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951-Riverside Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:12 PM
Original message
Ron Paul at a Fox News debate
 
Run time: 02:09
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ_Z_XG0L2c
 
Posted on YouTube: January 11, 2008
By YouTube Member:
Views on YouTube: 0
 
Posted on DU: January 12, 2008
By DU Member: 951-Riverside
Views on DU: 1820
 
Too bad Dennis Kucinich is being censored.
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ryanmuegge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
1. Cut his mic! He's not reading from the corporate cue cards!
Yeah, Ron Paul's wrong about a lot of things, but he's dead on in a couple areas. This is one of them. That was fucking awesome.

FOX is so professional, too: making fun of the candidates.
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salvorhardin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. You can put lipstick on a pig...
Paul is wrong about only a couple of things? Let's consider these excerpts from a 2000 statement by Paul on his Congressional website*:
'A Republic, If You Can Keep It’ by Dr. Ron Paul, U.S. Representative from Texas
Address to the U.S. House of Representatives delivered on the Floor of the House January 31 - February 2, 2000

....The modern-day welfare state has steadily grown since the Great Depression of the 1930s. The federal government is now involved in providing health care, houses, unemployment benefits, education, food stamps to millions, plus all kinds of subsidies to every conceivable special-interest group. Welfare is now part of our culture, costing hundreds of billions of dollars every year. It is now thought to be a "right," something one is "entitled" to. Calling it an "entitlement" makes it sound proper and respectable and not based on theft. Anyone who has a need, desire, or demand and can get the politicians' attention will get what he wants, even though it may be at the expense of someone else. Today it is considered morally right and politically correct to promote the welfare state. Any suggestion otherwise is considered political suicide.

....Controlled curricula have downplayed the importance of our constitutional heritage while indoctrinating our children, even in kindergarten, with environmental mythology, internationalism, and sexual liberation. Neighborhood schools in the early part of the 20th Century did not experience this kind of propaganda.

....It is now accepted that people who need (medical) care are entitled to it as a right. This is a serious error in judgment.

...Probably the most significant change in attitude that occurred in the 20th Century was that with respect to life itself. Although abortion has been performed for hundreds if not thousands of years, it was rarely considered an acceptable and routine medical procedure without moral consequence. Since 1973 abortion in America has become routine and justified by a contorted understanding of the right to privacy. The difference between American's rejection of abortions at the beginning of the century, compared to today's casual acceptance, is like night and day. Although a vocal number of Americans express their disgust with abortion on demand, our legislative bodies and the courts claim that the procedure is a constitutionally protected right, disregarding all scientific evidence and legal precedents that recognize the unborn as a legal living entity deserving protection of the law. Ironically the greatest proponents of abortion are the same ones who advocate imprisonment for anyone who disturbs the natural habitat of a toad.

....The welfare system has mocked the concept of marriage in the name of political correctness, economic egalitarianism, and hetero-phobia.

....Any academic discussion questioning the wisdom of our policies surrounding World War II is met with shrill accusations of anti-Semitism and Nazi lover. No one is even permitted without derision by the media, the university intellectuals, and the politicians to ask why the United States allied itself with the murdering Soviets and then turned over Eastern Europe to them...'
http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2000/cr020200.htm


So just because Paul is anti-war we should excuse his rabid pro-fascist ideation and socially regressive views on multiple subjects?


*As reported in a blog post by Psychobabbler at my website:
http://neuralgourmet.com/2008/01/08/ron_paul_why_should_he_worry_s
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pretzel4gore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. he's for less cohersive/intrusive policies
where democracy stumbles since it first was discussed by the wise is this problem; that too many people are dingbats. Yet, the very freedom to be a dingbat is what makes living in free democratic states the preference of everyone, even hard rightwing nazipoohs. Yes Paul has his flaws, but as he's been in an echo chamber for years, being fed on and thus reflecting some of the harsh anti liberal ideas you mention, a stint out in the fresh air where Dennis Kucinich is, might affirm the progressive which is there (unless you think the commons is regressive- it plainly isn't) Like it or not, our politicians can detest short skirts, for example, yet vote for womens' right to go topless, even after admitting he prefers his puritanical ideals, this being free country etc...we are in a battle for life itself, in 2008, and even Hillary's MIC friendliness, indeed any go-along-to-get-along candidate from whatever party that suggest 'we can work' with men who belong in prison, if not on death row/The Hague, makes Ron Paul's piggishness alot less needing of lipstick then the piggishness of those who want more of the same as we've had too much of these last 8 years....the US military spending is greater then the rest of the planet combined, yet this simple truth is unknown by most voters. And it trumps Ron Paul's hankering for smaller government...
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ryanmuegge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Yeah, I never made that argument. I am FAR from a Ron Paul supporter.
Edited on Sat Jan-12-08 04:26 PM by ryanmuegge
Thanks for baselessly pigeonholing me as a Paul-bot, though. I'm sure you've had those links and those cliched arguments saved up, and you've been waiting for the opportunity to use them on somebody. Whether they applied to the original post or not is an afterthought, apparently. I apologize for the abrasive tone, but I take particular umbrage to somebody talking to me as if I'm a Paul-bot.


Notice how I said Paul is wrong on "A LOT" of things, not "just a couple." Actually, I said he's only right on a couple of things (foreign policy, globalization's impact on national sovereignty, elite organizations such as the CFR, and his analysis of the Federal Reserve) and I'm aware of the information you have presented, and it is part of the reason why anybody with half of a brain wouldn't support him. These are positions that are similar to those taken by us on the left.

It's good when any opposing viewpoint is presented in the carefully scripted world of political news and formal political debates. It was good to see somebody call the modern Republicans out on not being fiscally conservative when they claim to be. Hearing somebody at a Republican debate suggest that it maybe it isn't "conservative" to spend billions of dollars to intervene in the affairs of other people, as well as mentioning the historical roots of a noninterventionist foreign policy int he Republican party was refreshing.

YES, he is fascist. He ultimately does want to give even more power to corporations and make the rich richer.

Most of the Paul supporters are mindless drones, much like the Republicans' base of blood-thirsty biggots and greedy pigs. They look at him as if he's a fucking messiah. No one can even question anything he says. Even when faced with overwhelming evidence of mean-spirited racism, they deny that he made the statements or knew about them. They're primarily young and uninformed, and they do not realize what welfare queens they (and all of us) really are. What about the public universities that most of these Paul supporters attend (only so many people can get into MIT, Harvard, and Yale)? That's just one example. They're uninformed fools who are rightly angry (primarily about the war), but they channel it in the wrong direction. They blame the government, rather than the corporate power that corrupts government. Seeing Paul on TV, they jump on the bandwagon of a guy's personality, as opposed to researching ideas or policies. That's because politics are personalized by the media.

If Ron Paul wasn't talking about his foreign policy, and he ran only on his other policies, he would have been ignored by young people. He is consciously manipulating his young, naive followers by presenting his positions on the Iraq war at an opportune time with the hopes of implementing his unpopular domestic policies, which are the true foundations of his candidacy. He does a good job of analyzing the problems, which is more than I can say for the Republicans, but his solutions would make things even worse...outside of getting rid of the Federal Reserve.

Notice how, out of all of the candidates who are not viable, only one on the far-right end of the spectrum. An extremely conservative (in the true, traditional sense) is much more preferable to the corporate elite than one on the left. They would not DARE give Kucinich the time they have given Paul.
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salvorhardin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Sorry about that
Edited on Sat Jan-12-08 05:29 PM by salvorhardin
I misread your prior post. We're almost entirely together on this. The support for Paul on the left is just grating on me. I think it's anger over the war turned to reactionary populism that is driving Ron Paul's support (well, that and the Stormfront crowd).
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Maraya1969 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:30 PM
Response to Original message
3. That man reminds me of a college professor rather than a politician
Every time I listen to him I learn something new. I don't agree with his social policies and I would not vote for him but I am glad that he is in these debates.
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Acadia Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. Fox does not want any rePIG to dissent from the Bush message and
like him or not, Paul is doing something good for Democracy, because he is speaking his mind. Romney is a bush plastic clone. Rudy is a nazi.
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CGowen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Rudy looks like he has something in his pants
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DutchLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. Maybe somebody mentioned 9/11?
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thebrandnewcrow Donating Member (28 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
5. Ron Paul is a "Libertarian Republican"?
In 1988, Ron Paul ran for President as a libertarian candidate.

He admitted back then, on the Morton Downey Jr. show that he was registered Republican, but had always been libertarian in his voting. He explained this by saying he was a "libertarian Republican". He was on the show to promote the legalization of drugs. His behavior was also very erratic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHB2I83_N_k

He also confessed to Tim Russert on Meet the Press that he resigned the Republican Party in January 1987 to run as a Libertarian candidate for President in 1988.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCSY438wpCk&feature=related

So either he was a Republican - or he was a Libertarian. Can you be two political parties at the same time?
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7horses Donating Member (143 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
8. Ron Paul...
Edited on Sat Jan-12-08 03:19 PM by 7horses
needs to be heard, as all the candidates need to be heard on both sides. Let the people hear and let the people decide. Fox news should not make fun of Ron Paul nor anyone else. If the people could hear the policies of all the candidates... Edwards would win it all. Go John go.
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harmonicon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. all voices should be heard
Will you still vote for Edwards if he doesn't stand up for Kucinich and refuse to take part in the next debate unless all of the candidates are included? If you will, you're voting against your stated principles.
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DUlover2909 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 05:15 PM
Response to Original message
11. Hey RON PAUL! If you're a strict constitutionalist
then why don't you bring impeachment articles for Bush and Cheney?
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Hulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
13. This loon is the best thing the repugs have for America...and that's sad!!
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DutchLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
14. I don't like Paul, but his answer was one of the best I've heard so far in the debates...
...both Republican AND Democratic!
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