ROVE is Cooperating - Cheney will Resign!

I have thought all along that the Plame operation originated with Cheney. Rove was most likely brought in to assist without knowing of her undercover status. When the story broke Rove realized pretty quickly that he was in danger and he was probably furious that Cheney did not tell him the whole story about Plame. Rove probably made it clear he would try to navigate the minefield without compromising Cheney, but he would not fall on a grenade for him and take the wrap. Don't forget that initially all the players of the Bush inner circle thought this was going to be handled by their boy Johnny Ashcroft and that they could lie with impunity. It was probably immediately after Ashcroft recused himself and Fitz was appointed by Comey that Rove fully realized that he was terribly exposed because of Cheney's amateurish operation to discredit Wilson.

I believe that ultimately Cheney will resign and be pardoned as Smirky leaves office. If my scenario is close to the truth, you can bet that one of the calculations by Rove was Cheney's 16% approval rating and zero possibility of ever being elected as President. This move would allow Smirky/Rove to put somebody in as VP to try and set them up as the '08 front runner for the GOP primary. I know it sounds mad to suggest that any rational person would tie themselves to Smirky's wagon for a few years, but remember we are discussing the GOP where madness is like oxygen.

he has to if it means protecting Bush, too.

ANYONE who goes in with the Bushes for ANYTHING has to swear to take the bullet for them. THAT has been an essential element of their inner circle for decades. That's why I really wonder what the hell Clinton is doing in Poppy's inner circle now.

it will probably sink, but I am curious about this too. The possibility of Cheney resigning I did not figure in. And I forgot all about big poppy. I know that Palast has some stuff on Clinton his 'Democracy' book, some stuff I had never heard about, kind of a quid pro quo thing between him and the repukes. But we do need to move this discussion away from Leopold and Rove and onto what is going on right now with it. Rove will burn in hell ultimately, though that isn't as satifying as a prison term now.

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Cheers!

That means I would get to have him here. :hi:

the same as Arkansas.

:hi: Nice joke...

:hi:

:hi:

Nice running into you here on DU! :)

I just checked back here, but I wasn't expecting to come across you.

Namasté Pachamama! :hug:

Just rummaging through the news and some of the "muck" on the DU....

Namaste Swamp Rodent! :hug:

It's thicker than Godzilla's poo. :D

because I live in Arkansas and he did some good things for folks here while governor.

Can't ya share?

we had him like forever. I don't mind sharing :) Besides, he hangs out at his library from time to time.

:)

under "RW took some inventions from the extreme left - the Nation in this case. And it was Arkansas - shows your respect for accuracy.

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I personally have a much more cynical view. I think threats were made. Of course I have no way of knowing anything but dam I am curious about what happened.

BTW they are all a bunch of chicken hawks no one has the guts to take a bullet for anyone.

IMHO.

I am curious to know why you think that. Cheers!

to Halliburton, where he can do so much with their huge surplus of cash on hand, and his new connections in government.

I have no doubt Bush would pardon the asshole.

Leopold's story was obvious trash from the beginning. There is no reason Rove would "flip" on Cheney. I doubt he was facing serious enough charges to bother anyway. How much time Rove might have spent in jail was never the issue. It was all about avoiding the indictment. If Rove had been indicted, even if he were later found not guilty, Rove would still have had to resign from his White House position. Further, a Rove indictment would have helped the Democrats in the 2006 campaign in many ways - chiefly depriving the GOP of their "architect" and adding to the "culture of corruption" charges Democrats have been making. It was all about avoiding the indictment for Rove, never really about the threat of jail time. Rove wouldn't have bothered to "flip" on Cheney over perjury or obstruction charges. He'd be better off in jail taking one for the team.

Sorry, I think your grasping at straws here.

Truthout should just fire Leopold, and we should all focus on winning in 2006 instead of obsessing about obviously crap stories.

Some of the big mainstream papers were anticipating an indictment during that time as well. Were it 'obvious trash' the thread would have been locked from the first post. It's because of what was being said in the mainstream press that made it very beleivable. DUers aren't that stupid, I don't think.

"Some of the big mainstream papers were anticipating an indictment during that time as well. Were it 'obvious trash' the thread would have been locked from the first post. It's because of what was being said in the mainstream press that made it very beleivable."

Because some of the mainstream press were "anticipating" an indictment doesn't make Leopold's story any less silly. The "mainstream" press did NOT report Rove had been indicted. That is the difference. Big mainstream outlets with serious reputations to protect held back, even if they suspected Rove might be indicted, until they had some actual evidence to back it up. No evidence existed, and the mainstream media opted to wait for facts rather than print guesswork. Leopold obviously rolled the dice thinking the odds were good he could make crap up and get it away with it. He obviously lost that bet and along with it any shred of journalistic integrity he had left.

The magically flexible 24 hours Rove had to "get his affairs in order" nonsense should have been an immediate red flag to everyone. Rove didn't need any amount of time to get his affairs in order. His indictment wasn't going to result in his being hauled off to jail. Many DUers point this out, but as if often the case, too many people simply believed what they wanted to hear instead of critically analyzing what Leopold had written.

"DUers aren't that stupid, I don't think."

Umm, as in any population, yes some are.

The calculation was the relative value of Rove v Cheney to the GOP and BushCo at this point in time. As you correctly observed, a Rove indictment would have caused his resignation and severely limited his future in politics. It is precisely BECAUSE Rove was most likely faced with the stark choice of an indictment by the GJ or cooperation that he flipped on Cheney. IN addition, the Luskin statement on the Fitz letter mentioned all the phrases that would be used by a prosecutor that had reached an agreement with a suspect to cooperate. I have a very hard time believing that ANY person called to the GJ FIVE times was never in danger of indictment.

:eyes:

I need an aspirin.

health issues...with no more control in government it's a typical Cheney move, "don't waste my time!"

I want his rotting corpse dragging down the repubs until the last possible minute.

Any new vp will have a leg up in 08. Maybe just a tiny leg. But still.

Snarlin' Dick is hated by everybody. Well, at least 8 out of 10 people dislike him!

If Wilson indeed had anything on Rove that he could use in a private lawsuit, then Rove had to flip.

Why would Wilson pretend he had a lawsuit if he had nothing on Rove? I think it stands to say that they do have something on him. Which would mean you are correct.

and seeing that she is nominated in '08.

A federal prosecutor has lived up to the oath of his office. His obligation (often violated) is to bring no indictment which he personally does not believe that can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. he told you at his press conference that he will never announce the fact that he has conducted an investigation and has decided not to indict. To say anything about someone he has decided not to seek an indictment against would be a violation of the oath of his office. This is over. Now and forever. Move on. or moveon.org. The story is over. Now and forever.

There is no standard of reasonable doubt, the grand jury is where the indictment would come from, and one's status as a subject, target, or whatever is commonly announced publicly.

But thanks for stopping in to make up a bunch of junk.

and I added in that Chimpy would appoint McCain and if Chimpy was impeached, it would be McCain who would pardon both Chimpy and Cheney. Basically, I see it playing out just like Watergate if we gain back the House, even more likely if we gain both back.

We lost again. Move along. Nothing to see here.

Let's get ready for November, so we can fall short again. Go Democrats! Go Go Go!

We'll get 'em next time. Unless of course, we don't.

I do this stuff for a living. This is the code of conduct for federal prosecutors. There will never be an indictment. there will never be any more indictments. Start dealing with the world of reality,

I also don't think the democrats have a chance in hell of taking control of Anything in November, let alone 2008. I think the die has been cast, and the liberals will continue doing what they do best. Falling short, and losing.

of reality. But we need to win red state districts and we aren't going to do that by living in a fantasy world.

I haven't done shit

I went to work

I live in a Red State, in a Red district

there is a Dem challenger, I should go volunteer,

but I don't like him any better!

Just a DINO

but I acknowledge the reality that our best candidate, John Forbes Kerry, will not be elected. And I concede that Carter and Clinton were a million miles better than the alternative. And I have endured the alternative for going on 6 years now. And I am sick of a war criminal president. I will take anyone but another republican.

democrat trying to wrap herself/himself in republican sheepskin?

that I'm in a Repuke red district, with a repuke congressman

and there is a Dem running, but he is a DINO (pro life, pro military, pro big business)

You sound just like a right wing poster - they use the same expressions.

parties. Think he could be the new VP?

I think Rove and Libby are really turning on Cheney and Bush. Fitz might be getting ready to nail some other people. Perhaps Hadley or Gonzales?

Here's what I think will happen next:

1. Hadley is indicted for perjury and obstruction of justice.

2. Gonzales is indicted for obstruction of justice.

3. Cheney is indicted and resigns.

4. Bush is forced to appoint McCain as VP.

5. Bush resigns to avoid impeachment and get a pardon.

6. McCain is sworn in as President.

It's the Nixon-Agnew-Ford scenario.

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If I sound harsh, good.

People need to wake up and start helping to win an election.