Do you have a Positive or Negative view towards those currently serving in the Military

Bryant
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if everyone refused to serve and there was no army to go to Iraq.

neocon infiltration of the leadership,
religious overtones, brain washing, and proselytizing that takes place in Iraq, Air Force Academy and elsewhere. I still have the photo of the M1A1 tank with a troop putting a rosary on the turret before heading off to kill people.

We are not heroes. We joined because of myriad personal reasons and choices. We and the military in general do not belong to one political party. One political party does not OWN patriotism, the flag, or us.

Just my 2 cents, but this poll/topic might just serve as fodder for lurking wingnuts. Any group could be substituted, "Do you have a positive or negative view towards (Blacks, Hispanics, Gays, women... ad infinitum)."


Sorry to rain on a thread. I hate when somebody rains on mine.

I give extra credit to those serving. Not enough to turn the tide on a truly rotten person -- just a few extra points.

On the other hand is it accurate? If someone says "DU has a negative view of veterans" is that the truth or is that false?

Bryant

For example, I don't know anyone who became an accountant or a drywall installer because he wanted to smoke people.

I do, however, know many people who joined the military for that exact reason.

The military is nothing more than a slice of the general population. There are tall people, short people, fat people, thin people, men, women, and probably some of every race on earth. There are smart people, stupid people, nice people, and absolute assholes who make me embarrassed to be an American.

Just like anywhere else you go...



The difference is that all of them (all of the ones who are worth a damn, anyway) are willing to lay down their lives to protect the people they serve with and the ideals they joined in support of. While some people (on every side) will never do more in life than sit and complain, they are out there doing something. That is where the "extra credit" comes in, IMO.

Anyone who joined or re-upped after the US invaded a svoereign country has voluntarily joined a murderous organization engaged in an illegal and immoral war.

Do the math.

is a trauma nurse in the air force so I beg to differ.

Anyone who joined or re-upped after the US invaded a sovereign country has voluntarily joined a murderous organization engaged in an illegal and immoral war.

Do the math.

Weird. It's almost as if you have no argument being repetition.

Bryant

"It's almost as if you have no argument being repetition."

Now -- THAT's weird.

Did doing the math confuse you??

Anyway I don't know what math you are talking about.

Bryant

It's not an easy or well-paid life--God bless 'em.

what is positive about illegal war, torture, excessive firepower & willful gross ignorance (the Iraq-9/11 connection).

What kind of "god" would bless that?

members of the military for Chimpy's policies and a few commanders' bad decisions. My husband is a proud patriot--he is dismayed by the turn our country has taken, but he serves nonetheless.

My next door neighbor's kid joined the Army Reserve. We talked after he got out of basic. He's convinced that he'll never have to go to war because the recruiter told him so.

Poor sod actually believes them.

they've been put into an impossible situation by their civilian chickenhawk leaders.

i used to be of the opinion: "fuck them, they volunteered, and it's just too bad, so sad for them..."

but what's being done to them, and what they can expect as far as non-support once they rotate home and out is downright disgusting, and pretty much criminal.

which seems to be winning out in the poll for the moment. Of course the day is only beginning, so I expect that will probably swing in the other direction later on.

:patriot:

The military is full of people. Not heroes, just people. When I was in, I saw a bunch of other guys like myself, just trying to provide for themselves and/or their families. Very few political ideologues, at least amongst the enlisted men.

they and their families are carrying the burden for the other 290+ million Americans. And, they deserve better support than this and other admins have provided to vets.

Timber-cutters and deep-sea fishermen do even more dangerous and unpleasant jobs.

Both are jobs. Most soldiers join the army not out of idealistic reasons, but because it provides better opportunities than they can get with their (very often very few) qualifications in other fields.

And most of what the US army does does not come under the heading "defending the US".

There are differnces between "getting paid to risk your life producing fish" and "getting paid to risk your life occupying Iraq" and "getting paid to risk your life preventing genocide in Darfur", sure, but they're still comparable.

I don't know what fraction of fishermen are self-employed, incidentally, but I suspect it's fairly high.

By the calculus you present, there's no difference between Blackwater mercs and enlisted service personnel.

Indeed, some people can't afford 'idealism' ... and there's no question that we have an economic draft.

One other difference ... the deployment of the military is, ultimately, under the authority of We the People. We are where "the buck stops" ... and any attempt to shift the blame to those at the bottom of the totem pole is (imho) political cowardice.

I think you need to reconsider, therefore, the logic behind thinking that the beneficial effects of having an army implies that soldiers are good people.

National defence isn't the prime, or even the sole, purpose of the massive ammounts America spends on "defence"; international influence is. It would still be perfectly safe with far fewer soldiers, although some are certainly needed.

Indeed, reducing the number of soldiers it employs, and hence the defence budget, would benefit America (although not nearly as much as other defence cuts in e.g. spending on nuclear weapons).

:shrug:

our country doesn't face any threats that are going to be stopped by soldiers.

Our military doesn't have a choice;When told to act they must comply.So how could anyone blame them or have negative feelings toward them?Those incredibly brave men and women bring me to my knees in gratitude - I could NEVER do what they do.

It's for that reason alone why I think BushCo. needs to be Impeached and Jailed:Misuse of our Military violates the very foundation of our Constitution.

I am by no means a pacifist,I understand perfectly the need for our Military and thank the stars every day that there are people willing to serve our Country.But I feel intense sorrow and rage that they are being used for such evil un necessary purposes.

It is a vile crime what they are being asked to do.

They have a tough job to do, and they do it with dedication, and that is worth some degree of respect.

...knowing what * and Cheney would use him/her for. There is something noble in selfless service, though, even when it's perverted by the current imperialism. It's not the fault of all those in uniform that our military commits these crimes. It's the fault of every citizen who fails to act to reform our corrupt government.

Having been in a similar position myself almost 40 years ago.

is probably the best way to categorize my own view. I have a sister who has been in the military for years. She bites her tongue a lot - stays out of politics for the most part - remains loyal to her promise to fulfill her duty.

It must be difficult to find out that the work and dedication you've offered your country is being abused.

Edit: to spell sympathetic correctly.

People that are negative about service members are deranged. Our soldiers are volunteers who give up their time, families, and more recently their lives. Many of them do this because of financial hardship. Others do this for overtly patriotic reasons. Our soldiers are outstanding people and anyone who's "negative" about them needs to think this through.

i don't hate the playas, i hate the game.

I know commanders over there are supposed to make sure the mission goes on, but people like David Petraeus are used for political means. And the Commander In Chief, Bush, supports torture. I also question those who sign up just to participate in the occupation. But I really do support the troops, just like most liberals do.

We don't run the show... The Military would never want to run the government in this country. And generally, those wearing a uniform would not have this country in any war.

It's up to the elected officials. Which is why the we must always concentrate on the men in suits.