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Ahm, What Digby said. (Really)

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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 07:57 AM
Original message
Ahm, What Digby said. (Really)
This is my greatest fear in the election fraud issue. It is coming to pass. We have to watch these bastards for more than just the machine issue. They are going to fundamentally rewrite the registration laws in America and no one will ever have to listen to election fraud stories again because everything that happened in '04 will be nice and legal. And permanent.

http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 08:05 AM
Response to Original message
1. The Republican plan to permanently disenfranchise voters
Edited on Fri Jun-09-06 08:15 AM by TayTay
1: Voter ID cards. This was test-run in Georgia. The courts knocked down the $40 fee for an ID card, because it was obviously discriminatory. However, the measure, without the fee, passed and will be the law in that state. What's wrong with showing an ID to vote? Depends on what documentation is required in order to get that ID. White, comfortable suburban voters can't get it through their heads that the requirements is where the disenfranchisement starts. Not everyone has an original birth certificate. Not everyone was born in a hospital and had paperwork filed. Not everyone can afford the gas or time off from work to do the run-around to get the ID. It is discriminatory and it will be come permanent and legal long after the machines have been brought up to code and standards.

2: It will become legal to intentionally discriminate in the placement of voting machines. Fear the immigration issue here. The Repubs are going to start screaming that Dems are registering illegals to steal elections. It is already happening and may have cost Francie Busby the election. All sorts of bad things will come from this, including a lot more caging, voter challenges on election day, onerous restrictions on who can register people to vote and so forth. Again, this is the goal because it is permanent and legal.

We have to wake up to this. It's more than just the exit polls and the machines. It's being done in broad daylight. And we aren't seeing it.
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MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 08:07 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. EXACTLY! n/t
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
3. Florida sucks. It just sucks. Again, stealing legally.
State wants limited voting machine checksState election officials have proposed new restrictions on testing voting machines in the wake of a test that exposed security flaws in one system.
BY GARY FINEOUT
gfineout@MiamiHerald.com
TALLAHASSEE - Months after a maverick elections supervisor irritated a leading voting-machine company and state officials by conducting unorthodox tests on voting equipment -- and finding security problems -- the state wants to make it harder for counties to check voting machines.

The state is proposing rules that require all 67 election supervisors in Florida to get approval from the state Division of Elections before testing their voting equipment for any problems, including whether or not it has security flaws or if the vote-counting software is working correctly.

The new rule would require county supervisors to submit a ''testing plan'' to the division, as well as to notify the maker of the machine before the test can take place. Any results of the test would have to be sent to state officials.

''The purpose is to make the process more transparent,'' said Jenny Nash, a spokeswoman for the Department of State. ``Certainly any supervisor can test any machine. It's just so the department and vendor will be included. In essence, it's so all parties have the same information.''

More at: http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/state/14776132.htm?source=rss&channel=miamiherald_state
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
4. The GAO Final report on the 2004 election is up
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whometense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. The whole subject makes me want to weep.
Edited on Fri Jun-09-06 09:02 AM by whometense
I don't see that any progress whatsoever is being made on this front. And it'll probably stay that way as long as the repukes control congress. And they'll control congress as long as we don't don anything about the voting problems...Ok, I think I'll go stick a pencil in my eye now.

Did you hear Ed Schultz's rant on Wednesday about the Tuesday election? Link here: http://audio.wegoted.com/podcasting/6706Opening.mp3

I don't always agree with Ed, but I have to say I was almost as angry as he was about the results of Tuesday's voting in San Diego. Then there wass this from Nagourney yesterday:
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/08/washington/08elect.html?_r=1&hp&ex=1149825600&en=709f8b2b9f3d2f45&ei=5094&partner=homepage&oref=slogin

Republicans demonstrated yet again their ability to raise more money than Democrats and to deploy the get-out-the-vote and absentee-vote operation developed by the Republican National Committee.

The committee's chairman, Ken Mehlman, said Wednesday that Republicans had 160 people in this district helping to get out the vote.

"They made 164,000 phone calls," Mr. Mehlman said.

Democrats said the Democratic National Committee had no similar effort on the ground here.


And why the fuck didn't they??????? Huge sigh.
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Because the Democrats have decentralized and outsourced this
function to 3rd parties. America Coming Together and other 527's (or 527 like organizations) did a lot of the GOTV drive in '04. IT DIDN'T WORK that well.

Why wasn't it enough? In the days that followed, theories circulated claiming that Republicans had stolen votes from Kerry by messing with the results from electronic voting machines. But the truth was that the Bush campaign had created an entirely new math in Ohio. It wouldn't have been possible eight years ago, or even four. But with so many white, conservative and religious voters now living in the brand-new town houses and McMansions in Ohio's growing ring counties, Republicans were able to mobilize a stunning turnout in areas where their support was more concentrated than it was in the past. Bush's operatives did precisely what they told me seven months ago they would do in these communities: they tapped into a volunteer network using local party organizations, union rolls, gun clubs and churches. They backed it up with a blizzard of targeted appeals; according to the preliminary results of a survey done by the Center for the Study of Elections and Democracy at Brigham Young University, one representative home in Portage County, just outside Cleveland, received 11 pieces of mail from the Republican National Committee.

This effort wasn't visible to Democrats because it was taking place on an entirely new terrain, in counties that Democrats had some vague notion of, but which they never expected could generate so many votes. The 10 Ohio counties with the highest turnout percentages, many of them small and growing, all went for Bush, and none of them had a turnout rate of less than 75 percent.

For Democrats, this new phenomenon on Election Day felt like some kind of horror movie, with conservative voters rising up out of the hills and condo communities in numbers the Kerry forces never knew existed. "They just came in droves," Jennifer Palmieri told me two days after the election. "We didn't know they had that room to grow. It's like, 'Crunch all you want -- we'll make more.' They just make more Republicans."

In hindsight, it seemed significant that Bouchard, months before, felt constricted enough by ACT's legal and financial realities to shift its focus, moving canvassers out of more contested counties and precincts and away from the business of trying to convert undecided voters. In the end, these were the voters Kerry needed. But Bouchard and his troops ran smack up against the inherent limits of a 527 in a presidential campaign. They could turn out the vote, but they couldn't really alter its shape.

Therein, perhaps, lies the real lesson from Ohio, and from the election as a whole. From the days of Franklin Delano Roosevelt, and especially after the disputed election of 2000, Democrats operated on the premise that they were superior in numbers, if only because their supporters lived in such concentrated urban communities. If they could mobilize every Democratic vote in America's industrial centers -- and in its populist heartland as well -- then they would win on math alone. Not anymore. Republicans now have their own concentrated vote, and it will probably continue to swell. Turnout operations like ACT can be remarkably successful at corralling the votes that exist, but turnout alone is no longer enough to win a national election for Democrats. The next Democrat who wins will be the one who changes enough minds.

"I can't think of a thing in Ohio that we could have done more to boost our vote," Steve Rosenthal told me three days after the election, as the trauma of the defeat began to subside. "The shortcoming in some ways is that the national Democratic Party has built this values wall between itself and a lot of voters out there, and the Republicans took advantage of it. The rude awakening here is that I always thought there were more of us out there. And this time there were more of them."


Sorry, but it hasn't changed. This is why Sen. Kerry is supporting Bob Casey and Jim Webb and so forth. These people are not doctrinaire Dems, they have a lot of conservative ideas. But we, as Dems have to live in the real world and we have to start talking to real people where they live. And most people are not wonks or liberal purists. The Repubs have the advantage still. We still have not 'gotten serious.' Hillary hasn't that's for sure. Sen. Kerry is getting serious, very serious. I can read the recent moves and it bodes well for him. (But not in liberal-land.)

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whometense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. That's very interesting.
Edited on Fri Jun-09-06 09:19 AM by whometense
So far, his support for people like Casey and Webb has seemed sort of like blips on the radar screen of his normal political activities. I'll be keeping an eye on this. I just hope he doesn't come out for the flagburning amendment. :o

You (and Ed) are right - WE HAVEN"T GOTTEN SERIOUS. And what about Dean? What is his plan for victory in November?
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. It's more complicated than that.
Edited on Fri Jun-09-06 09:34 AM by TayTay
There were problems with America Coming Together and how they did GOTV and registration. First of all, they were NOT LEGALLY ALLOWED to mention John Kerry by name. Our GOTV effort was not allowed to mention our candidate by name. Cogitate on that one for a while. (Insane comes to mind.)

Howard Dean is completely correct when he says that we have to take back our own GOTV effort. We have to do it from the ground up. I cannot be recruited to go into a poor or minority community to do GOTV. I don't live there, I don't understand the concerns of people in that area and I am not going to be living there. It is nutty to assume that I can have a long term effect on the turn-out. (Ed Schultz muddied the message here on Tuesday. The plane load of pros that came in, came in to motivate locals to GOTV. There is a huge difference.)

The 50 State strategy is essential if the Dems don't want to become a permanent minority. We must get a precinct captain in every precinct in America who knows their territory and the people who live there. There is no other way. This is expensive and costs money. And again, it is the only way. This means that some money is not available for races like Busby's. The theory is that we can have other big name Dems (like, oh, John Kerry) come in and do some fund-raising. It wasn't enough. Ahm, since when have Dems ever had as much money as Repubs, besides 2004? (And it wasn't enough.)

John Kerry is on-board with the 50 State Strategy. I heard his people from 2004 articulate this strategy at the DCI event I went to in March. Kerry, smaht pol that he is, understands that it's not just a media problem for the Dems. We have a serious people problem. We are not living in people's lives. Go see the Victory '06 page for Massachusetts, a test lab for this concept btw, and see what Teddy and John learned in their fabulous adventure in '04. (Okay, not so fabulous.)

Also, remember that list of Ten Things that Dems can do that the good Senator has been tinkering with in his recent speeches. Damn, somebody learned something. Something big and necessary and real. I was duly impressed. WE must have have a clear message that answers the question: What are the Democrats going to do for me? That is the essential voter question. Kerry, not Clinton, is front and center right now at answering it. (And this is still under the radar as far as the media is concerned.) Sigh!
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. Great point!
These people are not doctrinaire Dems, they have a lot of conservative ideas. But we, as Dems have to live in the real world and we have to start talking to real people where they live. And most people are not wonks or liberal purists. The Repubs have the advantage still.


People would look at this statement and conclude that the country is more conservative than liberal because people seem to not understand the nature of being a liberal and a Democrat. There are a lot of people who support a spectrum of liberal values, but on one issue or another lean conservative. The thing is that the one issue isn't always the same, and a handful lean conservative on a couple of issues. As you say, that's the reality. For the most part, Democrats are united on a number of core issues. Ignoring reality is what continues to give the Republicans the edge. People know, or should know if they're paying attention to this Congress, that Republicans do no support ANY liberal values.

The country is more liberal and may become more liberal still, but for now it's important to take the Republican advantage away.

Imagine a Democrat who supports most liberal values winning in a Republican-dominated district or state, taking the seat away from a Republican who supports no liberal values.
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. The valves are clogged on messaging
Democrats can't get the message out because the media is clogging the filters. They will not let the Dems talk. (Look at the PEter Daou column that Sen. Kerry recommended. It's true. We have to make the REthugs own their nuts. If the media will let us.)

We have problems. The only way out is to begin to talk to people where they live. There is no other cure.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. On that rallying call
from JK, I have been trying hard to think of a way around this problem. The RW owns the media, so how can Democrats get their message out? After watching how Ms. Evil was handled, it's obvious the media is dissing all liberals, everyone of us. What I find despicable is that many on the wingnut blogs are denoucing this kook, yet the mainstream media sees fit to coddle the nut.

Talking to people is a solution, but I tell you the media has to be neutralized---it shouldn't operate as an extension of the RNC, and it definitely shouldn't be promoting extreme wingnut messages!
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. We need a coordinated push to do what the Rethugs did before us
We have to send e-mail and phone calls and such to the media and tell them that they are biased and not doing their jobs. That is what wingnuttia did and they made the media pay attention to them. We have to do that.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. You're right
I'm being repetitive, but I really like this tool:

http://www.democrats.org/page/speakout/letterstoeditors
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ginnyinWI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #8
18. sad but true, Tay.
Sen. Kerry is about the only one I still believe in, anymore. sigh. His political smarts surpass those of anyone else I've seen.
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
5. I'm kicking, Tay Tay n/t
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. A Point was made in the RFK,jr piece in Rolling Stone
that the Dems were afraid to bring up some voting legislation for fear that the Rethugs would make HAVA worse. This is not cowardice. This is a genuine and real fear. The Digby article says why. The Rethugs have no consciences at all and want power at all cost. The Dems have a reason to fear legislative changes this year. It could get much worse.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:29 AM
Response to Original message
10. This whole thread belongs in GD - people need to get the whole picture
.
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. It has been. Repeatedly. People don't want to see it
Edited on Fri Jun-09-06 09:42 AM by TayTay
They want the quick fix and the idea that if we get the machines right, everything will be right. It won't. They also completely misunderstand the 50 State Strategy and how it works. (They must sign up to be precinct captains and go door to door 3-4 times a year for the forseeable future in order for this to work.) This is how you take back America. It's damn hard work and requires comittment and not just writing silly threads that call other Dems names for not solving the problem overnight. (This is why these trolly or nasty comments bother me. They are blind to what must really be done to affect change. We know this in here. BLM, you know it cold. Others are still looking for a phrase or bill or speech that will change everything. It is not going to happen.)

Some people know this and understand the details. Others want to assign blame. Sigh! That said, I did put it in my Journal.
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Blaukraut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
19. looks like they aren't resting on their laurels
This is the frightening part - the rethugs are always one step ahead on us, and reading downthread, I have to agree with you, Tay, and others; our options are growing slim, and the Dems have to rethink their strategy before it's too late.
(reading the other Digby blog entries and they're not very positive, either)
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whometense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Bradblog always strikes me as a touch
on the hysterical side, but when I read stuff like this http://www.bradblog.com/archives/00002924.htm it just makes me want to tear my hair out.
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Holy Mother of Gawd
Edited on Fri Jun-09-06 12:31 PM by TayTay
They took the machines home and had no 'chain of custody' for them? Honestly, you'd think elections in America were no more important than buying a loaf of bread or something.
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Blaukraut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. You're not kidding, whome
Considering that Busby came thisclose in an overwhelmingly republican district DESPITE her much-talked-about gaffe is already good news. But the thought that she may actually have won had it not been for the usual shenanigans with the machines is frustrating and depressing. How much Bradblog can be trusted on this, I don't know.
We do know that Diebold machines are a huge problem - not the only one when it comes to election fraud, as Tay's thread shows - but a central one.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. Meantime in Iowa
We have a real live case where votes really were switched from one candidate to another. I checked early this morning and there was no explanation yet. Sure it was Republicans but it shouldn't matter, just like that Texas election a few weeks ago. Certainly the machines should have been secured, but I do not understand why we go running off on a case where there's no evidence of tampering when we have a case right in front of our noses where something absolutely happened. This kitchen sink approach is just not going to work.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
23. OMG!
August 31, 2005

Kerry and Edwards to Stay in Recount Case!!! Trial to Start in August 2006

Don McTigue, attorney for John Kerry and John Edwards, appeared in federal court in Toledo, before Judge Carr, on August 30th, and told the Court that Kerry and Edwards intend to remain in the case.

Judge Carr set an August 22, 2006 trial date.

Additionally he consolidated the two recount cases, Rios v. Blackwell and Yost v. Cobb & Badnarik. He gave the plaintiffs until September 15th to file amended pleadings (plaintiff's counsel had requested an opportunity to streamline their claims).

Judge Carr set a discovery cut-off of May 1, 2006, and ruled that any summary judgment motions must be made by May 15, 2006.

http://fairnessbybeckerman.blogspot.com/2005/08/kerry-and-edwards-to-stay-in-recount.html



This looks like the case that was dismissed earlier this year!

February 10, 2006

Associated Press Reports: Ohio Recount Suit Dismissed
According to the Associated Press, the Ohio recount suit has been dismissed:

Judge Dismisses Penultimate Ohio Lawsuit
By JOHN McCARTHY, Associated Press Writer
Thu Feb 9, 10:42 PM ET

COLUMBUS, Ohio - A federal judge has thrown out a lawsuit over Ohio's recount of the 2004 presidential election, leaving only one court challenge remaining from the state's role in the re-election of President Bush.

U.S. District Judge James Carr in Toledo threw out the suit filed by a voting rights group on behalf of the Green Party and Libertarian candidates. Tuesday's dismissal, barring an appeal, leaves active only a suit filed by the League of Women Voters of Ohio.

http://fairnessbybeckerman.blogspot.com/2006/02/associated-press-reports-ohio-recount.html


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WildEyedLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Maybe you could post that in a thread in GD started by Jefferson's Ghost
Which is currently being polluted by two trolls.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Done! n/t
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jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. Hi Wel! Are you and Vektor in your new job yet?
I've been thinking about ya!
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WildEyedLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-09-06 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. We're here
It's pretty cool, if a bit slow initially. I'm sure it'll get really exciting as the summer goes on.

No JK sightings yet, alas. Well I did see him for a split second at the Mass Dems convention, but he wasn't within speaking range.
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BlueIris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-10-06 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
29. Kick.
And blech: I was looking for good news when I opened this up.
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