What was I supposed to do?

I have done nothing wrong…

I am a Gen-xer…

-I was born in 1969 and graduated high school in 1988.
-I came from a broken (parents divorced) home.
-My father worked for a tire manufacturer in Ohio (union shop) and made good money.
-My step-mom was stay-at-home.
-I went to a small county school and played football and participated in the band.
-I worked part-time in the summers.
-Could not get into college as my math scores sucked.
-Joined the Air Force (because they said employers liked that…LOL)

The above was written to illustrate that I grew up basically ordinarily…nothing more nothing less.

Spent my four years in the military and participated in the first "Bush" war for oil. After that I went to work for RadioShack as a PT sales associate and worked my way up to District Manager making over $100k per year. Then in 2002 at the age of 32, I suffered a heart attack and had a double by-pass.

At the behest of my doctors and therapists, I left the stress of retail and worked in an office setting as a professional recruiter for five years. Now I am working for the same company my father works for as a supervisor. I have three children, a wife, child support payments and car payments. I pay my bills and take care of my family.

Again…I am ordinary and yet to some…I am evil and they wish my demise…

You see, there are those among us (DU'ers) who are praising the higher prices of fuel and wishing it to go higher so that we may drop our “ADDICTION” to oil. Excuse me…did you say addiction? Let me clue you dumbass fuckers in on something…it cannot be an addiction if there is no alerternative! GET IT!

Yes I know there is the Prius…but unfortunately there is that nagging little thing called a “car loan” and another little thingy called “being up-side down” on your car…I know…how foolish of me for being so financially irresponsible. So excuse the fuck outta me for not running out and buying Prius and jamming the five of us into it to go and do our grocery shopping.

Oh yeah…how could I forget…the magic bus...the one that picks you up at your door along with the other 30,000 people of our small Midwest community and delivers us at the doorstep of our employer…IT DOES NOT EXIST!

Oh right…move closer or move where they have public transit…FIND ME A FUCKING JOB THERE YOU ELITIST ASSHOLE!

I began this post by stating that I did nothing wrong…

I still believe that I (like many others) were in the “path of the storm” as Andy Dufrain put it so well. I paid my taxes went to work everyday…what else was I supposed to do?

edit for sp

No thanks... I'll keep my little piece of the world out here in the sticks....

Recommended

You have done the best you could, given your own circumstances...

I give you a lot of credit for having success!

You sure as heck didn't do anything wrong...

Hang in there!

:hi:

Thanks for the comments.

I work for a company that pays well (still a far cry from where I was at) but me and mine will be alright. It is the thought of others that scares me. How the hell can anyone make it on less than $15 an hour in this day and age????

I don't get it?

and it ain't easy.

What part of the country do you live in?

Chattanooga outskirts.

I too, graduated in 88, and my story is a bit different cuz I am on the other side of that child support as my husband at 22 couldn't handle a family so he chose to run...and then he settled down and was having the payments garnished, and then quit his job to keep from paying an extra $50 a month. the payments were half of MY income and stopped this January, along with the medical/dental that was paying for my son's braces...(the other ex is in jail, great)

"times are tough all over" is what my mom used to say
I understand your plight, and know it isn't just me who is struggling and sometimes I freak out because I am the one left raising the children while my ex's can run free. (so I guess I am a little bitter about that)

but, all in all, I support you for your struggles, I have never known the ability to purchase a car on a loan, so I get you about the buying a prius and trying to cram your family in it.
there IS no alternative, I keep saying I will buy a horse and buggy and use the manure to find alternative fuel for my car!

hope you and yours are okay and that we ALL can get through this mess.:hug:
otherwise, I'll see you on the reservation, maybe we can be tipi neighbors!


for your perusal...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=230x3078

That do not pay their CS...just pisses me off...

Hang in there...thats the best we can do...

How can guys not want to be there to raise their kids? I get so much joy seeing my daughter smile. Even if my wife and I divorced I would pay child support and try to live as close as possible to my wife so we could have joint custody. I cannot imagine not being there to watch her grow up.

Keep them at the store until after closing and tell them they'd been denied... which they always would be because bankers hate them too. Everyone hates those guys!

To the OP and others. I'm sorry for where you're at with the gas crunch. Avoiding burning gas has been a priority for me for as long as I've been driving. I was raised knowing that there likely won't be a planet for my children to inhabit... at least not much of one anyways. So I've chosen where to live and how to get to work accordingly.

Flame the hell out of me if you must: BUT when else was it going to stop? When we run completely out of oil? What happens when we run out of planet? You knew we were running out of planet and still you bought the gas guzzler. Your decision. And don't tell me it wasn't your decision... somehow people made it work without SUV's and v8 trucks, etc before. I know hauling groceries is hard and stuff, but somehow my grandparents managed with their cars and SMALL trucks. Somehow the Euros manage every day. And yes they have people that live in the country there too.

My wallet is getting hit HARD because I'm in sales, and a trashed economy is absolutely killing me. So believe me I DO feel your pain. Perhaps even more so, as my salary is pretty damn minimal, and I need commission to eat.

Call me an elitist all you want... I graduated into Bushland, so you can guess how my prospects look. I would just rather eat Ramen forever than see the Earth destroyed. Perhaps I don't care as much because I've always been living paycheck to paycheck :shrug:

Yes global warming exists...yes eventually we will use up all the oil...I get it!

But guess what...It ain't happening tomorrow or the next day or the next...This is nothing but greed and speculation gone berzerk...

Why is that the the "vocal" majorities on any issue are at the polar ends of the spectrum? The earth is not going to implode within the next 24 hours and SUVs did NOT cause global warming! The opposite is the argument that rising prices are due to supply and demand...what China and India just began using fossil fuels in that last 3 years...please!

Gas prices jumped up during Katrina and never looked back!

On one end you have the "Chicken Littles" and the other end you have the "Free Market" defenders...and guess who's in the middle of that shit sandwich...I guess that makes me shit...(a self fulfilling OP)

But within the next couple of centuries, definitely - and I imagine we'll see some pretty bad shit in our lifetimes. Actually we can now if we look - but we don't because it hasn't reached here yet and we are all elitist assholes. Who the fuck cares as long as the food riots are on the other side of the world in poor countries mostly populated by people with different amounts of melanin in their skin, right?

It's not doomsaying. And SUVs have definitely contributed to global warming and the general destruction of the planet. Yes, they're a relatively small part of the monster but they are part of it.

And I graduated from high school in 1999 (not sure why what year you graduated means anything) and make $10/hour - and my job involves driving around all day so I'm worried about high gas prices leading to my company deciding that my gas bill isn't worth it and getting rid of me.

But the world doesn't revolve around me - and also generally the world doesn't give a damn if you "do everything you're supposed to" or not. Random shit happens to people randomly, and also I'm pretty sure that oil company execs didn't sit around with a detailed dossier on your life to help them decide if you personally deserved screwing.

What needs to be done is develop alternative energy sources - with EVERYTHING on the table (solar, geothermal, hydroelectric, wind, even nuclear, hydrogen fuel cell, etc.) so that we get away from our "addiction" to oil (and I'm not crazy about that term "addiction," either). These things are beyond the power of the individual; they must be done at the national level and (most likely) be mandated by the state.

No, it's not OP's fault. It's not my fault, or your fault. But we must band together to force the state to take the necessary action.

Bake

"Yes global warming exists...yes eventually we will use up all the oil...I get it!

But guess what...It ain't happening tomorrow or the next day or the next...This is nothing but greed and speculation gone berzerk..."

----------------------

When do we do something about it? No one cares until it hits their pocket books.

As I mentioned I recenty stopped selling cars after about three years. I tried to talk 100's of people into getting cars/small trucks, instead of big v8-v10 monstrosities that they didn't at all need. Generally got three responses - "I need to be comfortable." Yes because you need to drive around in a barca lounger on a barge all day :eyes: And your comfort is more important than the planet. "They won't let gas prices stay this high. A lot of people say they're going back down again." Hah, wrong. "I need it because every 14 months we take a road trip to Disney Land. I'd much rather impress the other drivers with my Expedition, than feel like I'm fitting a stereotype with that van over there."

When does it end? People obviously don't care until it makes them less "comfortable".

In the meantime there's no ice in the North Pole. NO ICE! What happens when the North Atlantic current shuts down and Europe freezes over? Or when the Midwest becomes a desert and half of America starves? Oh but maybe you'll be dead by then so who cares :shrug:

All the technology is there, and proven; the people loved their plug-in electric cars. We just can't buy them because of bad politics. The only reason we're still guzzling gas is to make the BUsh family some more millions. Solar energy and wind energy can run this country, and will, when we get some decent people into the government.
And millions of new jobs will be created. It's not by chance that the rest of the world is switching over now.
For now, I have an old cadillac. not ideal at all. It's what I could afford. It's 15 years old, and I'm hoping it will last till I can buy an electric car. no more oil changes. no more parts replacement.
in other words, the solutions are there. Our federal government is not interested in solving our problems. they're just bleeding every penny out of us that they can for as long as they can.

Believe me, I live in the sticks and cannot afford a new car (I can barely afford gas), I own my home and do not want to move. Why should I have to? Gas simply should not be 4 bucks a gallon. K&R, BTW.

Praising the rising prices of fuel or others that lambast me for not being more "eco-freindly"...

again what was I supposed to do?

You did what you had to do to survive, we, who can see past our vegan burrito get that. Those who don't can go hump a tree. Oh and For those who take offense, I recycle EVERYTHING and chop my own wood, buy used clothing and am devising a rain water system for my GARDEN. Fuck your 20 grand hybrid. Go edwardsguy, do what you have to.

On edit, Gen-Xer also, born 1972.

that the rise in fuel prices will make car sellers realize that Peugeot 207's which get 60 mpg and seat 5 complete with airbags can sell well in the USA for around 12 000 us dollars.

PS I was born in 1979, I always thought I was at the end of gen x but now I hear that I am part of the millennial generation???? Which is it? I liked Counting Crows and Nirvana way more than Limp Biscuit NIN more than Marylin Manson does that make me gen x?

As far a I am concerned Rock topped out with Motley Crue and Posion...:hide:

Rock of Love has been my naughty addiction (DU-straction), if you know what I mean. Fluff is good sometimes. ;-)

On edit, the Cure is also a must.

Motley Crue, Kickstart my Heart, Dr. Feelgood. cool, Poison???? 22 years of mental tears cries a suicidal vietnam vet .....who fought a losing war on a foreign shore to find his country didnt want him back.......while the poor they life from hand to mouth the rich drink from a golden cup... cool Poison.

You know it, baby!

Have to sing along with each each time I hear it!

can you give me the name?

also what part of the states are you living in???

I am in the part of France called the Var, where Saint Tropez is and not long from Cannes, so our prices for houses are really REALLY exagerated. I live up in the hills away from the coast but still the prices are TOO MUCH for the average working folks....If only we could find work up in the mountains we would move;.....

years since I heard that one....

cue the solo......do rockers still know how to do guitar solos??? even Metallica forgot how to do solos.....and Dimebag from Pantera remembered but he got shot to death on stage.......

imagine that....

Typical of me. Who knew a song inspired by the love of a stripper... Gotta love Brett.

Sweet Child o Mine, one of the best riffs ever in my opinion. GNR were great hard rockers Bon Jovi, Dry County....I saw Bon Jovi in cocert back in 1990, I wore a Bon Jovi patch on my jacket between Slayer and Pantera and did not give a damn if other headbangers gave me shit for it....also had a poison patch next to my Nirvana patch.....

Just kiddin.... ;-)

I miss those days, true sign of age.

break the old leather jacket
out once in a while when I am visiting my parents in Chicago....The teenagers don't know whether to laugh or to think that I am some kind of cool old headbanger.....

Truly awesome. They will get it some day.

Welcome, young one! :-)

I always felt closer to you "slackers" who were not happy to work harder than your parents to have less.....you older gen xers laid the groundwork for folks like me, after the Reagan 80's we needed a generation to say that family comes BEFORE career....

Quality of life trumps quantity of bucks!

When I asked him if he left a girlfriend behind in his home country when he came here to work as a meterologist he said "what, leave a girfriend for a job?????" he barely belived me when I told him that many in the USA had and continue to do so. At least us gen x'ers know better for the most part.

screamed with despair, not anger. I loved the anger of metal, but Kurt's voice, you could hear the pain in it. Like some kind of beaten animal, like he ended up like a dog who'd been beat too much...;sorry had to quote Bruce Springsteen, even if he is from an earlier generation....

We could have gotten ourselves away from gasoline simply by having the Dreaded Big Government take the lead decades ago. But the CAFE standards stagnated in the mid-80s! It could be at 35 or 40 mpg NOT, not years from now.

But, no, let the Sunny Happy Free Market work it's magic.


*poof* Hey, lookit that! You're wallet's magically empty! :wow:


:-)

it is even more in the uk

AHHH, France, I've been. Would love to see it again.

solidarity still exists, but individualism is creeping in more and more, it makes me sad. There is a huge strike today to protest against making people work 41 years for retirement instead of 39 years. I love the fact that we take our gripes to the streets. The fishermen here protested high diesel prices by BLOCKING PETROL SHIPS FROM OUR PORTS, the governent caved in after a week......rock on fishermen......even if it made my diesel go up 20 cents a gallon because of the shortage.....

Viva La Revolution! Or, something like that. High School French was a long time ago!

travailleurs travailleuses du monde....battent ensemble contre la mondialisation ultra libérale (libérale in French means laissez faire economics. but the socialists have taken libérale to mean laissez faire on things like gay marriage, drugs etc. now and STILL CLAIM FOR STRONG STATE INVOLVEMENT IN THE ECONOMY!!!!!I hope the mayor of Paris will become the first gay president of France in 4 years.......

Jealous. Obama is our hope.

I will be voting Obama in November, so long as he gets the nomination, but that is for another thread. Obama will improve many MANY things for Americans and folks in the world.

It is obvious you love your country, of birth and choice. We all should be citizens of the world.

You have health care, a lot of us stay in perma-debt because of medical bills.

At what price can stay?

None of us did anything wrong. Maybe we should. Maybe it is torches and pitchforks time. We should visit the oil companies first.

record profits....;;and we get fucked over just to go to work when we live in the countryside. My wife works near where we live as a teacher, but I have to go 50 miles to the coast to find work. There are trains but I would often have to wait 3 hours after my shift to catch the next train.

for the "new" speculators...

At first houses were out of reach for me...now it's gas...

I dream of having a house with a garden like my parents, but that just will not happen. At least we were able to buy a condo.......but damn....my wife and I each work, each have a master's degree, and as teachers we do not deserve to live in a house with a yard for our kids to play in.....what the fuck??????

in the rest of the world. you did nothing wrong because the 12,000 dollar gas sippers that seat 5 are not sold in the states. on edit i am addicted to air.......

That line just cracked me up! :P

We could all move "closer to our jobs" too, as another poster stated. :eyes:

Great rant and btw? You're doing what we all do... trying to survive in this world.

There's not a GD thing wrong with that at all!

:kick: & Recommended

what about when you and your spouse cannot find work in the same town?

What about when you get laid off and have to change jobs, it is not so easy to sell the house is it????

I'm guessing you read http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3323371">this. Just making sure. ;)

:hi:

I have seen the posts you are referring to. Some people just don't get it.

I'm a baby boomer. We went to school, went to college, got skills to make ourselves more employable. Bosses don't care what you can do, or how much you know. All they want to know is how cheap they can get you.

I finally said, screw the job market. They don't want anyone over 40, you might get sick and use that insurance.

I understand about the lack of mass transit. Some of the posters here think everybody lives in San Francisco, Boston or NYC. Well, we don't.

In Texas, everything is quite far apart. If you can stand the insanity of Houston or Dallas, Ok, but the housing market has gone nuts in Houston and Dallas.

The nearest big city to Houston is Austin and that's 180 miles. San Antonio is 200, Dallas is 250.

Houston has awful mass transit and you risk getting heat exhaustion in the summer waiting for the bus. Summer runs from May to November -- not kidding.


Some people have no empathy and no compassion for people who are struggling in some way. I thought they were called Freepers and Republicans, but a lot of them do not go by that label.

Since my kids are Texans (Born in Fort Worth in '04 and '05 respectivley) I know what you mean by the craziness. After my heart attack, I moved to coprorate office for RadioShack in Fort Worth. At that time housing was stil reasonalbe...but the job market sucked...had to move back to Ohio for work.

:hangover:

I hear ya and agree completely! I'm in a smaller community that you are and am still waiting on that magic bus.


:kick: and recommend.

Hell, I fit the description of elitist in just about every aspect of the definition, but I largely agree with you.

I suggest you keep you anger properly focused.

Are the ones who look down their noses at anyone that even owns a mode of transportation that utilizes an internal combustion engine. "I have not spent a penny on gas in a year...why can you not do the same?" Or how about the sanctimonious bicycle riders: "Good, means less people on the road so I won't have to fight them"

the only thing any of us can do is push for changes in public policy that would support a better infrastructure, including public transportation, help for low and mid income housing, universal health care, quality education at all levels for people of all economic classes, and research and technology aimed at finding "green" solutions to our current energy crises. This is not a burden that can be borne by the poor and lower middle class person - you're right, most of us don't have the options available to add solar panels to our rented homes or apts, we don't have the $$$ to buy or run hybrid cars, and we don't all have access to safe transportation to and from work and school, or the $$$ to acquire housing near work and school.

Together, we could work to make the needed changes. Singly, all we can do is struggle to keep from being pushed into the undertow. Often, the struggle becomes adversarial, not just individual.

you take a deep breath and start thinking about how you and your family can make deep changes in your lifestyle because we are all facing this and we need to get started. Carpools, walks, fewer trips across town, skimping and saving on some items to be able to afford others, living with less so that we can give more away to others who are worse off, focusing on our community as much as we focus on our own family.

You have right on track on one really important insight: The conservatives have been selling us a big, crappy bill of goods for a long time talking about 'consumer choice' -- you can buy a red car or a blue car, a big car or a bigger car -- but they been preventing us from working together so we have REAL choice. I don't have a choice to take light rail to work unless I get politically active and get my neighbors to demand a light rail system. I don't have a choice to create a community electric co-operative so my energy comes from wind and sun and is stored in batteries shared by my neighbors and I -- so my energy is free and I can plug in my electrical vehicle. I want the kinds of choices that require that I take action with my community members.

What else can you do? Start thinking about deep changes in your lifestyle that you can make if you band together with community members so that you can all do well through the upcoming changes.

A storm can be devastating and it can be cleansing.

Peace.

Just received in the mail a "final" notice on the old electric bill. Not that it won't be paid till tomorrow...had to prioritze from last payday ya know...so what else should I "cut back on" or "sacrifice"?

Truly. I've been there and I am pretty confident that sometime in future I'll wind up back there. We are all facing a need to make deep transformations in our lives and I believe this process will continue over the next few decades. We'll wind up having what matters most to us, but lots will change and that change will make us fear that we might lose what means the most in our lives. When we reject fear and stay open to really new ways of being we will make the transitions most easily.

Peace.

:applause:

I love the Prius as much as anyone else, but fitting three car seats or booster seats in one is something I haven't figured out yet.

We don't have that magic bus where we live either. Living rural definitely has it's benefits, but public transportation is not one of them.

But so what? What are you owed? The poor rural Poles who were invaded and slaughtered by Nazis in 1939 did nothing wrong either. The millions of people who died in the flu outbreak of 1918 did nothing wrong. The millions devastated by the depression in the early 30's had done nothing wrong. The Iraqi citizens who found themselves invaded and terrorized by us did nothing wrong. The poor Chinese folks buried by the earthquake last week did nothing wrong. Shall I continue?

Are you owed something because you did nothing wrong?

I think he is pissed off by sanctimonious ass holes who have lectured in here and berated in here and have trotted around on their high horses for a bit too long without being reined in.

Tell me where he says that anyone owes him anything?

He just wants to go to work, pay the bills and have a little left over to order a pizza once in a while.

:shrug:

I think the OP anger and frustration is honestly come by, but it's being directed at the wrong group. People who say higher gas prices are the only way we'll break "our" addiction to oil are actually correct. But, by "our addiction" they refer to the corporations that make cars, congress who mandates (or fails to mandate) CAFE standards, local governments that fund mass transit, employers who could allow for more telecommuting or better reimburse mileage, and entrepreneurs who already have many working solutions ready to go.

"We" is a collective "we." We have to hear this person's pain and do something about it. As it stands, no corporation is going to manufacture efficient cars out of the goodness of their heart. It's going to take a massive hit to their bottom line for anything to happen -- and in the case of AMERICAN car manufacturers, they are so deaf/blind/stupid, that multiple hits to their bottom line aren't enough to get with the program. Pick up a Car and Driver and see what's on deck for the next few years in American car roll-outs -- 8-cylinder dragsters. They are insane.

We are "owed" something by "our governments" b/c WE ARE OUR GOVERNMENTS, and if "we" aren't doing anything about our collective crises, then we are going to be extinct in short order.

Oh I don't know...How about: Life, Liberty and the Pusuit of Happiness?

Or maybe this: Establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense and PROMOTE THE GENERAL WELFARE...

each other.

We're all doing what we can with what we have in our current situations.

Its hard being told day in and out that you're a "bad progressive" or not really trying hard enough because you drive or live outside a public transportation hub or have kids or whatever.

It gets tiring. I mostly ignore it, but it does start to rub the wrong way after a while.

Look around your house and see how much plastic you use. Plastic is a petroleum product. I've almost (but not quite entirely) given up using baggies and tupperware, using glass containers to store leftovers. I buy milk in a glass bottle and return the bottles (I know this isn't an option in most places, but even cardboard milk containers are better then the plastic ones.) I cook in glass and metal pots and pans, I eat and drink off glass and ceramic. In general, my motto is: if it's a petroleum product, I don't want my food or lips to touch it.

Other household plastic that can be cut down: use a canvas bag to grocery shop instead of collecting an endless supply of plastic bags given by the store, or ask for paper bags instead of plastic. Stop buying CDs and DVDs and videotapes and take what you want out of the public library. (Even small town libraries have systems where they can borrow items from larger libraries.)

Of course, there's so much we can't avoid in using plastics. Hard to buy fresh meat not wrapped in plastic, or deodorant, or shampoo, or a non-fiberglass shell for our car, or petroleum-free pantyhose, and the list goes on. But there are some alternatives to oil usage that are really quite do-able and don't cost as much as a Prius (which has a plastic dashboard, after all). And every little bit helps.

My brother, all good wishes to you. The part about your nice salary and the medical crisis is straight out of my life. I had a job so good, so well paid, and it ended one day when I was in a multi car collision. My status went from world wide recognition- I kid you not- to disabled debtor in an instant. I empathize with that part of your story so very much. It is hell. This stranger will keep you in his meditations or whatever. Those who have not walked in those shoes, they just don't usually get much of it. Struck down in our primes! And still not insane!
Lesser people have been destroyed by such things. Those we should look to have overcome far greater obsticals. Peace and great good fortune to you and your family.

My best to you and yours!

We've all got it bad.

There isn't an alternative because people would rather bitch about how bad they have it instead of working toward the alternatives. Cheap oil is over and "the times, they are a-changin'" as Mr. Dylan used to say in a time before nasty underwear commercials...lol.

And next time think before you say "I didn't do anything wrong" in the same breath that you call me an elitist asshole and a dumbass fucker.

(EDIT: Sorry about the previous paragraph. It's a rough morning and they threw Gigantour in the middle of the week for some reason. I'm not thinkin' straight this AM. I loves me some Megadeth, but damn...on a Wednesday night? Anyway, I realize you weren't talking to me personally and so I shouldn't have taken it personally. Again...sorry.)

I ain't mad at ya....Welcome to DU. :hi:

Of course the country should have invested in alternative energies years ago.
Of course we should all do our parts to conserve.
Of course it's annoying to see people driving around solo in enormous vehicles.

To suggest that these problems would somehow improve if people with the least resources are punished more than anyone else for gas prices is stupid, thoughtless, cruel, and very immature.

I'd ignore anyone posting dumb stuff like that.

and I am older than you - I was born in 1957.

We would buy a new hybrid car if we could afford the payments. We can not. My husband takes the trolley to work because it is the most efficient way he can get to his downtown job from our suburb. I have gotten very disgusted over the "I do everything on a bicycle" posts too. I think it's fine if you want to do that but try coming home from Costco with a weeks load of crap on a bicycle.
I have the only vehicle during the day because I am the taxi. My little kids go to public school and I drive them there and pick them up - I also take the husband to the trolley station and pick him up.
Our 1999 Isuzu Rodeo is in very good condition and is a very dependable smaller SUV which is comfortable for our family.

I try to ignore the bossy posters here who insist that I can not possibly be a real Democrat and a true liberal because I drive any form of an SUV. My car is no monster and it is the smallest thing that will work for us. I know a lot of people who are in the same boat as you and me. It is just the way it is.

I have been told I am stupid for living in San Diego. okay... I am the stupid person who lives in one of the nicest cities on the planet. It would be a lot nicer if it were not for the fact it is filled to the brim with Republicans... But I grew up jere and my husbands government job is here - Oh, he could transfer but he retires in less than a year and he will need to find another job to fill the gap in our income. We like it here. Our kids are happy here. So we should move? Yes it is expensive but we bought our home before prices went crazy and so it makes sense for us to stay put. But I have been told that if we are in the way of one of our famous wild fires and my house burns down, I deserve it. Not over at the Free Republic but here.

People have a lot of preconceived notions about how we are supposed to live our lives.

I care about who YOU VOTE FOR that's all - if you vote for your Democratic candidate - that's fine... end of story. And if you are happy, then that's good too. :pals:

I telecommute. My husband travels and also works from our home. I drive a minivan. It functions as a child hauler, a pick up truck and a way to get a week's worth of groceries home from Costco and Kroger's.

I try my damndest to drive as little as possible. Why? Because we are running out of oil. I can afford the gas; I'm one of the lucky ones. I can afford it if it goes to $10 a gallon, but that's not the point. The point is, we're running out. We ALL need to conserve, not just because of the prices, because it's going to go away soon and we will all be royally fucked.

and, as far as the Prius goes. My kids would never fit in it, so there you go.

I was born in 1969, too.

I never made anywhere near 100K. I buy my cars used for cash, and have never driven a gas-guzzler even when gas was "cheap"?

What nerve for a man who has made a much better than average income and squandered on gas-guzzlers and car loans to lash out at people who are much poorer, yet living in more expensive areas of the country - as "elitist"?

I can only surmise that the prices are hitting you pretty hard, or else you wouldn't be so furious - for that, I empathize with you.

I wound up drowning in credit card debt because of a stagnant wage and sky-high California rent, so my planning hasn't always been the best either. Fortunately, I was able to move to a cheaper town and get a better-paying job, but I continue to live frugally.


I don't know if your tirade is in response to one of my posts, but if it was, I really want to emphasize that the point was that we can all do better one way or another in our daily lives. The point was NOT that everyone needs to buy a Prius.

Look, if the gas prices aren't hurting you then fine, keep up the gas-guzzling. But if you are hurting, instead of lashing out at people who are merely putting forth ideas, why not brainstorm for things that you CAN do in your situation to save on gas and money?

WE are not the people who jacked up gas prices on you. If anything, we econobox-drivers helped keep them cheaper, longer for you by depressing demand with our gas-sipping cars.



I disagree with the posters who said that high gas prices are a cause for celebration. I was not in on that. But man, things are not going back to the way they were. At some point, you are going to have to adapt. The lashing out is not going to fix anything.

"Gas Guzzling"?

I drive to work, stop at the grocery on the way home and once in a while venture into town for a little fun...sheesh...again...elitist...you always seem to have the answer for all. BTW..Why don't YOU run for president? You seem to think you have all the answers...

Oh...and BTWW...That 100K damn near caused me my life...litterally...so I could live the "American Dream"

Why have a big outburst if you're not either driving a long commute or driving an especially inefficient car?

Who the hell ever said everyone must buy a Prius this minute or they are eco-villains?

He also pooh-poohed any sort of ideas for conserving fuel in another thread. If he's not gas-guzzling, then why the out-of-proportion hostility towards conservation and people promoting it?

The people who say that higher gas prices are the way to break our addiction to oil are correct, b/c the only "people" congress listens to are corporations. When corporations' bottom line are endangered, then Congress moves into action. When lowly people like you and me are in dire straits, we can go to hell for all they care.

The people who say higher gas prices are the way to break our addiction to oil aren't responsible for the high prices. They're just stating the obvious. They're not elitists -- they're in the same damn boat we all are. No one has a special pump that spits out gas at $.99 a gallon (except maybe Dick Cheney and Prince Bandar). And when it gets right down to it, I bet most people aren't even that in love with our current car technology or culture. We'd ALL LOVE TO SEE THINGS get better. We know there are better ways to get around. We know the technology exists. We know that planning and zoning can be changed. We know that employers could EASILY do with more telecommuting and pay better mileage reimbursements. We just need a reason -- and YOU are that reason.

Please don't direct your anger at the rest of "us" who are in the same boat, facing the same challenges, and who have NO POWER to relieve you of your current difficulty. Direct it where it belongs -- at the leaders, the "deciders" and the profiteers. Join the people you mistakenly call elitist because you are exactly the reason why they are 100% correct. Nothing is going to happen until we stand up and let everyone know we can't take it anymore.

There's no more slack we can pick -- it's their turn to create the slack and they have the record profits to make it happen. Did they think they were just going to keep that money? If so, it's time they got a big dose of reality.

governement is fatally dysfunctional, on verge of collapse - if not immediately, no more timeline than 20 years tops? What then?

yeah, it's on the verge of collapse, and we are in the process of picking up the pieces. we've only just begun.

Technology did not stop advancing in 1975.

Hang in there.

Dear edwardsguy,

Maybe you're alright. Maybe you need a big car to carry your family. Maybe you need a car to drive to work. But not everybody does. It drives me crazy to see some assholes driving their pickup truck to go grocery shopping. Or have one of those, and never in their entire life carry anything with it. I carried all furniture I bought from Ikea in my honda accord. I loaded it up that I scared the sales people from the store, but I did it. When I need to carry something large I rent a truck: the smallest one I need. When I rent a car, I don't ask for the sporty Mustang or some minivan, or a truck. I actually ask for the car that has the best gas-mileage.
I will start some work this summer in a different city and I did look for a place to stay withing walking distance. This way, I won't need a car.
My parents raised me well. We did have a car but we used it only for going on vacations. Once a year no more! The rest, walk and public transportation. You know, it was good exercise and less time for TV. You say there is no bus taking you to your company? What if you and the rest of 30,000 people working there couldn't drive to work? Don't you think the company would start a bus service? Or your small community might do that. I'm sorry you take it personally. Fact is you alone are in a pinch and won't be able to do much. But if the whole community decides to do something, a lot can be done.

So sorry you see me as an elitist asshole. Maybe your anger is misdirected. Maybe you should bitch against the fat cats that profit from gas prices, not me - the one
that's trying to do something about it. Don't get me wrong, I love to lay my butt into a comfy car and zip through the wind; it feels sporty, it feels young and manly. But sorry, at $4/gallon, no, thank you. And no, I don't need my lawn mowed by a gas mower; in the past there were manual ways of handling it and it was good exercise. I don't need a motor leaf blower either....

So instead of complaining, why don't you talk to your community members and ... well, ... start a bus service to your (and other) big companies. Who knows? You might even profit from this. I would at least think about it if I were you.

Not everyone can move, or buy a car or get a different job. I take care of my bedridden elderly mother and therefore I'm basically stuck with my situation. I live in the SF BAy Area which means I have to drive on freeways because the public transit system simply doesn't hack it. I can't move because of my mother and her health insurance. I can't sell and downsize because we live in a condo with a low mortgage. What would I downsize to? If I sold the condo and moved closer to my job I would have to pay double or triple what I pay on my mortgage and we can barely make it on my salary and her small retirement. Month after month I need to take money out of my retirement to pay the bills.

I'm 60 years old. Where would I get a new job? Who would hire me? I'm an administrative assistant in UC Berkeley which has excellent health benefits and a retirement system even though they don't pay a salary that's compatible with the Bay Area. It's a great place to work but happens to be in one of the highest cost of living areas in the country.

So what can I do? I've paid off almost all my credit cards (another thing that people in this are are forced to do is max out their credit cards) with what would have been my retirement, because the way our economy is tanking my IRA won't be worth a damn in a year anyway but the credit card companies will make sure they get paid or me and my mother will be out on the street. Should I pick out a cart I can put her in and transport her around in and call it home?

"Should I pick out a cart I can put her in and transport her around in and call it home?"

And yeah, with 3 kids, a prius isn't going to work. I have one toddler and one baby on the way, and it won't work for me.


Please don't feel as if people think you are the enemy. You aren't!

One of us is very confused about math

fight for what you know is right.

Sheep only have one, inevitable, future.

Your candidate by far had the best ideas for the future...but alas...the powers that be marginalized him.

easy and entails great risk, but that risk must be taken or else...

well, we can see the consequences of that inaction all around us today.

I'm on your side there.

Don't want to go there right now...

I work for an airline (a very good, very well-liked low-cost carrier) and I can tell you, low-cost airlines (and the low fares they promote) are about to be EXTINCT - within a few weeks really -because of jet fuel prices - which are about $8 more per barrel than oil.

I have poured 10 years of my life - blood, sweat and tears and all my energy and initiative - into promoting quality customer service and in analyzing the voice of the customer for our customer relations department and officers. We have a great company, a great culture - and these fucking speculators and BIG FUCKING OIL MAY THEY SQUIRM AND ROAST IN THE WHITE HOT FIRE OF A THOUSAND SUNS - are going to ruin air travel as we know it FOREVER.

And yes, I enjoy this industry - and yes, I realize that the carbon footprint is abominable and sometimes feel guilty, BUT I have loved being able to travel to some some amazing cities in the USA on my flight benefits, and being able help people get from Atlanta to Dallas for their grandma's funeral. Air travel is important! Especially for regular folks, remember that even 30 years ago only VERY RICH people got to travel...

And my husband works in logistics, and was laid off because his freight business (and all the truckers - who are the salt of this earth, who are the ones that make the money go around) are REALLY HURTING.


THIS PRICE-GOUGING IS FUCKING PERSONAL!

If I am not mistaken, air travel is produces less of a carbon footprint (per person) than driving...so don't feel ashamed by that!

I am truly concerned about ALL the working class stiffs with this economy being what it is...

completely change their way of life uncaring that maybe its not financial feasible for many even if you wanted too......tell em.

I too am a Gen Xer divorced parents as well. This shitty suck ass situation was shoved down our fucking throats because many people of our parents generation voted and put a retard in the White House. I'm worried we are going to have a repeat of this insanity in the next election.

It's not our fault I agree! If it wasn't for my car getting totaled recently I'd still be driving my old car. But fortunately my insurance covered enough for a decent down payment on my Honda Civic Hybrid. But my husband still drives a Ford Escape. All I can say is do whatever you can to conserve in your household (compact fluorescent ect..) at least you'll save some money and offset the higher costs of energy and groceries.

When I read that you had a heart attack at age 32, I was startled.

Healthwise, are you doing better? :)

thanks for asking. Definitely changes ones outlook on life...

K/R

Straight talk.

You give me public transportation tomorrow and I'm on it yesterday.

I work part-time as a substitute teacher right in my small community. I drive as little as I can get away with, combining trips as much as I can. But this goddamn cost of gas is still taking its toll. I put $13.00 in (all the cash I had on hand) Monday afternoon and I was driving on fumes today. And I drive a small car that gets reasonably decent mileage. Monday I paid $4.25 a gallon. Today it was up to $4.29.

You didn't do anything wrong. I didn't do anything wrong. I am extremely resentful, however, of those moronic idiots who voted for the chimp -twice- and got us into this mess in the first place.

Knowing that I have to choose between gas or milk...

It would be understandable if you were a single parent but why drag the whole brood along?

They'll just get in the way and annoy other shoppers.

So your OP is quite incorrect.

LOL...You crack me up!

Scenario: OK Honey...you got to go to the grocery store last week while I stayed and watched the kids, so it's my turn this week! But I've been stuck in the house all week...I need some interaction with other humans as well ya know...

And BTW...Fuck you for assuming my kids annoy other shoppers...take your bike and sanctimonious attitude a shove it up your ass...

Chat with the clerk and make the lines even longer. How considerate.

one does what one can...sorry my existance on this planet bothers you so much...

Please explain

Believe it or not...Is really the highlight of our "social" calendar...get it? We can not afford a babysitter to do anything else (even if we had the extra money to spend). So going out for the week, wandering through the store, taking our time is...well kinda fun.

Again...one does what one can

edit for sp

Sorry if that makes me an "elitist"

BTW...we do have parks and yes we use them...but you know sometimes the kids like to go to the store and look at the toys...

How do you think children learn to behave in a store? How do you think children learn how to shop and judge what's best for the budget and for them to eat? It's actually a learning experience. There are always going to be parents who don't watch their kids, but to tell the OP he's doing something wrong because he takes his kids to the grocery store is ridiculous.

He tells total strangers to shove things up their ass.

I'll bet his kids are real charmers.

...and are one of those people who doesn't like to see them in public either.

My two boys come to the grocery store with us and we keep them with us.

They learn about reading labels and how much things cost. Sometimes they are loud, but little kids are loud sometimes.

Yes, they stand in line with us and they chat a little with the checkers.

Kids are people too, they're just smaller and haven't learned to judge others yet.

you paint with a pretty broad brush.

Kids are people and need to learn how to behave in all kinds of situations, the way they learn that is to be taken into those situations by their parents (or other caregivers).

Some kids annoy people because their parents haven't properly prepared them for the situation they find themselves in.

Some people are just annoyed by the fact that kids exist and will be angry about even the best-behaved children.

Most kids and adults fall into the middle...but not taking my kids with me to everyday places is not an option. I want them to have a variety of experiences, both mundane and exotic (well, what passes for exotic in Iowa). That includes the grocery store, the hardware store, the park, and even family friendly restaurants.

it will never stop screwing us until it's replaced.

What does that suggest to you?

I posted this hoping that some would realize that there is not any one single issue that is at fault...rather a series of events/policies that have us screwed and in a no-win situation...ranting if you will...

To think that things getting worse is a 'good' thing is the same mindset that Bush has about bringing 'freedom' and 'democracy' to Iraq. It's a good thing for things to get worse than they were when Saddam was there because it's the people's fault for being addicted to his regime and letting him oppress them. They should stop whining and be grateful.

as existed (to a degree) from the late '30s thru the '60s. They get very upset when they realize it's been re-written to read "You must play by the rules and in return we will treat you as our livestock and labor pool. Or worse.".

Humans are predators of other humans - or at least that's what I've observed but I was born in 1980 after Reagan was elected, so hey.

My point was that the choices you make in your personal life don't have any effect on gas prices. Well, maybe the choices you make re energy use are a tiny drop in the bucket - but personal choices outside of energy consumption has absolutely nothing to do with it. And I'm not sure how they could - I know that oil company execs haven't come to interview me to make sure that I'm conforming enough to deserve cheap gas.

Conformity is evil and one of the main reasons why the species sucks anyway. Play by your own rules and do what you want and what feels right to you, not what other people tell you to do. Just doing whatever other people tell you to do and not being able to think independently is what got the species to where it is today - on the brink of destroying the planet.

as in excess waste.

Yep, except got born into wrong place, wrong time, society that is wrong. Who didn't?

"You see, there are those among us (DU'ers) who are praising the higher prices of fuel and wishing it to go higher so that we may drop our “ADDICTION” to oil. Excuse me…did you say addiction? Let me clue you dumbass fuckers in on something…it cannot be an addiction if there is no alerternative! GET IT!"

The striking symptom of an addiction is the strong belief that there is no alternative but to keep on injecting. Of course there is alternative, there allways is, but as usual with most difficult addictions, the cure may as well kill, no one is denying that.

All the unthinking big mouths who say crap like "I walk (or ride my bike) to work. It's just a mile away. You should move closer to the jobs" need to stop and take a look at reality. If all of us who live in small towns or rural areas or depressed urban areas suddenly descended upon those urban areas where jobs are more plentiful and more nearby, it would be a HUGE mess! The vastly increased demand for housing, transportation, water, police and fire services, other infrastructure, etc would make life untenable for both the current walk-to-workers and the newcomers.

The answer does not lie in moving all the country mice to the city.

PS for us the nearest bus route is about 70 miles away - about 10 miles farther than the drive to work.

That's a theory I've recently read -- that oil itself has not really gone up that much in price for those who pay in Euros. The problem is simply that the dollar has fallen so badly against the Euro, and we're seeing the consequences.

If the prices stay up and driving actually becomes prohibitively expensive, society will adjust by adding more mass transit and altering zoning so that housing will be closer to places of employment.

Also now with the internet it is possible for more people to work without traveling.