Plameologists: Josh Marshall has some interesting comments today re Libby

(Josh is saying in this that Bush will Pardon Libby either sooner or later. And, I had the same dread when I read DiGenova's comments in Newsday...But will this fly with the American people?)

I missed it when it came out. But it seems the groundwork is now being laid for pardoning Scooter Libby for his alleged crimes relating to the Plame case. How this usually works is a tasked quote-meister like GOP lawyer and uber-insider Joe DiGenova is sent out to give quote floating and legitimizing the idea, to normalize it and make it part of respectable debate.

So here we have him telling Newsday over the weekend that "I think ultimately, of course, there are going to be pardons" in the Libby case and that Patrick Fitzgerald's indictment of Libby "is the epitome of the criminalization of the political process."

-snip-

Make no mistake, this is a trial balloon, an effort to test the waters and prepare the public for Libby's eventual pardon. And you should expect that the president will pardon Libby, perhaps as soon as six months from now, because signals of Libby's impending pardon will raise little concern or controversy in Washington or among name pundits.

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/

Preferably towards the end of October.

Not to be cynical, but it might get a bit of bad publicity in December (when the pardons occur)... but, the RW has such a lock on the media that even if the media is generally negative, the RW propaganda machine will still be able to create reasonable doubt in the process in the minds of many.

the american people do not care one bit about plame.

Right now, the Plame case is only being followed by a very loyal group of "Plameologists" but when (and probably IF) Libby goes to trial, then the whole case goes up on the public radar screen.

Do you think Bush wants quotes and notes from Cheney and other insiders being played out on the evening news? I don't think so.

Bush can keep the whole thing off the public radar screen by pardoning Libby now. There will be a brief shot of outrage from the Democrats but by and large the public won't care. It will die down before the midterm elections.

If I were a political advisor to Dumbya that's how I'd play it.

in the Justice Dept. who aren't Gonzales loyalists. It would mean that the Bushies made a joke out of Fitz's investigation and smells alot like Nixon's actions with Watergate. But, that was a different time when there was a Congress that cared. It does make one wonder where justice can be found if not in the courts anymore.

Maybe the Wilson's should start a Civil Suit immediately. That might cause more attention if Bush pardon's Libby.

because he knows Bush will pardon him.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2346773

I may be wrong, but isn't a pardon given after a conviction, rather than to stave off a trial?

Pardon power is vast with very few limits.

I apologize

However, no President has ever pardoned someone from their own administration during an ongoing investigation into their own administration.

Bush won't because then he will set himself up for an easy impeachment or indictment. Nothing like abuse of power and obstruction of justice to put a crimp in this trial balloon.

that the rest of the team got protected.

BUSH PARDONS WEINBERGER, FIVE OTHERS TIED TO IRAN-CONTRA

(Calls Weinberger "true American patriot") (650) By Dian McDonald USIA White House Correspondent Washington -- President Bush December 24 granted pardons to former Defense Secretary Caspar Weinberger and five other individuals for their conduct related to the Iran-Contra affair.

Bush said Weinberger -- who had been scheduled to go on trial in Washington January 5 on charges related to Iran-Contra -- was a "true American patriot," who had served with "distinction" in a series of public positions since the late 1960s.

"I am pardoning him not just out of compassion or to spare a 75-year-old patriot the torment of lengthy and costly legal proceedings, but to make it possible for him to receive the honor he deserves for his extraordinary service to our country," Bush said in a proclamation granting executive clemency.

The president also pardoned five other persons who already had pleaded guilty or had been indicted or convicted in connection with the Iran-Contra arms-for-hostages investigation. They were Elliott Abrams, a former assistant secretary of state for Inter-American affairs; former National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane; and Duane Clarridge, Alan Fiers, and Clair George, all former employees of the Central Intelligence Agency.

Explaining those pardons, Bush said the "common denominator of their motivation -- whether their actions were right or wrong -- was patriotism." They did not profit or seek to profit from their conduct, Bush said, adding that all five "have already paid a price -- in depleted savings, lost careers, anguished families -- grossly disproportionate to any misdeeds or errors of judgment they may have committed."

Asked about the pardons at a news conference in Little Rock, Arkansas, later in the day, President-elect Clinton said he did not have all the details on the matter and would withhold comment until he had had a chance to study the president's statement and related information.
http://72.14.209.104/search?q=cache:UqJtv7528hkJ:www.fas.org/news/iran/1992/921224-260039.htm+Casper+Weinberger+pardoned&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1

whether their actions were right or wrong -- was patriotism."

Of course much the same could have been said of the Nazi war criminals.

The Bush Crime Family: Fascism with an American accent.

the excuse. Could be the excuse for anything these days.

Continue the legacy of lies and cover-ups.

ny

Many a U.S. President Pays the Pardon Piper
By Robert Scheer
Published March 6, 2001 in the Los Angeles Times


Forget Gerald Ford's pardon of Richard M. Nixon, which, while effectively short-circuiting an ongoing probe of possibly the most egregious behavior of any U.S. president, can be rationalized as a healing gesture. Nixon had accomplished much, and he was by then a broken man.

But unforgivable is what former President George Bush did. He protected himself--a former Reagan administration official--in an ongoing investigation when he pardoned Reagan's Defense secretary, Casper Weinberger, and the rest of the Iran-Contra gang of six.

At the time, Independent Counsel Lawrence E. Walsh bitterly charged that "the Iran-Contra cover-up, which has continued for more than six years, has now been completed"--by presidential fiat. Walsh called it "evidence of a conspiracy among the highest-ranking Reagan administration officials to lie to Congress and the American public" and said that, "in light of President Bush's own misconduct," he was "gravely concerned" about Bush's decision to pardon others.

Bush could easily have been said to have covered up his own potential culpability--far short of anything Clinton has been accused of doing in his pardon of Marc Rich or anyone else. Nor did the Bush Iran-Contra pardons pass the one-more-pardon-before-leaving-the-White-House "smell test" so liberally applied to Clinton's pardons; the pardon came after intensive lobbying by former Reagan aides and many last-minute White House meetings.


http://72.14.209.104/search?q=cache:KKIhGbhlk5EJ:www.robertscheer.com/1_natcolumn/01_columns/030601.htm+Casper+Weinberger+pardoned&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=4

and rightly so... It was their ass on the line...

Contra. But, I wonder if they want to drag themselves through more muck.

John Dean urged them to go that route way back, but they chose not to for whatever reason. Dean said that a Civil Suit had more power in this case than an Indpendent Counsel would for subpoening information from this Administration. I guess one could think about the Paula Jones case where Supremes allow a citizen to prosecute a President.

I hope the Wilson's will do this. Otherwise Bush does just what his Poppy did and declares Libby a national hero with long service to the government and pardons.

I hate to think about it ....so depressing.

the Wilsons have delayed a civil suit so as to not intefere with the Special Prosecutor's investigation. Last week, the Wilsons' legal firm put out a statement after the Rove non-indictment that the Wilsons retained their options to pursue the matter. The Wilsons would not jeopardize the investigation.

Also, the issue is if Bush pardoned Libby, then there would also have to be a pardon on Cheney. That's a whole different kettle of stinking dead fish. The reason Fitz is being REALLY careful AND looking at the calendar is if Libby is pardoned, but Fitzgerald has more than one avenue to nail Darth Cheney's coffin, then he has Bush in a dark scary corner too. Fitz has evidence and people who have rolled over. The charges Bush would be pardoning are lying and obstruction of Justice. Could bush do the same say after Libby was pardoned and THEN Darth Cheney gets charged. It's looking very much like a Catch-22 for bush. This is a game of the calendar right now.

to keep the evidence against Cheney from coming out under further discovery if he feels Fitz is getting close to indicting Cheney. He also could pardon both declaring as his father did with Weinberger that both have a long history of patriotic public service.

Since Rove is off the media has been muzzled again, which would lead one to believe they've figured out that the Bushies will start building the support for eventual pardons for them all. If his father did it for Weinberger and five other Iran Contra participants what's to stop Bush from doing it, particularly if they've set the stage by having the Media compliant in downplaying what happened with Plame. Public has short memories...and many probably already believe that what the Bushies did was no big deal with exposing Plame. :shrug:

with us daily. bush's legacy would be forever tarnished and judged a moral failure. Fear of being permanently branded a failure is what is keeping bush in check. He certainly could pardon Cheney & Libby, but at what cost? Many people assume Libby is the singular way to get Cheney (Rove helped smooth that rocky road.) The truth is that the war was a moral and legal failure, the media complict and duplicit and Bush would be publicly acknowledging that as completely true if he has to pardon people to quash the truth. A Catch-22.

The public believes the liars that call themselves journalists because the narrative is controlled by the corporate parents, their editors and producers. The corporate media (NBC, Time, NYT, WaPo, Newsweek, Fox, WSJ, NRO etc,)have a stake in making this disappear - but they haven't been very successful in their disinformation campaign. Pardons can't excuse the deaths of over 2500 brave men and women and tens thousands of Iraqis or the disfigurement of thousands more. The public through all the media manipulation and bush butt kissing have clearly come down on the fact that this war was wrong from the beginning. Libby & Cheney, the incubators of evil, may just be the corrupt folks who will do the lasting damage to the bush name in politics.

....for Libby. I think that was a huge strategic mistake. So one of the lawyers has a conflict? It wasn't Luskin. Hire another damn lawyer, then. The citizens have a right to a speedy trial of the accused, don't they? (They should.)

The '06 mid-terms were the primary concern of the political pansies in the White House. Libby is in a "do no harm" to Cheney and Bush mode. All of Scooters toothless saber rattling about getting administration docs to prove his circular logic true have been tossed out by the judge. Meanwhile fitz has kept his hand close to vest and Libby is desperate for a peak. The longer he has to wait the more psychic pressure builds on Team Libby. Bush has to wait until after the mid term elections to knight Libby - but Fitz is under no obligation to seek an indictment from the GJ until he has collected more evidence in his investigation. Cheney is just hanging out there thinking if Libby hangs tough then the worst could be over. It's the anticipation of the worst that has the crooks freaking out, the reality would almost be a relief. Fitz can just collect the facts and choose when he has collected enough multiple sources and witnesses when he should go back before the GJ and start laying out his case.

It's bush the Arrogant's call and he's playing blind man bluff with Fitz.

putting us $9 trillion in the hole. No matter, one criminal will give another a pardon.

It's not like he's Marc Rich. :sarcasm:

At least all the ones I can remember. It doesn't matter much because the very controversial ones are done at the very end of the Prez's term in office, and those who are upset complain loudly for a while, then it goes into history.