Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

How battle crazy do US Marines have to be to MURDER a 3 yr. old girl??

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread		 This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU
 
NoodleyAppendage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:04 PM
Original message
How battle crazy do US Marines have to be to MURDER a 3 yr. old girl??
Edited on Sat Jun-03-06 12:35 PM by NoodleyAppendage
I know that the vast majority of our American fighting men and women are good persons, but they and their organization need to get over this loyalty "wall of silence" and complicity by excusing the actions of the Haditha Marines as "battle fatigue" or stress.

If those massacred in Haditha were males of potential fighting age, I could see some plausibility behind the common response of giving the soldier the benefit of the doubt. However, what plausibility exists in the EXECUTION OF CHILDREN who are not yet potty trained????

J
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Terran1212 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
1. It happens nearly every time there is an awful war or occupation
It's the nature of the things; the planners know it as they make the wars -- making them guilty as well.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. One of the Haditha victims was an infant.
If I'm not mistaken.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Avalux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
3. Killing is killing.
These men are taught to kill and have learned to bury their emotions in order to do so. After being in Iraq for months, some of them 3rd or 4th time around, they probably feel absolutely nothing. It has nothing to do with being a good person. It has everthing to do with what killing and war does to a person's mind.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NoodleyAppendage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. So, essentially the soldiers are taught that Iraqis are sub-human.
Boy, that sounds like the dehumanization process the Nazis used to exterminate the Jews.

J
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Avalux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Yes.
That's exactly what it is, unfortunately. x(
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The_Casual_Observer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
4. Crazy enough to kill a 3 yr old girl I guess.
Edited on Sat Jun-03-06 12:09 PM by The_Casual_Observer
They aren't peacekeepers, they are military occupiers on a conquest for Iraq Oil.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
demosincebirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:12 PM
Original message
They are a tool for Corporate America.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
5. The word is "murder", not "execution", which is what is done in
"carrying out a lawful sentence (my dictionary)."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Bush has sort of CONDONED this shit because he said he is "Troubled"
by allegations....

He did not say or act PISSED OFF that some assholes went and fucked up the war that was already fucked up.

Was ME, I would have all those guys back here ASAP FRONT AND CENTER for a DRESSING DOWN....then straight to the hospital for a check up///most likey they got some battle shit in their heads.

After that....the courts will decide...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jerry611 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. The right wing is attacking Bush for saying "troubled."
The right wing wanted Bush to say that he was going to wait until the investigation was complete.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #10
22. A revealing response and its sickening....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jerry611 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
7. Marines are trained to kill, pure and simple
They are the guys you want on the front lines during combat. However, they are not the guys you want to be doing peacekeeping missions.

They are trained to kill anything without hesitation and without a 2nd thought. They are not trained to keep the peace.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
jerry611 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. It's been this way for over 150 years
There are stories of Marines killing kids as young as 8 or 9 in Mexico City during the Mexican war in 1844.

Ever see the movie "Full Metal Jacket?" That gives you a good idea about how Marines are trained and how they think.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
adriennui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. your attitude leaves me cold
your hatred is rather transparent. last year my husband and i went to the funeral of a navy SEAL who was trying to make a difference in afghanistan. he was a good gentle man, who left behind a fiancee, parents who loved him and a brother who is inconsolable. these troops are people but i'm afraid you may be the type of person who takes delight in crucifying anything our soldiers do.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
jerry611 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. The screw-ups of a few give a bad name to all
People forget that even John Kerry admitted to doing things or participating in things in Vietnam that he shouldn't have done.

When you have bullets whizzing by your head and IEDs blowing up the people you have trained with and became friends with for years, it really changes the way you think.

And people also forget that the terrorists arn't any better at all. They are killing civilians. They are killing babies and young children. They are killing innocent muslims. You can't let them off the hook either.

This is a war. And all war is hell.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. THIS. IS. NOT. A. WAR
This is an occupation. If they are going to kill their own, THEY need to work it out. Why are we there? You are a human being before you are a soldier. This is an illegal occupation and everything done under this action is illegal.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
adriennui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. why are we there????
i don't know, we should get the hell out ASAP. but to condemn so many soldiers whose only future was to enlist is rather callous. this country must make more options for our people before we try to cure other dysfunctional societies.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. You should probably know that I'm not condemning so many
soldiers. I condemn and deplore those who set aside their morality in service of a criminal enterprise. I DO believe the soldiers have an obligation to know as much of the truth as possible. I DO believe the soldiers have an obligation to act like senient beings. When they don't, I could care less that they wear a uniform. If they serve with honor, I accord them all my respect. They have choices. When they choose the wrong path for any reason including stress, I have no sympathy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #18
25. Don't want bullets whizzing by your head? GET OUT OF IRAQ!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
adriennui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #18
27. thank you for your rational response
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #18
33.  They are killing civilians. They are killing babies and young children
So you have no problem with this, then?
IOW, it's BAD when terrorists do it, but UNDERSTANDABLE when Marines do it?

Pick an argument and stick with it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #16
23. while YOU bend over backwards tryikng to defend the inexcusable.
These MURDEREROUS THUGS!

SHAME ON YOU!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Snivi Yllom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #11
28. you need to take a big step back
I know plenty of veterans and they are some of the most respected kind, considerate, and 'humans' of all my acquaintances.

You don't have a fucking clue what you are talking about.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. stop. you're hurting my feelings
:smilie flipping bird:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #11
29. People's heads are getting cut off for you to see, the marines involved
in the "massacre" were on their THIRD duty of this bullshit Bush war, a 3 year old girl was murdered you say? .. any distinction from Bush's bombs kiling even more 3 year old's faster at a much higher rate as we're informed, well that's "colateral damage" we're at war? -- that's different?

No-one in these rooms has a clue as to what our military is experiencing on a 24/7 basis, but at the core their still only human, what would it take for you to shoot a 3 year old?? I'd say you would have to be in rough shape as the safely hidden generals say, "now you marines must be professional in your killing" deon't get personal??
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #29
34. Don't take my condemnation of an individual murderer as an
interpretation of my excusing the mass murderers who sit in centcom. No way. The guilty soldiers are doing on a small scale what the president is doing on a massive scale. The blivet and his cabal are responsible for all this.

But I stand by my belief that no matter how much stress you are under, there is simply no excuse for extra-judicial killing. None.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NoodleyAppendage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. It's no wonder they tend to be Repukes and Fundies then...
If you are taught to be amoral and avoid philosophical conundrums like "good killing vs. bad killing," then you are likely to ascribe to a deontological view of the universe defined by those in power.

J
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #7
32. I'm not sure the USMC would agree.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
12. psychologoically, they have to dehumanize the "enemy"
in this case, the entire population is the "enemy" (or potentially so, or it is just too complicated to sort out the diffferences between "good" hajis and "bad" hajis. Because they aren't "human," killing them is easier. (eventually it catches up with you though)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
13. Who's surprised? This was absolutely guaranteed to happen.
We're an outlaw nation. We invaded based on lies. We're occupying another nation illegally. We dropped bombs that murdered thousands. Anyone who thinks continuing to do the same thing is somehow going to have better results is outa their fucking mind. There's never been a shred of doubt in my feeble little mind, since October 2002 (and before), that innocent men, women, and children would be murdered in Iraq. No matter how many times people are told that waging war is insanity, they just don't seem to get it. There's not a damned thing 'special' about these troops that can't be found in every high school in this country.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
20. They are trained killing machines
so it's not that hard until they have to think about it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jigarotta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
21. Jacobs Ladder with Tim Robbins.
one of the scariest movies I've ever seen... because it just may possibly explain some of these subhumans acts.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jigarotta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. folks, i strongly recommend seeing this movie.
it's well known that the military are given drugs. uppers, downers, whatever they are called.
maybe there is another mix involved as well.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bridgit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:14 PM
Response to Original message
35. bat-shit stink-eye battle crazy...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
36. How battle crazy do US Marines have to be? obviously pretty crazy!
anyone in here walk in these marines boots? have a smidgeon of a clue to the insanity going on daily?

how long could you deal with being over in Iraq -- the weaker soldiers who've committed suicide rather then face the everyday reality of fighting this war are labeled, yellow and weak, yeah, right!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-03-06 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
37. I think it's not a matter of "excusing"...
It seems to me that a lot of people are trying to figure out why this happened, how it could happen. I think most people commenting on it aren't "excusing" the actions of the Marines in questions, they're explaining why it happened. With the exception of some of the most nutty of the wing-nuts, I think most people accept and agree with the individuals in question being prosecuted for murder.

Battle fatigue is real, and its results are one of many reasons why war should always be a last resort. When you send your children off to war, not only do you have to hope that their bodies come back intact, but their souls do as well.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list Thu May 16th 2024, 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC