Republicans cannot be convinced. You must physically STOP them from violating the Constitution.

No moral argument in the world is going to stop any of these people.

No Constitutional argument is going to stop them, that's for damn sure.

Not even any legal argument, or logical argument can stop them either. Telling them 1 + 1 does not = 3 will never stop them from continuing on the course they're on right now.

They'll tell themselves, and the rest of us, that they are right--they'll keep it up until the show has to go to commercial, and afterwards, until they go into the grave.

Nothing is going to change this until people are removed from office, and people with legal authority physically put them in handcuffs, and physically place them behind bars. That's the only language these people speak. They are wholly devoted to their mission of a permanent Republican majority, and permanent corporate theocracy.

They're all all wired with their own personal Tony Snow and Karl Rove, who spin, obfuscate, and press fear buttons to serve their self interest, and they have the will to keep up that spin to serve their goals throughout the remainder of their free lives.


(edited 1 + 1 does *not* equal 3 : ) )

... he probes the details of the dynamic of which you speak. They think in terms of their 'frames', and those are more powerful than facts.

Bush makes his contempt plain with his smug smirk, the twitch and shrug that communicates that he thinks you're too stupid to live and he's being generous and granting an audience.

They are not persuadable. If they were another country, it would mean armed conflict-or at least the threat of one-while we have only elections and impeachment, the legal system which cheney and scooter have corrupted and made disreputable.

Hope it works.

Now we have a parody of elections.

That's what it will take to get them to comply with Congress. They will not be shamed into it.

Getting the police to handcuff them is not that easy. Are you saying investigate, impeach, or have Congress vote a "we think you're doing a shitty job"? What would it take to get people to physically arrest them, and who would do this?

Edited to add that these people scare me and I don't see how to get them to stop. I am willing to hear ideas and am working as I can. Peace

So it's no surprise they don't give a fuck about the constitution.

The famous saying is say a lie often enough and people believe it to be true. We're dealing with goons who have been suckled on kool-aid. Their perceptions of what is right and wrong have long been compromised by power and dollars. They can't see a big picture as the short-term is all they've been told matters. They can't admit failure or assume responsibility, since they've never been forced to do either. The ends justifies the means and that end is power and ego. The best you can expect from these people are to keep them on the defensive by constantly challenging their lies.

Someone here said we're stuck eating a "shit sandwich"...as the Democratic majorities aren't big enough to force a break in GOOP ranks that open the door to a direct challenge of this regime. Slime like Lugar and Dimenici and Warner and Liebermann are putting up the obstructions and diversions to enable this regime to play out the clock...to shift the blame of all this carnage on Democrats.

We need to realize what cards we're dealt with and start working toward getting a stronger hand. This means electing more Democrats to the House and building a bigger majority in the Senate. It's getting a Democrat elected to the Executive and then demanding we get a full accounting of the crimes and criminals that destroyed this country. Accountablity must be demanded now and until we see justice. It may take years, but better the time and price is worth the struggle and angst. History has already vindicated us...my hopes are the courts...here in the U.S. and in The Hague will do the same in the future.