"Their work is complete when the victims log off in a huff."

From Wired.com:



Edited to add link: http://www.wired.com/gaming/virtualworlds/magazine/16-02/mf_goons?currentPage=1


Griefing. It's not just for gamesites anymore (if it ever was).

:argh:

I'm just kidding!

:P

But it IS true.

My favorites are those few who spend their time looking for posts to criticize, then subtly - or not - attack the poster as ignorant and uninformed or criticize an idea as unworkable without providing an alternative. There have been several of these types posting in threads about alternative energy lately with two basic strategies:

1) No single form of alternative energy can replace fossil fuels, so why bother?
2) Alternative energy is unaffordable, under every circumstance, so why bother?

Others personally attack people who try to post politely - those not using variations of the F-bomb in every sentence, or attempting to make peace and bring sanity to an otherwise contentious thread - because they sense some vulnerability. I never spent much time looking at the candidate threads, but I expect that most of those attacks happened there, though I've had my share on other threads.

I know where these people are coming from because, after eighteen years in DC, I finally figured them out. Seriously, I was a nice, clueless guy until very recently. They have nothing to offer but negativity and they get off by dominating and demeaning other people. However, they are also huge, craven cowards and will ONLY attack those they believe are weak enough to beat down.

The rules for ruining THEIR day are simple:

1) Never, ever take them seriously.
2) Think before you post a response, do some research if you have to.
3) Never post angry, unless it's a calm, informed anger.
4) Alert on their lousy ass(es). They don't deserve to be here.

Basically, don't play their game, don't roll over for them and you win. Hell, we all win 'cause they'll run off to another board with easier pickings.

There have been plenty of griefers and shills in that forum, many of 'em now 'stoned, but no worries, talking to them was like talking to rocks anyways...

Nevertheless, anyone who isn't too busy harassing furries in Second Life to post meaningful thoughts on DU can learn some heavy stuff in E/E, even when they find the presentation distasteful.

My own confrontational persona on DU is somewhat synthetic. I don't like to dance around trying to get to know what someone really thinks, or what their motives are. If they refuse to visit places relevant to the discussion, that tells me something important.

I have the luxury of not having to be entirely anonymous here. If I don't put my name right out in front of me it's because my wife and kids find me plenty embarrassing enough when I'm not on the internet.

:blush:

I am a relative newcomer to E/E, and it is a most excellent resource and place to learn from people who often know far more than I.

"Griefers and shills"...oh yeah, that about nails it.

naysayers and wondering why such posts were being made on a "progressive" site.

I am still researching ethanol as an agricultural business opportunity, but did not desire the 'grief' from the dumb-shits.

NoFederales

You might want to try a less "progressive site" than DU.

and other sugar/starchy/cellulose crops need meaningful debate. There is so much disinformation "out there" about ethanol that only a dedicated researcher will encounter it. I have long been w/o patience to explain meaningfully to the single-bit nitwits topics of which they are so 'erudite'.

As for warm-fuzzy I have no need; for intelligent discourse, I need that, but I guess not in e/e.

As for "progressive" site, DU is diminishing and you are correct: other sites may be preferable.

NoFederales

... it wouldn't come close to meeting our insatiable demand for liquid fuels.

The most immediate effect of bio-fuel production is that it makes it more difficult for people living in poverty to afford food. For that reason alone supporting biofuels is not a progressive position.

NoFederales

Hanging out in places where there are no disputes is not at all the same thing as "intelligent discourse." The flames of intelligent discourse often burn hot.

In earlier times here, his ass would have been banned for the troll-behavior, no matter what his political beliefs.

freakin' griefin' trolls

:crazy:

I had never heard the term before, either, though it seems to have been around for quite a while.

"Griefers, griefing."

Yep. Seen plenty of that on political discussion boards! :D

Some of their stuff is funny. No one who could start lolcats can be all bad. But yeah, they do go way over the line sometimes.

It was a group of mostly middle aged professional women. I was amazed that this type of group formed from within (not invaded from outside). They would choose a victim, plan strategies by IM or on private outside boards, and then stalk people both on the board and at times in real life, even trying to get people fired from jobs. Because this site started out as a very close-knit community, way too much personal info had been shared, so once the crazies started going over the edge, they had all the info thhey needed to harass people. I had been a mod but also posted as a member under another name. Once I was outted, they made sure I could never feel at ease in my own community of friends again. They finally won and drove me away.

And I'm sorry you had to go through that. I've been a years-long lurker and only recently began posting. And since I've been posting I've grown more sensitive to the lack of logic in some of the posts. They do sound simply provoking. In fact, (and if you can forgive me) the posters often sound like jerks. So I guess they're not jerks? They're just playing the greifing game? Sheesh.

they ARE jerks. Normal, well-adjusted people don't do that shit. I mean, sure, anyone can get provoked into a net confrontation given certain circumstances, but normal, well-adjusted people don't just do shit like that without some sort of cause.

I am much more careful now. I still share more than is probably wise, but then, I do that in real life too. I don't see much point to life without sharing. I might as well hibernate if I have to change that about myself.

Via the attack of the killer bunnies, those "griefers" practically managed to destroy the wonderful unity that had been built up over so many years...and that closeness has never fully recovered since that disastrous election season. As their hateful partisan "anon" attacks picked up steam, normally friendly board members became suspicious of one another, were forced to become defensive, and finally gave up, relinquishing their home site to nasty agitators.

I rarely go there anymore either, but I have heard that this time around, old-timers are quite prepared to deal with any "grief" that may come with this election. So effectively, the ass hats did accomplish one positive thing that they may regret...they managed to organize and steel those they were harassing, creating an even greater unity amongst the few long-time members that are left.

The shame is that so many simply left in total disgust (or fear), never to return. Or, as this OP states, "the victims log off in a huff", which was the intended purpose of those rabid rabbits...to spew enough kerap to make folk feel like they'd been gob-smacked in their own homes.

I recently started popping back in now and then just to see how the old crew is doing, see baby pics, see who's still annoying people and who's still whining. LOL

If you are who I think you are, :hi:

I go there about once a month, if that, or around holidays, just to let old buds know that I'm still alive. I don't recognize lots of the names anymore, at all.

At first, I really missed the kinship but gradually weaned myself off the computer and managed to resist going back, whenever I did go online. Actually, I've done the same thing with this place, since there's so much to be done in our real communities, normally not a lot of time to spare, anymore. Bad bones have had me plopped here for a little while, but mostly been reading, since typing hurts.

That board was once unique, for sure, and a great little community to share. I'm just hoping they make it thru these campaigns without all the strife.

:hi: and a big :hug: for all that you had to put up with during that "grief"!

I miss the good times from the other board, but I certainly don't miss all the strife. At times I was tempted to try to be a part of it again, but I knew they'd never quit, and I didn't want to continue to be a lightening rod for their drama there.

:hug: back atcha! :)

It's such a game to them, and we were just the object of their ridicule. They see their "prey" as pathetic and worthy of their scorn, so they have no pity or remorse for anything they did. I can't even blame it on the anonymity of the net because I met some of these people in person and talked to others on the phone. They knew damn well I was a real person and claimed me as a friend. I truly can't explain it.

That belongs in the bedroom.

I finally left a listserve I helped to found after the original group of affiliated people was invaded by a couple of guys who just very unpleasantly took it over. No one was able to get rid of them because we hadn't set up sufficient structure. The one person who could probably have created that structure (and actually got pretty far with a website) decided on a massive life-change (he changed his sex) and disappeared.

It was nice while it lasted, but after those two SOBs came along it was just one extremely personal attack after another. I was one of the last of the original group to call it quits.

Griefing is antisocial alright.

Hekate

These are virtual pilots, usually the younger ones, who will circle around an airfield where the players spawn into the on-line dogfight. As soon as these "pilots" spot a new player taking off below, they will dive down and strafe the player taking off before he/she has a chance to even get their wheels off the ground.

Many of these idiots will then boast and brag about how they "shot down X number of planes".

Funny thing is, that if you do manage to escape them and get up in the virtual sky, when you engage them, they becomes easy targets because they have not developed any real dogfighting skills. And when you do shoot them down in flames, they start squawking about how YOU must be cheating.

Kinda like Freeper Trolls showing up here in a way.

long time combat flight sim-er here. :hi:

I like space sims, but I thought about trying out some other combat flight games. You guys don't still play Warbirds, do you?

KG,

Kinda hard as you don't know until you spawn in if there is someone in the area.

Evoman,

Right now I'm using a merged version of IL2-Forgotten Battles/Aces Expansion Pack/Pacific Fighters from Ubisoft. I got out of on-line simming and built a 4 PC LAN rig. All the PC's are running in the 2.5 to 3 gig CPU range, each with 256mb vid cards and 1.5 gig of ram, and all 4 rigs have full HOTAS (Stick, Throttle, and Rudder Pedals) gear. I'm getting a ping rate of around 5-10, so there is no warping or dropouts. When we run a dogfight, we have a simple rule: take off with nav lights on, when you reach 1000 ft, turn off nav lights. No shooting anyone with lights on.

http://www.hitechcreations.com/frindex.html



best gaming community on the net. 14.99 mo.

first 2 weeks free, no CC needed for that.

PM of you're intrested.

Emotional pain, physical pain, anguish, agony, humiliation -- people just groove to it. Exquisite depictions of suffering are the new national pastime, and one of today's top industries. :(

It's the griefees. Jesus, think skin, less ego, and a sense of morbid humor goes a long way. And Doritos.

Boredom plus poor parenting and socialization yields sociopathy.

Offline gaming, you can choose who you will play with. Not so in MMOs. I've seen organized attacks that you just wouldn't believe, I've felt some of them.

Most of them are people who don't have the cooperative skills to work with others and create something successful.

At least on DU we have the ignore button.

I'm way too late to (by a decade or more!) to nominate "griefing" for Word of the Year. It's just so perfect, though -- sums up a whole, demented mindset so concisely.

It seems pretty clear that griefing is not limited just to gamesites. People in this very thread have pointed out how online communities of every sort can become playgrounds for the griefers.

In fact, I think we could easily take the word offline and apply it to the Bush (mis)administration, the neocons, the so-called political pundits... All of 'em -- they all get their lil' rocks off by making people miserable.