The thread on scooters kind of has me worried since it seems that many people unfamiliar with two wheelers are now thinking of buying scooters..

Approximately 70% of motorcycle (and scooter) accidents occur in the first 90 days of ownership.

Riding is emphatically *not* the same thing as driving, but just on two wheels. As far as a lot of car drivers are concerned you are essentially invisible.. "I didn't see them" is the single most common statement made by car drivers just involved in a collision with a motorcycle. Don't trust making eye contact with drivers, they will look straight at you and still not have a clue you are there.

http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-Safety/motorcycle-accident-statistics.htm

39 percent of fatal motorcycle collisions with other vehicles occurred when the other vehicle was turning left while the motorcycle was going straight, passing, or overtaking the other vehicle.

If you are going to take up two wheel motorized vehicles, take a safety course before you get on the road.

I repeat for emphasis..

If you are going to take up two wheel motorized vehicles, take a safety course before you get on the road.

http://www.msf-usa.org/

http://www.harley-davidson.com/wcm/Content/Pages/Rider_Education/skilled_rider_course.jsp?locale=en_US

And practice evasive maneuvers on your machine, there is a 100% chance that if you ride long enough you will have to evade a car headed directly for you.. It happened to my daughter and son in law just about six months ago and one of the group they were riding with ended up in the hospital with one foot severely damaged despite wearing heavy boots.. The driver of the car, an elderly woman, "didn't see them" and we are talking a group of four large, loud Harleys.

Wear protective gear, helmet, gloves and jacket at the minimum.. The first thing you will do if you come off is put your hands down, without gloves you are likely to tear all the meat off your hands. Road rash is extremely painful, very prone to infection and slow to heal.

Car drivers today are highly distracted and distinctly unused to looking out for two wheelers, assume that you are completely invisible and ride in such a manner that you would not get hit even if no one could see you at all.

Keep 'em shiny side up and rubber side down..

I'd very much also like to know what advice you have for drivers when they share the road with a scooter or motorcycle. For example: myself, I always try to yield a little in the lane I'm in to give the rider room to pass. Is that a good idea?

Is don't tailgate them, you never know, someone might just have a blowout or come off for whatever reason and I know you would feel horrible if you were to run over someone.

Other than that, just treat them as another car..

Thanks for asking..

and I mean that sincerely. If I decide to buy, I will definitely take a class.

My own scooter is an electric, sort of a glorified bicycle, and I ride it wherever I'd ride a bicycle. I stay off main roads whenever I can and I've found that people tend to see me more easily on the back roads I've learned to take most places. I also use a neon pink kiddie backpack for increased visibility.

Road rash is awful. Think carpet burn all over your body, with the addition of asphalt grit in it.

I learned to ride on the 5 FRWY in Los Angeles on a summer Sunday afternoon. I just got the Honda Silver Wing the day before. I had only ridden my brother's bike in the Rose Bowl parking lot for about an hour the night before I got my bike.

I don't advise doing it the way I did.

in case they "disappear" from my sight while I'm driving.

Hubby said a friend from work in another city bought a motorcycle, got his leg banged up the first month in a very low speed accident. He set the ad to sell it the next day.

80% of motorcycle FATALITIES occur at 22 mph OR LESS. The advise given is sound.

People NEED to practice slow speed maneuvers (turning, braking, SWERVING, u-turns etc.) because it's not a matter of IF you'll need to use your skills, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

When I ride on Saturdays, I always head to an empty school parking lot first and practice these moves and I've been riding for a while. Several times I've had to swerve to avoid cars that suddenly brake in front of me, or cars that have turned left in front of me (thankfully with no one coming at me) in order to avoid hitting them. I also DON'T follow too closely which has allowed me the room to perform these maneuvers.

My girlfriend wanted to learn how to ride and I simply told her her left hand is for the clutch, right hand is for throttle and front braking and her other two hands are to steer. Left foot is for shifting, right foot is for rear brake and your other two feet for balance when you stop. This is on top of the 6 eyes you need in your head to see everything else going on around you. She decided riding 2-up is fine with her.

Just about everyone knows how to ride a bicycle but very few people know what they are actually doing when they ride..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countersteering

When riding a bicycle or a motorcycle, countersteering is a method of initiating a turn by a small, momentary turn of the front wheel, usually via the handlebars, in the opposite (counter) direction. Like the book example above, this moves the pivot point (the wheels' contact patches) out from under the center of mass to establish the lean angle for a turn. While necessary at all speeds, the need to countersteer becomes more noticeable as speed increases.

Learn to consciously and actively countersteer, you will have far greater control of the motorcycle/scooter.

at very low speeds it's different, you have to turn the tire in the direction of the turn.

at higher speeds if you want to move left, you have to "push" the left handlebar and left you go. It's opposite of what one would expect i.e. push the left handlebar and you'd expect normally to go right.

Those who've had accidents.

Those who haven't had an accident yet.

I will never ride without a full-face helmet. When I got forced off the road I did a header over the handlebars. If I hadn't been wearing a full-face helmet, I would have lost my jaw.

Some people in cars are simply oblivious to anything on two wheels. :eyes:

Fixed it :)

Hi-Viz and Full-Face helmet

Motorcycles and scooters are fun and yes economical but everything the OP says is correct. Leather and Kevlar are your friends. People die from road rash if they fall unprotected (meaning wearing tshirt, shorts and flip flops).

There is an old saying that real motorcyclists know is the truth.. If you ride, it's not if you'll fall but when". Training and proper riding gear are your best defenses.

And also always ride like every car is out to get you. Even those going the same direction and especially those behind you.

Always remember that there is no such thing as a fender-bender between a bike and a car. The bike always loses.

This advice applies to pedestrians too. I was hit by a car that didn't have it's headlights on at dusk. I never saw it.I was holding hands with another person walking slow,as he stepped onto the curb I was hit ripped from his hand and thrown in the air landed on the other side of the road the car was going 45mph in a 15 mph,zone.. I lived but I was shocked to hear the extent of damage it had taken on my body,years later.After the accident I was sent to an ER and released the same night.

I find it disturbing they did not notice my neck fracture, or my spine fractures. They didn't give a shit I guess because I was a medical assistance patient,and if you are on MA you will be lucky to find medical people anywhere that actually care about helping you with your injuries/illness.Lucky to find an ER that will do through checks and tests to make sure you are ok..

So if you are on MA be triple cautious because if you are hurt the care you get in an ER with the status of less worthy than dirt of getting help can hurt you in the long run. Some people tend to assume alot of untrue crap about MA people and some are bigots.That is reality so you might not get care that is sufficient.

Car drivers can be over aggressive and impatient as well as inattentive and distracted.People become dulled to the fact that driving is in of itself so fast and violent.. Cars to a pedestrian are like deadly weapons to dodge,even when the light is red, or about to be red some aggressive drivers run the lights and that could hurt you..Drivers insulated by their car,can dehumanize pedestrians and cyclists and the law tends to be vehicle preferential . In a car drivers they don't feel so vulnerable,so they can get careless sometimes.In other words if you share the road with two or more tons of metal flying at high speeds and you bike cycle scoot or walk please watch your ass.At least until people can't afford to drive cars anymore.

I'm particularly paranoid in parking lots since cars are coming from every direction.

My younger brother was hit by a car and nearly killed right in front of me when I was 12 and he was 8.. The lady driving the car went into hysterics and the two 12 year olds (myself and my friend) had to call the cops/ambulance.

Bro spent nearly six months in the hospital with a broken hip but thankfully eventually made a full recovery.

When drivers get competitive over parking spaces for a pedestrian it is like playing russian roulette.
I walk past roadkill that in a car is a blur, the horrors I've seen in the results of the violence of car impacts, it makes me horrified,shit like deer thrown, dead with their internal organs flowing out of their mouths and rear ends because of how forcefully and where they were hit by a car.Heads crushed,spines scraped by impacts, it's the stuff of nightmares,In sprawl-land they assume no one walks so there are not many sidewalks and road shoulders are not wide.
If drivers would just stop and realize how violent and dangerous to all creatures the act of driving a car really IS..and the danger it presents to us.
Oh, you are on greatest page now, Your OP needs to be seen and understood..

...who landed "just right" after flying headfirst over the top of a car

I believe the reason I was never one of the "bad" statistics is that I always acted as though I was invisible. It takes a bit to live this piece of wisdom, but it saved my ass many a day.
Always look forward....always believe that car is going to pull out in front of you....always believe that SUV is going to pull over into your lane.
And yes, it becomes instinctive to ride safely, but it takes time. The first 1000 miles is the most dangerous.

I also never, ever trust people's turn signals, and always expect the other drivers to act stupidly.

always keep an eye on your mirrors, have some space between you and the car ahead of you and always have an "out". Many riders get hit from behind by the same "I didn't see them" drivers.

I always, always always stop directly behind the drivers side tail light. One, it allows the driver of the car in front of me to see me in two mirrors and two, while watching my mirrors, if someone comes up behind me, all I have to do is give a little gas, move a foot to the left and get out of it's way. I'm not stuck.

if not for my highway bars, my right leg probably would have been crushed- as it was, i flew off the bike and over the car, landing on my helmet and shoulder, then sliding a bit. i ended up with a nice road rash, a broken collarbone, and a cracked shoulderblade.

So I couldn't agree more with this post. And I'd like to add, always be a defensive driver, NEVER demand the right of way when someone else's making a mistake (as we sometimes do in cars, sortof daring the person to follow through with their mistake), they will win and you will lose. Use your horn often! I know that when I ride a non-motorized bike, and see lots of traffic in an intersection I need to navigate, I begin tapping my horn quite a little bit (4-5 times), sort of wake folks up and make them look around.

who are just as invisible to car drivers.

Safety equipment, make sure you have all the reflectors necessary on your bike, on the spokes, the front, and back.

In addition, wear a helmet, you do not need to be one accident away from being brain damaged.

For added safety, where one of those orange safety vests that you usually see construction workers or crosswalk people where, increases visibility.

If you are riding at night, make sure you follow any state or local laws and install a headlight and tail light on the bike, you can buy these for as little as 35 dollars for both, and they last up to a hundred hours or more before the batteries need changing.

In addition to this, research the laws in your state applicable to bicycle riding, in many states they are considered, by law, as vehicles of the road, even if not licensed as motor vehicles. This means that you must follow all the same laws as motorcycles, scooters, and cars, while on the road, and its usually illegal(an unsafe) to ride on sidewalks.

Depending on the state, this means that you must follow traffic on the street, stop at stop signs and red lights, etc.

If there are any bike trails or lanes where you ride, use them, they are there for your convenience and safety.

When crossing intersections, be extra aware of the drivers on the road, assume that they can't see you, and I would say that you should walk the bike across the intersection when the pedestrian light is activated at a clearly marked crosswalk.

Follow these tips, and many others, and you should be safe enough, the key here is to think about how much in gas you are saving by riding a bike rather than driving a car.

I'm thinking about getting a scooter in a few years...when I get enough money.

BMW motorcyle, wears the most God-awful, neon-yellow, armored jacket when he rides.

I am very glad that he does.

I mean, when I turn off the lights in the garage, I would swear I can still see it.

Burned onto your retinas..

A headlight modulator is not a bad idea either. Blinks your headlights in order to be more visible.


http://tinyurl.com/5j6v8b

The Allies discovered in WWII that lights on the wings of planes in the daytime actually makes them more difficult to see.. Allied antisub planes had lights on the wings in order to more readily sneak up on U Boats..

I've forwarded the information.

Prefer the relative safety of four wheels these days.

During the spring and summer months, it makes a lot of sense to commute on two wheels. It's a lot more fun and you get to see the road and traffic from a whole new perspective. It may even make you a safer car driver, when you learn to watch for other folks out there on two wheels.

Don't forget to wear all of your safety gear all of the time - even on hot days. It used to make me cringe to see kids riding powerful bikes while wearing only beach shorts and flip flops on the streets of Miami. Scuffed jackets and gloves are a lot cheaper than a huge skin graft operation.

I can recommend the made-in-the-USA Buell Blast as simple, rugged, reliable two-wheeled transport. Harley dealers use them to train new riders, so they're very easy to control and can soak up a lot of rookie abuse. And here's the big bonus - mine gets almost 70 miles per gallon! (and it's a cool blue color, too - see below)

I had a Honda FT500 Ascot many years ago and was getting over 60 mpg with a fairly aggressive riding style.

They also are light enough to be very responsive to both brake and throttle and narrow enough to lean way over without dragging anything..



My first real bike was a BSA Gold Star, another 500cc single.

a big DU

WELCOME!

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

Thank you very much..

/Elvis

I know the temptation to save money on gas is very high right now and I just want to see people do so as safely as possible.

All The Gear, All The Time

We were taught that 90% of people killed in motorcycle accidents were "taught" to drive by their friends.

I took the class, I rode for 10 or so years (before my back went out).

I live in LA and I did not have one accident.

In fact, my experience with the class has made me believe that everyone should learn to ride a motorcycle before being allowed to drive anything else.

I have the same feeling..

It would really cut down on the number of inattentive and just flat out stupid drivers out there.

Swear to goodness that's the only way to aproach it. Complacency is a far greater danger than speed.

I did the GG bridge on a daily basis to work at Golden Gate Cycles...Long time back. I roadraced so I worked there to support the habit. Best defense was a good offense.

PS...Thumpers rule!!

For example, I try to never cross a busy street at an intersection (unless the side street is low volume).

No such thing as yield anymore.

Cross mid-block, where the biker is in control.


Basically, modern America is like a science fiction story, where the environment has been terra-formed by aliens (automobiles) making it uninhabitable for other life forms (any other mode of transportation).

not that they are but you know, always be on the look out for a way out

when you are splitting lanes and come up loud and fast. I can appreciate that when traffic is heavy, you need to go faster, but please I really don't want you to leave part of your hand on my outside mirror. And if I don't happen to see you coming, you can startle me to the point where I may jerk the steering wheel in the wrong direction.

Most of us drive cars too so we really are aware of how drivers react.

Thanks for the reminder though.

If you think there's a lot of lane splitting in CA you would be amazed at most of Europe, there are bikes and scooters trickling through every traffic jam in huge numbers.