MAJORITY of AMERICANS agree with 13 Dem Senators on Iraq withdrawal

So do the Iraqi people (87%) and the US Soldiers polled in Iraq 73%


That should be the ONLY TALKING POINT that we use about this vote.


And THAT should be the campaign issue. The senate needs lawmakers who reflect the concerns of the American and Iraqi PEOPLE for a change, instead of those Republican Rubberstampers doing the bidding of a delusional dictatortot.

The media won't say it - we MUST not forget to say it. The MAJORITY of American people agree with Democrats.

There's a thread going on this - looking for final tally

Kerry, Feingold, Kennedy, Boxer, Durbin, Harkin, Menendez, Lautenberg, Akaka, Inoye, Leahy, Wyden, and Jeffords (I think - I took these from posts on the Kerry group)

or Wyden.

I'm particularly dissapointed in Harry Reid. He should have represented us better.

with the military machine that spans the globe? Not that it makes a difference one way or the other.

in those who don't have the guts to stand up and say this war was a mistake, and that it is wrong to stay and keep hitting the hornet's nest with a stick.....:cry:

So no one can see the results of the failure. One reason they will never be able to agree on withdraw is because the rest of the world will get to see the aftermath of what is left and what happened to Iraq at the hands of the US. Many other reasons to be sure but just think how ugly it will be when the world gets to see and hear the real story

The war is over, but the occupation continues (in it's second decade)

I think of the phrase every time I see the keystone kongress voting against the will and wishes of the American people.

voted against it?

we will be there for many more years until the cost, both in lives and money have started to affect more people

right now, too many people are fat, dumb, and happy, and loading up on their credit card debt

Let the GOPs hang on Stay the Course, and challenge them to explain what Stay the Course means.

These 13 are heroes. The other 87 should be shipped off to Iraq to get their asses shot off IMHO.

I'm sure a couple of those running who voted against the amendment will pay a price at the polls.

Kerry and Feingold both made superior arguments. Would you want to be the Dem arguing between those two?

amendments, which I must admit were both good, they were at least trying to get a exit plan executed. But in November it will be payback time to do some major house and senate cleaning.

,

I read your post as "why aren't they" instead of "when"... but right now, don't they relate? We aren't up to "when" right yet, and "why" well, that's where post 8 comes in.

maybe we'll NEVER get out of our arm-chairs until they come drag all of us off to secret camps. the when is my REAL issue in the two protest OPs I posted: first, the rallying plea for unity got no votes or constructive comments. Second the irrational anger GOT lots of votes and support. read this: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1490722

of the people................they prove that every day........they go with the flow and rubber stamp bushs every whim....disgusting :puke:

Statement by John Kerry on the Kerry-Feingold-Boxer-Leahy Amendment



Below is a statement from John Kerry on his amendment to redeploy U.S. combat forces from Iraq by July 1, 2007, with a rapid reaction force staged elsewhere in the Middle East. Troops to conduct targeted counter-terrorism operations, those essential to finish training Iraqi security forces, and those needed to protect U.S. personnel and facilities would remain in Iraq.



13 Senators voted for the amendment today.



“This vote today was a dramatic step forward in forcing a Congress that shares responsibility for getting us into Iraq to take responsibility for finally getting the policy right in Iraq.



“It was a vote to do what’s right for our troops, our country, and Iraq. Our numbers are growing and our ability to apply constant pressure to change course is stronger than it was just a week ago.



“Setting a deadline to redeploy U.S. troops from Iraq is necessary for success in Iraq and victory in the war on terror. Iraqi politicians have proven they only respond to deadlines - a deadline to transfer authority, deadlines to hold two elections and a referendum, and a deadline to form a government. Now we need another deadline to get Iraq up on its own two feet. Our troops have done their part, it’s time for the politicians in Iraq and the United States to do their job.



“Half the names on the Vietnam Wall are there because old men in Washington were too proud to admit a mistake, so they kept sending young men to stay a course they knew was not working. ‘Stay the course’ is not a strategy for victory in Iraq and the War on Terror. This administration is wrong. It is time to get Iraq right.”

There appears to be too much pressure from corporate lobbyists and the DLC on this issue. Dems had better watch out or they'll face a serious challenge next time they're up for re-election - and it won't just be the GOP they'll have to worry about.

The gutless Dem's that voted no on Kerry's resolution need to be called "Lieberman Democrats".

tatement by John Kerry on the Kerry-Feingold-Boxer-Leahy Amendment



Below is a statement from John Kerry on his amendment to redeploy U.S. combat forces from Iraq by July 1, 2007, with a rapid reaction force staged elsewhere in the Middle East. Troops to conduct targeted counter-terrorism operations, those essential to finish training Iraqi security forces, and those needed to protect U.S. personnel and facilities would remain in Iraq.



13 Senators voted for the amendment today.



“This vote today was a dramatic step forward in forcing a Congress that shares responsibility for getting us into Iraq to take responsibility for finally getting the policy right in Iraq.



“It was a vote to do what’s right for our troops, our country, and Iraq. Our numbers are growing and our ability to apply constant pressure to change course is stronger than it was just a week ago.



“Setting a deadline to redeploy U.S. troops from Iraq is necessary for success in Iraq and victory in the war on terror. Iraqi politicians have proven they only respond to deadlines - a deadline to transfer authority, deadlines to hold two elections and a referendum, and a deadline to form a government. Now we need another deadline to get Iraq up on its own two feet. Our troops have done their part, it’s time for the politicians in Iraq and the United States to do their job.



“Half the names on the Vietnam Wall are there because old men in Washington were too proud to admit a mistake, so they kept sending young men to stay a course they knew was not working. ‘Stay the course’ is not a strategy for victory in Iraq and the War on Terror. This administration is wrong. It is time to get Iraq right.”

spins and lies. I don't know if a door to door campaign is appropriate or what. But with the Republican Corporate owned media just spewing crap out of the white house, we need to fight them and not lay down hoping for an angel to rescue us.

WE are the angels!

Just as in, We need to become the media.

the term, "representative" isn't true at all anymore. If these people were actually public servants "representing" their constituency, there would indeed be a lot of differences in our political makeup right now.

to do it for us like the GOPs have, so the added burden is on us.

There are only so many ways we can do that. Most newspapers and TV news are owned by huge conglomerates that are behind the great red menace, and few of the smaller outlets want to risk it all by reporting and investigating anything seemingly detrimental to this administration. The bravery that is shown comes from online sources or those outside of the US. Yes, there are a few "freedom fighters" out there who will make a move toward dissenting, but we know who they are for the most part, and can't trust or count on too many others who are willing to take a stronger position.

I say it every day, myself, in about a dozen different ways. It's no easy task to match their relentlessness, but there is no alternative course.

take a couple of friends.
set up a table in a popular public place such as a Farmer's market.
bring some printed literature and, if possible, merchandise such as buttons and car stickers
and talk to anyone who stops to chat.

Ask them to join your group and help you talk to voters.

Don't charge them any money and sell your merchandise at cost. Don't sell it for a campaign unless you are properly registered to do that.

Shout at the fainthearted.

.

I was mad because both my demcritters voted NO. I will call them and be both patient and firm.

I wish the rest of them painful rashes in their nether regions.

No, that's not harsh enough.

and the Iraqi and troop polls?

Surely you have seen these polls around DU in recent days haven't you? Or did you hear all those senators citing the polls in their speeches last night?



Here - since you seem to have missed the reports AND the debate last night, I will seek it out for you.

This Gallup Poll shows that more Americans support setting a timetable for withdrawal from Iraq then don't.

http://poll.gallup.com/videoArchive/?ci=23380&pg=

17% Withdraw Now
32% Withdraw in 12 mo
42% As Long As It Takes
6% Send More Troops


And here's the troops:
http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1075

U.S. Troops in Iraq: 72% Say End War in 2006


Le Moyne College/Zogby Poll shows just one in five troops want to heed Bush call to stay “as long as they are needed”
While 58% say mission is clear, 42% say U.S. role is hazy
Plurality believes Iraqi insurgents are mostly homegrown
Almost 90% think war is retaliation for Saddam’s role in 9/11, most don’t blame Iraqi public for insurgent attacks
Majority of troops oppose use of harsh prisoner interrogation
Plurality of troops pleased with their armor and equipment
An overwhelming majority of 72% of American troops serving in Iraq think the U.S. should exit the country within the next year, and more than one in four say the troops should leave immediately, a new Le Moyne College/Zogby International survey shows.

The poll, conducted in conjunction with Le Moyne College’s Center for Peace and Global Studies, showed that 29% of the respondents, serving in various branches of the armed forces, said the U.S. should leave Iraq “immediately,” while another 22% said they should leave in the next six months. Another 21% said troops should be out between six and 12 months, while 23% said they should stay “as long as they are needed.”

17% Withdraw Now
32% Withdraw in 12 mo
42% As Long As It Takes
6% Send More Troops

49% say withdraw now or within 12 months.

It's Gallup - add 5 points and you have a majority.

Funny how you keep using the date when you know that date wasn't used for the polls. The date was just entered yesterday.

But, I think it's cute how you are trying to assume that the American people somehow wouldn't support July 2007, because it's not June 20, 2007.

HAHAH.... good luck with that.

with Gallup polls and there are many others here who do the same. It's kind of a running joke, that's not really a joke - like the Colbert report .

BTW - You weren't aware of the troop polls, either? I know they are 4 months old, but that likely means they have increased in % points, by now, too.

One thing that is problematic is most soldiers if you ask them that question will reply "no comment" because it is what they are trained to do. That factor may disturb the methodology. I'm not saying it's a good poll or bad poll, just saying that I find polling the troops problematic in that way. I suspect the troops are divided pretty much as Americans in general our divided, but perhaps wanting the mission to succeed, or at this point at least not be a 100% failure.

about it last night. Please be patient while I grab that last "shred" for you.

Though I'm not so sure that any of these stats are actually a concern to you.

Lucky for me this was just posted - the poll is a bit old - the poll numbers are probably much HIGHER NOW, though, from the 87% shown here - hell - maybe it's 95% by now, wouldn't you agree?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1486841

"A large majority favors setting a timeline for the withdrawal of US forces, though this majority divides over whether the timeline should be over a period of six months or two years."

The majority of Iraqis, I believe, agree with the majority of Americans in that we should leave, just not "too soon" so as to leave things in chaos, and there must be no permanent bases. This poll does not give any evidence that the majority of Iraqis support a July 2007 absolute deadline, however.

Any more "evidence" to submit?

Looks to me like you are trying to make it into an exact measurement issue, because I just presented you with 3 polls that prove that a withdrawal plan is desired by TROOPS, IRAQIS, and AMERICAN PEOPLE.

Kerry-Feingold amend was put up yesterday - you are well aware that the SPECIFICS of the bill were not used in polls that span a 6 month period.

The general aspect of the bill fits well into the general aspect of the polls taken. But, you know that. You don't LIKE IT - but, you know it.

Just do the math.

And if you had any inkling how Gallup works, you'd understand that they are heavily biased against Dem positions and candidates.

not offer the proof you claim in your OP.

I think it is dangerous for the Democratic Party at this time to be under any false illusions that a clear majority of Americans are in agreement with the 13 senators. That simply isn't the case.

Regardless, the fact is the ammendment would have changed nothing, even if it had passe.

you favor, it would not mean that the troops would be withdrawn anytime sooner, or by July 2007.

You do understand that, right?

I was a dingbat in highschool.

The outcome is that a DEBATE for responsible withdrawal of the troops was finally begun in the senate and the Dems are beginning to make starker contrast with the Bush policy than they were ever able to do as a party.

Don't begrudge the good that could come of this move.

If you're talking about this poll:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/polls/tables/live/2006-06-12-poll.htm

The 13 senators voted for a timeline.

32% of those polled voted for a timeline.

What the majority agrees on with the 13 Senators (and everybody else in the Democratic Party) is on setting some plan for withdrawal.

17% withdraw immediately - no timeline presented

32% withdraw in 12 months time

42% withdraw - no timeline wanted

Even if I accepted your adding 32 + 17, which I don't, 49% is not far enough past the MOE to be all that significant, especially if you're depending on this one poll. In any case, 49% isn't a majority, is it?

Are there other polls covering this issue?

It stands to reason that the 17% would accept the quickest route out as presented as a beginning to withdraw with a date certain.

It would have been more accurate to say PLURALITY, but, then again, this is a Gallup Poll, and they tend to be UBERconservative so I always add 5 points to the Dem position or candidate being polled. You may recall I've said that about a hundred times here at DU. ;)

is probably the quickest route to a majority ;)

But all that stands to reason to me is there is no consensus on timelines, not in Congress and not in the country. Not yet.

here at DU that on Gallup and Rasmussen, I add 5 five points because of their biased methods.

Like i said, plurality should have been used, but, since its' Gallup...........

:kick: