I have some questions

How is it that 500,000 illegal immigrates can protest without 10,000 police with,mace and billy clubs breathing over their shoulders,making numerous arrests? Where are the restricted zones? Why is it when WE protest,there are so many rules and regulations we have to abide by? From what I've seen,it looks like they are doing what they damn well please. 500,000 or more of them in the streets...WHY AREN'T THEY WORKING??? They have all the damn jobs.....are their employers giving them time off to protest?

My son was laid off from Sears 2 years ago after 13 yrs.They got rid of most of the Americans and hired Mexicans,Somalians and what ever else that wasn't a US citizen. Before my son was laid off,they had him reduced down to helping clean bathrooms. They made a special bathroom for them to go pray and they even had a place for them to wash their feet....some kind of religious ritual and my son had to clean up the water they splashed all over the floor.They couldn't speak English,so communication with them was zilch. What was once a decent job that my son had was slowly turned into a shit job,thanks to all those illegals.Now my son is going through all kinds of mental and health problems,no job,has had a major surgery and has to go through another one next month which is life threatening.We paid his rent and bought him groceries until he went to the hospital and we finally had to quit....it was putting us deeper and deeper in the hole. I am a very compassionate and understanding person,but this damn shit of people coming here every year by the millions and taking all the jobs has me pissed off royally.My son is having a terrible time getting the help he needs,but if he was an illegal he'd be setting damn pretty right about now.

I'm sorry,but I say send the 11 million back to where they came from and give the people who were born and raised here a chance for the "American dream".I know I will get flamed for this and this post will probably be deleted but I don't really care. I'm sick and tired of keeping my mouth shut in what is supposed to be a "free" country.

The media whore coverage over the illegals and their whining has made me sick,when I have to think about my 34 year old son in the shape HE is in and can't get squat. Where in the hell is HIS rights?
They won't put him on disability and I damn sure don't have the money to support him with another apartment,groceries and paying his bills. Shit,I don't know what to do or where to turn.That's my rant and if I have offended anyone sorry....just put yourself in my son's or my shoes.It ain't easy.:rant:

Yup, it's Them. Those People. You know how THEY are.

Redstone

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

I guess that makes you "them." If we're going to be doing that, which the same I don't make a habit of.

Redstone

You have NO IDEA what nationality I am. Geesus....

how far back must my ancestors have been here? Sounds like your family is having a tough time, but don't think this is the answer.

came here over the Bering Land Bridge...omigod, we're actually RUSSIANS!

But you know what? It doesn't matter to me that one side of my family was here before the white folks showed up. It doesn't give me ANY right to start throwing loaded words like "them" around.

Sorry to get personal, but I detest racists mor than just about any other kind of person...not saying that you're a racist, but dang, you come close to sounding like one with your "those people" talk.

Xenophobia is right on the border of racism, and the line gets easy to cross when you get bitter. Be careful.

Redstone

:7

How far back would your ancestors have to be "born and raised here" in order to stay?

Edited to add, oh never mind. It was too snarky, sorry. peace

Sounds like your family is having a hard time.

And if somebody calls you a racist for speaking up, fuck 'em.

I am full of fear of losing my only son. Even if he pulls through,he may not be able to work again. But this is America...as you can see from some of the other posts, WHO GIVES A FUCK?

You do know that on average, you have to make three to five runs at it. They make it hard, figuring people like you will give up. It's a cost-savings plan for them.

and start trying to figure out how to resolve a problem.

If you'd like help with that, there are plenty of people here for you.

What we don't want to hear is a bunch of racist crap.

I'm very sorry your son is having hard time, if you'd like some help - I have an HR background and will be more than willing to take a look at a resume, offer some advice on jobhunting, interviewing, etc. Just PM me.

WTF does that have to do with illegal immigration?

They are too cheap to pay Americans wages and can practically get the alien workers for pathetically low wages. I can't blame anyone one for trying to get a job, but I do think think if companies were fined for the illegals it wouldn't have gotten so bad.

You can't blame poor people for coming to a place where they have jobs available. Just like you cannot blame Indians or Mexicans or Chinese for our jobs being sent over there. The people to blame are the greedy corporations and business owners who think that Americans who want a good job, at a decent salary, with human benefits are just asking for too much. They want employees who will work for less than minimum wage, who will accept a job with no benefits and will be grateful for it. It is the corporations and the business owners who do not want to hire Americans that deserve the anger - not the poor who just want to live...

If the illegals wouldn't be so eager to work for minimum wages with no insurance,the big corporations would have to pay higher wages with benefits. I am sick of hearing they do the jobs most Americans won't. Americans want a better wages so they can live better. With the price of gas and everything else going through the roof.....what the heck is wrong with THAT?

required to pay a decent wage with decent benefits, we will be in this problem. Just unloading on the poor immigrant may feel good, but it misses the mark and is really unfair...

The same thing happened during the Great Depression. People worked for peanuts, because they were HUNGRY. There's no social welfare in their homelands to speak of. Starving sucks.

As for the demonstrations, the cops didn't count on the numbers that showed up. At that point, what do you do? You watch, if there is no violence, you engage in crowd control as needed, and leave it at that. The network/cable media didn't monitor Spanish newspapers or radio, so it took the English speaking majority by surprise.

People in this country have been given to understand that if you work hard, educate your kids, give them every advantage, they will do better than you did. Pushing a broom isn't moving up that ladder. Picking onions isn't, either. Shoveling shit in the broiling sunshine isn't what most of us want for the next generation. Someone has to do these jobs, and these folks are willing to do them.

The illegals aren't "eager" -- they're desperate. If they could work in an air conditioned car rental joint in their homeland, or even as a waiter, for the same or even slightly less wages, they'd stay home. There ain't no work, though. What are ya gonna do????

hey. Those jobs, in this area, are now gone for my kids due to our given situation. This is a fact. I also sick and tired of people saying these are jobs that no one wants to do. It's a damn lie. It's a chimp line that amany of DU'ers are buying into.

Be mad at YOUR GOVERNMENT for not cracking down on these big employers that hire them and turn these jobs into badly paying jobs.

Don't be mad at the immigrants. They are coming here because they want a better life for themselves. It is up to OUR GOVERNMENT to crack down on the EMPLOYERS who are allowed to hire them for $2.00 an hour or whatever. That is why they are here.

....up to ALL AMERICANS to DEMAND that our borders be shut down so thee are no illegals AND SO OUR PEOPLE have the jobs available. I sympathize TOTALLY with the original message.

because they are better workers? Or because the business owners just like them better because they enjoy the accents? Will American workers work for $3.00 and hour, for 10 hours, 6 days a week with no over time and no benefits? Would you? It isn't the "illegals" who are creating this problem, it is the business owners.

.....another person's wages then they will have to pay American's American wages. Come on, if I want your job bad enough of course I'm going to tell your boss I will work for $1.00 less an hour than you will. BUT, if the boss has no choice but to pay American wages, they will do so.:banghead:

If employers couldn't hire them, they wouldn't come.

I agree that we need more money for border enforcement, but that is a really difficult job. Better to address the problem at the source rather than playing catchup.

And I completely and totally disagree with the provision in that bill that anyone aiding an illegal will be a felon. How about anybody HIRING an illegal? NOW you're talking.

Yeah!

authorities were expecting some 30,000 to attend. Instead, some media reports have put the crowd at 750,000-1,000,000. So many people attended that L.A.P.D. was simply caught unprepared. (Think of the L.A. demo as the human analogue of Katrina.)

Who's the real enemy here? Working-class Mexicans (and other nationalities) who work for a living or the global capitalist system that will spare no effort to exploit for profit? If all undocumented Mexicans were deported from Los Angeles, the city would shut down -- no restaurants, no car washes, no nannies, no gardeners.

If I had to choose between an American economic nationlist like this poster and a Mexican day laborer, I think I'd choose the latter for common decency's sake.

I thought this was DU - not FreeRepublic.....

Disgusting shit on DU lately on the immigrant issues :puke:

.....a differing view emerges and it's FR. So much for allowing differing views.:sarcasm:

:hi:

it's the racist immigrant bashing view.

I thought *we* were different.

:shrug:

American history, going back to the early 19th century. (One of the fore-runners of the Republican party were the "Know Nothings," an early nativist fringe party.)

bust the air traffic controllers union without calling a general strike to shut the country down, that was a signal moment.

Forgot to add this to my intial reply.

illegals and firing US citizens.....UNION BUSTING.

the U.S. labor movement took the attitude of "We've got ours, the rest of the world's workers be damned." (Same criticsm can be made of American feminism, I think.)

What the American labor movement failed to realize was how deeply it was despised by the corporate elite. They would sell the country down the river if it allowed them to bust a union or exploit people more.

Remember the Department of Homeland Security? Couldn't have a labor union there, b/c mangement needed flexibility. And we've seen how well DHS functioned during Katrina, now haven't we?

It's the bosses who demoted your son...not the illegals...or maybe they were just foreigners who were here legally, but their brown skin makes you think they're illegal?

I told my kid to suck it up, get a job and get on her two feet. We paid her bills for one month and told her she was on her own after that. It worked. She got a job. Now she has a new car, insurance and can support her kids.

We were not going to keep aiding her laziness and let her blame the world for her rotten life.

She thanks us now, because she's smart enough to know that it was the best move we ever made.

I'm not interested in flaming you, I just think your post is racist. You found a group of people to blame for your son's inability to take care of himself and it's insulting.

Try a mirror.

.....who allow this that are ultimately to blame. Passing the blame around is easy but DEMANDING that the government close the borders so our people have the jobs would take some responsibility on our part. Can't have any of that crap.:sarcasm:

Once he has his second surgery I'll yank him out of his hospital bed and kick his ass to the nearest employment office.Racist my fucking ass. I think your comments were insulting and racist also.:eyes:

I'm sorry for him--in many ways.

Just like Ms. Bay Buchanan (ms. racist herself)you advocate deporting all 11 million of 'them'. Let's just put 'them' in train cars. :sarcasm:

You bitched about the horrible :eyes: work your poor son had to do at a job and blamed 'them'. You blamed 'them' because YOU had to pay your son's bills. You blamed everyone else for your son's lot in life.

Life sucks, life's a bitch and life's unfair. Most people don't feel the need to blame all the brown skinned people because of their 'hard' times.

Don't expect everyone in DU to fall over and feel sorry for you and your son in order for you to justify your racism.

I don't doubt you find my comments insulting, but it wasn't me who was saying 'them' and 'they' and giving such great description of those who came here to work. As I said, take a long look in the mirror.

......side of the story is when they or a close loved one is put out of work by a Mexican or any illegal alien:think: - right in front of their eyes.:banghead:

People at DU talk about jobs being outsourced to other countries but they don't the the outsourced jobs right here within our own borders.

I am so sorry for the position your son is in right now and wish him the very best.:hug: I've been there and done that one.

No one is "put out of work by a Mexican"! They are put out of work by a greedy business owner or corporation who would rather work someone at near slave wages rather than someone who will demand a decent wage with human benefits! It isn't the poor immigrant that ie at fault, here; it is the greed of the owners...

......to hire Americans. So again I say close the borders and then Americans will have jobs. We close our borders Mexicans will find some where else to go.:think:

More money for border enforcement AND we crack down on the greedy corporatist bastards who hire them? If we fined every employer $10,000 every time we caught them employing people who are non-citizens you bet your bippy that we'd have enough money to hire 500 extra border guards in no time.

"Mexican" or "any illegal alien" per se.....

It's greedy corporate America.

It's laws designed and selectively enforced by the US Gov't to ensure "we" have a cheap labor force to fall back on. They're here when we need them and we can send them away when we don't.

It's "Americans" who are too darned lazy or "too good" to do the dirty, thankless, lowpaying jobs.

"They" are people who have wives and children and husbands and brothers and mothers. People who have nothing in their own countries (in part due to US policies). People who leave everything they have and everyone they know in order to come here under great difficulty/danger and take the crappiest jobs no one else will take for the least pay and live in the worst dumps with an excess of others in order that they may send home $$$ so their grandmother can get the medicine she needs to stay alive or their children can actually EAT!!! (And yeah, I'm basing this on true stories of people I know.)

There is no "THEY" - there is only people.

I thought the people in here were more caring than this,but man did I ever get a rude awakening. What the fuck is a forum for if you can't discuss things? There are a lot of people on this board who are total uncaring selfish assholes. I'm glad you are not one of them. :hi: :hug:

And that you didn't care.

This thread showed me how insensitive and uncaring people are. I thought it was different in here,but this is more like FR. Democrats or "left leaning" people are no different than they are. This proves it.

Making felons out of more than 10 million working people? (plus anyone who aids them!)

as a result of the wedge the Repukes are driving between us.
Divide and Conquer.

Just perfect.

Don't blame Cafta, or the Fascist Governments or the Big Corps that are outsourcing the good jobs or hiring the cheap labor. Blame the Victims.

Perfect.

While we are cutting each other's throats, Rove & Co are standing back laughing so hard, they are peeing their pants.

important question is not 'How you feel about immigration?' but rather who is framing the question. It seems to me that false questions are constantly being thrown at us by the powers that be.

What are we going to do about social security?, is a perfect example. If they cut one air craft carrier from the budget it could supply social security for five years. It's a false question to force a false solution.

It's really sad seeing so many people fall for this. It's so obvious :(

would find some other group to use as a scapegoat to blame for everyone's problems. Would it be Native Americans? Jews? Blacks? People with blue eyes? Left-handed people? What ever group YOU are a part of?

...of those issues where people think with emotions first, logic second.

issue. Onething Rove is not, is STUPID. He is an evil genius.

.....to see what would happen if our borders were shut down and secured. I'd just like to see and a lot of other Americans would like to see it for themselves.:banghead:

My son may not live and these asswipes are telling me to tell my son to get off his lazy ass and get a job??? What the fuck are these people SMOKING???

....the democrats nor the republicans seem to have much of that stuff these days.

The illegal alien problem has the Democrats with "the more the merrier" attitude and the Republicans have the "let's make it nice a show" attitude. Me, I'd like to see some concrete results for once. Clap down on the borders and then we will deal with everything else.

Again, I am VERY SORRY for your son's medical issues and employment situation.:hug:

They'd be the "New Mexicans"--and if the labor force got too small, they'd just make the standards harder, and flunk out more kids to pick lettuce...

......how much many Mexicans get hired then. We can blame the corporations and anything else or anyone else that we want to blame but try closing the borders firs and then see what happens.:banghead:

Was Sears the only employer in that town?

.....should never happen. An American should NEVER be put out of work in favor of any illegal alien. :banghead:

The bossman did the math, and figured he could get TWO, or maybe even THREE, uncomplaining Mexicans for the cost of one uppity American.

Look UP the ladder, there's the greedy bastard. The illegal alien just wants to feed his family.

.....two or three workers for every American. First, close the borders though.:wtf:

:sarcasm:

This is the most ignorant post I've read so far at DU. :party:

Your son got sick because of foreigners? Please.

Or have mommy read it to you. I never blamed anyone for my son's illness. Geesus...

"My son is having a terrible time getting the help he needs,but if he was an illegal he'd be setting damn pretty right about now."

How so?

The reality is that your son's former employer is breaking the law, if he's hiring illegals and paying them less than legally required. If the gov't enforced those laws, the problem wouldn't exist. This is like blaming Columbian peasants for America's cocaine consumption. Your post is swimming in xenophobic resentment toward people who speak different languages and have different customs. Yes, that's called racism. They're not "taking" our jobs; our businesses are giving them away. But instead of focusing on the real causes of these problems, you'd rather focus your rage on the poorest, least empowered people in the world. "Setting pretty," indeed.

:thumbsup:

I hate when white people can't find work. Makes me want to stomp minorities.

Oops. I used my inside-my-head voice again.

:puke:

Can't you fucking READ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you can't read what I said in my original post,just forget it. Some people,you just can't through to and I've wasted enough time trying to defend my son and his rights. He's just another "lazy white boy" who may not live,but damn him,why is he is a nursing home? He should be out there flipping burgers......he has NO RIGHT TO BE SICK. Geesus H Khrist. This is un-fucking-believable.

You said you paid his groceries and rent for his apartment....now he's in a nursing home????

Come on, truth time.

We couldn't afford to keep it up,so when he was in the hospital we packed his stuff up and stored it here. We had to give his apt.up......we are not rich.He went from the hospital to the nursing home where he has to stay until his 2nd surgery. I don't know what is going to happen. I wish I was lying.It would be a lot easier if all this wasn't true.

I shouldn't have said it. These types of threads never seem to go well and I had told myself I wasn't going to get into it again.

I will say this...please don't blame other people for how badly things have gone for you and your family. It serves no one least of all you.

My strong suggestion is for you and your family to take a breather, talk to someone...a counselor, a friend, or whoever you feel comfortable with. It will help deal with the stress. Sometimes you can get help in the most unexpected places.

My hubby was out of work for 18 months and we came very close to losing everything. We had no help from anyone except welfare. The VA wouldn't and workman's comp cut him off when a birth abnormality associated with his injury was discovered. We didn't get much from welfare, but the little bit we got, helped enough for us to survive. It was just enough to take some of the pressure off.

I wish the best for you and your family.

WTF are you even saying? If you can't pay his medical bills, that's because our country isn't following the same, wise, socialist track on medicine that every other decent nation in the world has. There is a total disconnect in your logic here. As Mr. Pitt asked, what has it got to do with illegal immigrants?

you said he was sick and had/needed surgery - nothing about dying.

How about a deep breath.

What - exactly - is wrong with him?

Where does he live? What - exactly - has been done to secure disability?

How long ago did he leave his job? Did he leave voluntarily? Under what conditions?

What agencies have you contacted?

His insides are a mess....he has Chron's disease and he has to wear a shit bag on his stomach. It has to be changed pretty often.He has numerous other things wrong with him and he is in a damn nursing home. The Dr is running more tests on him and says he has a 75% chance of this second surgery not working. He could die with all that is wrong with him. I'm going to get off here,have a good cry and not post anymore. I'm sorry I even brought it up. I thought DU was better than this.

You must be very upset and very emotional with the situation with your son.
There is no way that you could possibly see this situation in any way except as how it has affected your son.
There can be no view, except a very emotional and heartbreaking view for you.

I am very sorry about your son.

I still do not believe that illegal aliens are the cause of his illness.
If anything, it is Bush's shitty health care policies that have made his situation so unbearable. It should never have gotten this bad, and would not have, if health care was what it should be. Job or no job.

:hug: :cry:

Are you in the right place?

This has to be the biggest group of uncaring folks I've ever talked to in DU. It makes me sick. I thought I was around a terrific group of people,but damn my eyes are wide open now.

the Irish at the turn of the 20th Century...
and against every single wave of immigrants as they hit the shores of this country by those who preceded them, even if it was ony by 20 years.
...and even against the Native Americans, by the self-righteous Americans who thought they had more of a right to this land and its riches than those who were here before the Pilgrims.

improve their lives, educate their kids, and their children started acquiring political power, which led to city jobs, a higher standard of living, and a bit of influence, the Eye-talians were the next up on the whipping boy block!

You'd think, over the years, seeing this sort of change happen again and again, that people would get used to it, and find ways to structure it to mitigate the inevitable pain that occurs in some sectors of the economy. It's a bell that can't be unrung, no matter how much one rails about it.

:cry:

as far as the illegal immigrants 'stealing' our jobs blame our GOV for GLOBALIZATION, not WE, the people.

peace

Ridin' around in their Cadillacs, livin' off welfare, buyin' mansions, havin' dozens of kids so they can get more of our hard-earned dollars.

Oh, wait, that was the lazy welfare queens that Reagan used to scare everybody with.

Oh, well, there's always some poor working folks to blame.

the illegals would be a lot happier if they could get the same pay and conditions that by law the company would have to provide for an American. The employment agencies hire aliens for one reason - profit. The agencies and employers rip the illegals off and trample on ordinary US workers.

Blaming the victims and exploited is not right, if you must direct anger in any direction direct it at the bosses who grow fat in the current climate. These companies are posting record profits, their CEOs are getting tax cuts and all the while laying off long term employees and gouging people who have no protection.

Rather than send 'them' back, I'd suggest that the american people start taxing the crap out of the fat cats 'til they are screaming. Levy punitive fines for companies found to be paying way below minimum wage. Spend this revenue on a universal healthcare system.

I take it people don't like being confronted with the reality that we are ALL just WORKERS and HUMAN RESOURCES to the corporate machine. The machine cares not where we were born. The machine does not recognize nation states. The machine does not know the difference between an "american" worker or a "mexican" worker.

The minimum wage means one thing only to the machine: IF WE COULD GET AWAY WITH PAYING YOU LESS, WE WOULD.

The Human Resources are not to blame here.

is getting a feel for what it's like to be an oppressed minority in this country. It really sucks when the shoe is on the other foot...but that is the way of the right-wing...we're all expendable, profit is all that matters, and the conservative mantra is "Be responsible, Help yourself!, after all.

Surely there must be a clinic around your parts somewhere, where your son might find low-cost medical care...he'd probably have to stand in line with a few other poor folks, but you'll get used to that, maybe even make a few friends.

Workers, United, Will Never Be Defeated!

Unionize!

Holy shit shallow...

Why do I feel so out of the mainstream on a liberal, progressive website? It's hard to even respond to that - maybe there isn't a response. "WHY AREN'T THEY WORKING??? They have all the damn jobs.....but if he was an illegal he'd be setting damn pretty right about now. I'm sorry,but I say send the 11 million back to where they came from...The media whore coverage over the illegals and their whining." Maybe illegals aren't responsible for you or your son's position. Maybe you are frustrated & angry & afraid and want someone to blame? And I have another question. Was your son laid off because illegals were hired, or because positions were eliminated? (I'm really not trying to flame you, here. Just wanted to put that in too. I'm sorry that your son is having these troubles - that must be very stressful for all of you.)

On Moderator review, we're locking this thread.

As stated, it's extremely inflammatory.

Thanks for your consideration.