Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

The way to get rid of the Arizona law is to make them enforce it.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-23-10 10:58 PM
Original message
The way to get rid of the Arizona law is to make them enforce it.
1) Find American Citizens with no criminal records. Preferably brown people. Make sure these people have valid drivers' licenses, but no birth certificates.
2) Demand cops verify these people's citizenship.
3) Make sure the people being verified answer the cop's questions in Spanish.

Dress like an immigrant and put yourself in situations where your immigration status will be checked. Have insufficient documentation if you dare.

Yes, this requires people willing to get themselves (wrongfully) arrested.

Also, you need to approach every police officer you see and demand that they verify someone's citizenship.

At every opportunity.

Every single time you see a police officer.

Maybe call the police station, and tell them that the first name in the white pages directory may not be a U.S. Citizen, and you demand they go to that person's house and check.

At the conclusion of the call, hit redial, and give the cops the name of the next person in the phone book.

Skip the Spanish-sounding names, just in case.

Use this law to punish Arizona until it costs so much, that they have to abandon it.




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Sebastian Doyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-23-10 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. I see the wisdom in what you're proposing
And if it worked the way you describe, it might well be effective.

Unfortunately, with racist hatred being the root cause of this, and a hateful racist being the chief law enforcement officer in AZ's most populated county, there's also the potential of many people being shot.... some with bullets, some with tasers. :evilfrown:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-23-10 11:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. What you are suggesting could get people wrongfully hurt or dead or tortured.
It won't be Phoenix PD enforcing it will be those nutty Joe's kids.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-23-10 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Yes, I know. That's how Civil Disobedience and Direct Action works sometimes.
Edited on Fri Apr-23-10 11:10 PM by Ian David


How bad do you want it is the next question, I guess.

People are going to get tortured and killed if you DON'T do this, too.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-23-10 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. After one person makes enough of those calls, he/she'd be in the pokey with no call.
But if enough people jammed the phones we could overfuckingflow the jails. :evilgrin: It's beautiful camping weather right now, but it's gona get hot. Joepinkunderweardude would need to expand and that's what all the private prisons are for doncha know.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Start with the names of people who have written Letters to the Editor in favor of the law.
Report them to law enforcement as possible illegal aliens.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
csziggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-23-10 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Interesting idea, but don't involve innocent people without their consent
Maybe start with a list of the legislators who voted for this abomination of a bill - find out their schedule and call law enforcement where ever they are appearing that day. Move on to the local and state GOP members. Tea Party members, talk radio hosts, use your imagination.

I don't like the idea of inflicting law enforcement officers on random people who have no personal involvement, even if that might point out the obscenity of this law quicker.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Good point. Start with names of people who have written Letters to the Editor in favor of the law.
Otherwise, I think you're right-- don't involve innocent people without their consent.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SPedigrees Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 12:29 AM
Response to Original message
6. It's headed for the Supreme court, but it will take an arrest
of an American citizen and will have to pass through many lower court trials to get there.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
winstars Donating Member (405 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. It's Lunch Counter Time!!!

People are gonna need to spend some time in jail, overload Joe's tents and the courts... It worked in the South and can work again...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cynatnite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 01:38 AM
Response to Original message
8. Personally, I think every Hispanic in the nation should converge on Arizona. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SPedigrees Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. every *legal* hispanic. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Good point. The ones who will be able to document their citizenship after they're arrested.
And who don't have any outstanding wants, warrants, or criminal records.

Also, do not do this if you have ever had something like automobile excise tax that went unpaid until you had a warrant issued, even if you paid it and cleared it before being arrested.

In On July 8th, 2000 Attleboro, Massachusetts the cops held a woman overnight for that, even though she had cleared the warrant a year earlier.




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Muddy Waters Guitars Donating Member (56 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 03:47 PM
Response to Original message
13. This is a good idea-- it'll work
People are raising valid concerns here, but the heart of your proposal makes sense and is a classic tool for undermining and overturning terrible laws-- pointing out how ludicrous they are in practice, with actual test cases. I especially like the idea of having them answer only in Spanish, to trick the bigots into making the bad arrests.

I've seen this done in other cases and it's very feasible-- wrongful arrests get the cops and the chiefs in big trouble, and since Sheriff Joe Arpaio is already up to his neck in trouble, this will tie his hands further and bleed the law to death by a thousand cuts. They won't be able to keep the wrongfully arrested in jail for more than a single night, but every single blunder brings the state closer to the recognition of what a disastrous mistake its lawmakers and governor had committed, leading ultimately to repeal (if it isn't overturned by the courts before that).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. We need everyone to "wear the yellow armbands." n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. Hey, it's what the bad guys have done for years to hobble legal abortion.
Whittle away at it, on all sides and at every imaginable angle, with subversive little whittlings.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Boiling the frog.
Boiling frog
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The boiling frog story is a widespread anecdote describing a frog slowly being boiled alive. The premise is that if a frog is placed in boiling water, it will jump out, but if it is placed in cold water that is slowly heated, it will not perceive the danger and will be cooked to death. The story is often used as a metaphor for the inability of people to react to significant changes that occur gradually.<1> According to contemporary biologists the premise of the story is not literally true; an actual frog submerged and gradually heated will jump out.<2><3> However, a variety of 19th century research experiments suggested that the underlying premise is true, provided the heating is gradual enough.<4>

<snip>

The boiling frog story is generally told in a metaphorical context, with the upshot being that people should make themselves aware of gradual change lest they suffer eventual undesirable consequences. This may be in support of a slippery slope argument. It is also used in business to illustrate the idea that change needs to be gradual to be accepted.<1><5> The expression "boiling frog syndrome" is sometimes used as shorthand for the metaphor.<6><7>

The story has been retold many times and used to illustrate many different points. It has been used to warn about diverse phenomena, for example: in 1960 about sympathy towards the Soviet Union during the Cold War;<8> in 1980 about the impending collapse of civilization anticipated by survivalists;<9> in the 1990s about inaction in response to climate change and staying in abusive relationships.<10><11> It has also been used by libertarians to warn about slow erosion of civil rights.<5>

More:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling_frog

See also: http://hippiesympathizer.libsyn.com/_2005_05_22_nsa_s_hayden_tapped_to_be_cia_head

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Precisely. By the time anybody wakes up and looks around and realizes it - the deed is done.
That's why I'm always so pissed at many elders in our movement (my generation especially) that thought if we got pretty far on some progressive ideas, well, that was that. It was okay enough. And we did little to back it up or keep the fire going. Too many liberals sort of - as some of us have bemoaned here for a long time - rolled over and went back to sleep. No vigilance, no efforts to watch carefully and not let our guard down and figure that everything was just gonna keep evolving in a liberal fashion until we reached a greater, more sublime level of enlightened living and behavior. Well, it didn't work out that way. When the guard was lowered, the bad guys were crouched in the darkness like trap-door spiders, watching for weaknesses and complacency, and waiting for the chance to exploit them both. And they did.

Started after they got their Barry Goldwater clocks cleaned by LBJ in 1964. They resolved to rise again and hunkered down to do just that. The wealthiest families among them with large endowments and long lines of American Industrial Age aristocracy started building an infrastructure, founding and bankrolling institutions that, indeed, began to institutionalize and lend well-established identity "credibility" to the whole CONservative mindset. That mindset was allowed to grow and expand to unbridled extremes, embracing and sanctifying greed, selfishness, cheating, manipulation, deceit, and arrogance - a sense of exceptionalism such that rules didn't apply to them because they were so exceptional. Along the way, you worship profit over all else, you validate the "Me versus We" worldview, and certify and legitimize corner-cutting and penny-wise/pound-foolish approach. You demonize the idea of a government that works for the benefit of the common good and need, and completely obliterate the idea of that government being a benign entity - even when it WAS "of the PEOPLE, by the PEOPLE, and for the PEOPLE." Oops! maybe that's sounding a little too commie-pinko-socialist-fascist-Nazi...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 03:54 PM
Response to Original message
15. See related thread: Arizona: So just suppose...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 04:00 PM
Response to Original message
16. Productive anger Re: Arizona-- MASSIVE LATINO VOTER REGISTRATION AND GOTV!
Productive anger Re: Arizona-- MASSIVE LATINO VOTER REGISTRATION AND GOTV!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x8209838


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 04:10 PM
Response to Original message
18.  If you see two cops together, demand one of them verify the citizenship of the other cop.
Or any other law enforcement within sight.

Extra points if you run in front of the Governor's motorcade to do this.




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 06:40 PM
Response to Original message
21. Lemme tell you what else they hate.
They hate it when I put on my hat and roll down all the windows and roof and blast my Mexican music. :evilgrin: Snotsdale's ass is chapped. How dare a white blonde play that so loudly. Fuck 'em I say.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. Viva La Bamba!
Edited on Sat Apr-24-10 06:52 PM by Ian David
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jp6j5HJ-Cok

Or play Andean Flute Music.

It has the added benefit of keeping the giant guinea pigs away.





Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
23. See also: Hispanics fear profiling under new Arizona law
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-10 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
24. Can Arizona Afford to Implement S.B. 1070? By Seth Hoy (GONNA COST EM)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sat May 11th 2024, 10:41 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC