn't like, she's winning.
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tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 07:47 AM
Response to Original message
3. We Nominate by the Delegate Count.
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pathansen Donating Member (696 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #3
18. Yes, and the delegates need to vote for the most electable candidate
Edited on Sun May-25-08 09:57 AM by pathansen
The one who will win in the swing states.
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #18
31. more electabe...
like the one who knows how to run a successful campaign and has millions ready to go, registers more new Dems than any other campaign, doesn't continually put his foot in his mouth, and is beating the other candidate in all groups except older women over 50. You mean THAT candidate?

Swing states? It will be interesting to see how well she does there now.
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #18
38. Obama is the most elecatble candidate, as proven by the fact that he won our party nomination.
Hillary is no longer even in the running.
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Clear Blue Sky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 07:47 AM
Response to Original message
4. So what? The nomination is not determined by popular vote.
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pathansen Donating Member (696 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 08:09 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. It will matter in the general election. Swing states are supporting Hillary
According to recent polls, a large number of Hillary supporters may not vote or vote for McCain or Nader.
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Honeycombe8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 07:48 AM
Response to Original message
5. What would you expect Philly to say? But of course, Obama leads in popular vote. nt
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Exilednight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 07:51 AM
Response to Original message
6. I intercepted this e-mail to the Hillary campaign .......
To: Hillary@hillaryclinton.com
From: Fuzzy@fuzzymath.com

Dear Senator, please stop using fictional numbers to make your argument about winning the popular vote. I have repeatedly, and with exhaustion, have run the numbers every which way possible, but I find no way that you win the popular vote.

I hereby respectfully request that stop using fuzzy math in an attempt to make your argument. You are ruining my good name and I do not want to take the harsh step of filing a lawsuit of liable and slander against your campaign.

Sincerely, Fuzzy Math

P.S. GObama!!
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Maraya1969 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #6
39. Did you really send that? I think it is great!
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my3boyz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
10. That Meecham guy from Newsweek said the same thing on Meet The Press. nt
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ErinBerin84 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:32 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. I saw that too
I was pissed off that no one corrected him. The manipulation of the metrics is going to be one of the things that gives people a false sense of "this was stolen from me!" He also said that McCain was a standalone brand and he doesn't buy the "Bush/McCain" stuff.

I liked what Doris Kearns Goodwin said when talking about how "when you allow resentment to fester inside of yourself, it can become poisonous ", and when Tim Russert showed the clip of himself in 92 saying in April that Bill have mathematically clinched the nomination, and then said "The Clinton campaign thought that I was a mathematical genius back then...because I could add!"
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:23 AM
Response to Original message
11. Too bad for her the delegate count is the currency that determines the winner.
Interesting to see who buys their propaganda and passes it off as gospel. Hillary is counting on the chaos she is creating permeating the mainstream to cause doubt and confusion.
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pdxmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
12. When Clinton introduces a constitutional amendment to get rid of the
electoral college and choose our President based on popular vote, then I will believe that she actually believes her own argument.
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ebdarcy Donating Member (654 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:35 AM
Response to Original message
14. Will someone please explain something to me?
How can anyone justify using a popular vote count when some of the contests are caucuses? Am I missing something here?
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Ravy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Perhaps the 4 caucus states that didn't keep track of who voted for whom,
could be calculated by the average turnout of the other caucus states (who did record the popular vote) and the percentage be applied to them to get an estimate of the people who voted for.
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ebdarcy Donating Member (654 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #17
20. Thank you. nt
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ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:37 AM
Response to Original message
15. funny. This thread is right above the one
wondering if critical thinking is dead. Never has the answer and the question been so close, so obvious.
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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #15
37. zing!
:rofl:
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DogPoundPup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
16. "Popular vote" as in Limpballs followers?
Yea, she is poplular with Limpball, Scaiffe, Murdoch, Coulter. Yikes!
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
19. She's winning if YOU LIE
The Michigan and Florida votes don't count...but if they did, then the states that held caucuses get their votes counted, right? That would make Obama ahead.

Fuck. These. Assholes.
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PM7nj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 10:16 AM
Response to Original message
21. Wriiten by JONATHAN LAST: Right Winger paticipating in Operation Chaos
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/attytood/When_Last_is_wrong.html

This is not the Inquirer "reporting" anything. It is a OpEd by a right winger.

Here is the Inquirer's actual report, which tells the truth: http://www.philly.com/inquirer/front_page/19169474.html
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IsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
22. By what method are they using to count the caucus states. Appearently their own, because there are
Edited on Sun May-25-08 10:22 AM by IsItJustMe
no numbers from these states. Are their counts accurate, who the hell knows. This article is total bull shit. We will not, or can not, ever know the actual popular vote. These people can act like we can, but just because they say it does not mean it is so.
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
23. 1. It's an OPINION piece.
2. Not everything the Inky says is true.
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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
24. LOL. Thank goodness the SD's are smarter than the bullshitting writers at the PI.
Hillary's "popular vote lead" really is fairy tale fantasy.
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SoxFan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
25. You picked a hell of a source
"When I came onboard in 2006 as The Inquirer's house fascist, I never imagined that one day I'd have hundreds of readers claiming I was a shill for Hillary Rodham Clinton. War-monger? Yup. Antiabortion nut? You betcha. Reactionary troglodyte? Out and proud!"
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/currents/16720136.html


One Last Thing: McCain is right about Iraq
A long-term U.S. presence is essential to securing the nation.
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/currents/16159157.html
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
27. hey Philadelphia Inquirer, the contest is won through accumalation of DELEGATES!! NOT POPULAR VOTE!
Even though their argument is b.s. anyway since Fl/MI isn't included unless the rules committee says it is.
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PM7nj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. It isn't the Inquirer! It is an OpEd by a right wing nut.
Operation Chaos.
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #29
34. ah, gotcha.
well then- how's the weather?? :hi:
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Austinitis Donating Member (726 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:56 PM
Response to Original message
28. If she wins the popular vote we need to take this to the convention and take the nomination for
Hillary. This is a democracy and the person with the most votes should win.
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dchill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #28
44. "The popular vote" metric does not exist.
If you have to count something six different ways, it's not really countable at all. Besides, did you ever hear of "delegates?"

In a democracy, you're supposed to follow the rules. Do you even know the rules?
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
30. Too bad about those disenfranchised caucus states, isn't it? Why does Hillary hate Ameica?
She only loves some states.
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Liberal Veteran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
32. Why are the HRC-Hivebots trying to disenfranchise caucus states?
That's the answer that needs to be given every single time this popular vote bullshit is brought up.
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #32
35. Because they hate America,
Duh.
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OnionPatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
40. So, to all those people who participated in the caucuses: Screw you!
What a bunch of garbage. If Hillary wanted to contest that caucuses are unfair, she should have done so before the election process began. She wants to change the rules in the middle of the game and as much as she claims she doesn't want to disenfranchise voters, she's perfectly willing to disenfranchise entire states whose voters took the trouble to participate in caucuses.
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LucyParsons Donating Member (938 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
41. More truth from the media that brought you the Iraq War
nt
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dchill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
42. From your link:
"The third and fourth counts - the ones which include Florida - seem more fair. Here, Obama is clinging to a slight lead of 146,786 votes (257,008, with the caucus estimates)."
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RiverStone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-25-08 01:13 PM
Response to Original message
43. RCP - Obama up by 458K
That's the truth - counting only votes that are from legit primaries.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/democratic_vote_count.html
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