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malachibk Donating Member (780 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-05-06 04:57 PM
Original message
Need some explanation/debunking help
Ah, my mother. A democrat who knows WAY too many repugs who email her crap 24/7. And she still so badly wants to believe whatever she reads or hears on the news. It's a problem. The latest email she got purports to list the Senators who "VOTED TO GIVE ILLEGAL ALIENS SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS. REGARDLESS OF POLITICAL PARTY, THESE POLITICIANS NEED TO BE DEFEATED IN 2006, 2008 OR 2010 WHENEVER THEY COME UP FOR OFFICE."

This is clearly an oversimplification but of course the email offers no explanation/vote ID #, etc.

I'd love to call her and explain what this 'news' actually is. Help is much appreciated...
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benddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-05-06 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
1. have you tried
http://www.snopes.com ? That is always a good place to look to stomp out these stupid right wing emails.
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malachibk Donating Member (780 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-05-06 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Thanks for the tip
I'll check it out
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-05-06 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
3. illegals cannot get social security legally
The only way they can get it is if they STEAL a social security #, but that would be a problem not specific to just illegals, anyone could use a stolen # to collect benefits.

In addition, if it is true, what bill # and roll call vote was this said vote. HR what? SR what?

You need to educate your mother on SOURCES, on what is credible and how to prove something is credible.

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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-05-06 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
4. from snopes
though you probably already found it by now:

* The subject of the proposed amendment was not about giving (or denying) Social Security benefits to illegal aliens; it was about whether a select group of formerly illegal workers (i.e., those who might obtain legal immigration status if the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2006 were enacted) should be able to receive credit for payments they made into the Social Security system using phony Social Security numbers (i.e., numbers that were invalid or had been assigned to others). Such persons would still be eligible to collect Social Security benefits in the future; they just wouldn't receive credit for payments they had already made into the system.

* The senators named didn't technically vote against Senator Ensign's amendment itself; they voted (by a 50-49 margin) in favor of a Motion to Table (i.e., a motion to permanently kill the pending matter and end any further debate on the subject).

* It was the potential passage of the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act that created the situation Senator Ensign's amendment sought to prevent in the first place (i.e., allowing formerly illegal workers to receive credit for earlier Social Security payments), so the senators who ultimately voted in favor of the immigration reform act might logically be considered at least as responsible for the outcome as those who voted to table the Ensign amendment.

If all of the above made your eyes glaze over, it boils down to this: While the list of who voted which way is accurate, what was being voted on was a motion to table (that is, stick in a closet in hopes that it will never be seen again) a motion to deny former illegals credit for the Social Security payments they made while in the U.S. illegally.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/socialsecurity.asp
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malachibk Donating Member (780 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-05-06 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Just sent that link to my ma before i saw your post!
Thanks
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teach1st Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-05-06 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
5. Media Matters
Maybe this is what the e-mail is about...

http://mediamatters.org/items/200606050002

On the June 2 broadcast of his nationally syndicated radio show, CNN Headline News host Glenn Beck accused "liberals" of wanting to "rape" illegal immigrants by "hav them pay into Social Security" without "allow them to get any of those funds back." In fact, when the Senate considered an amendment by Sen. John Ensign (R-NV) that would have prevented newly legalized immigrants from receiving credit for Social Security benefits for work done as illegal immigrants, Democrats overwhelmingly opposed the amendment, while Republicans strongly supported it. In the May 18 roll-call vote, 38 of the 44 Senate Democrats voted to table the Ensign amendment, while 44 of 55 the Senate Republicans voted to keep the amendment under consideration. Sen. Jim Jeffords (I-VT) also voted to table the amendment, and Sen. John D. Rockefeller IV (D-WV) did not vote. The amendment was tabled by a 50-49 vote, effectively killing the measure.


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