What's up with the killing of all these school children

in China.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8676613.stm
<snip>
Seven children and two adults have been hacked to death at a kindergarten in China, the latest in a series of school attacks, state media report.

Another 11 children were injured in the attack near Hanzhong city, Shaanxi province, Xinhua news agency reported.

The children were all thought to be under the age of six. Their attacker later killed himself.

There have been five violent school attacks in the past two months in China, leaving dozens dead or injured.

in china,e specially because of the 1 child policy. so those who are angry about the changes or whatever want to send a message by taking away the thing that is most important to people.

i would like to get a background of the attackers.

maybe mental health problems ?

in an article I read that China really doesn't do much in the way of mental health. Actually China doesn't do much for the health of its citizens at all. It's all the responsibility of the family.

What with the pokey and the man and the thing where the guy comes out of the thing and they like to go zip zip zah zoo.

I mentioned that news reports stated that the recent incident was the fourth incident in a month in China and he said that it was because of some video game that allows the player to plan and plot the entrance into a school and the killing of several small children before escaping the school.

Supposedly, the game has been banned by the Chinese government but apparently several whackos are still playing it!

During difficult economic times (Which was China in the mid 1800s) a little bit of knowledge of Christianity permitted a group of people who thought alike (do to the Christian teachings) to organize and rebel. In the Taiping rebellion the leadership claimed to be "Christian" and went through the motions of replacing older Chinese religions, but the main thrust was NOT religious but economic. Thus redistributing land was more important then the religion of the people who received the land. Maintaining the army was more important then spreading Christianity. The main thrust of any executions was to landlords NOT religious people. etc. The Taiping Rebellion is often attacked as Radical Christians trying to take over China, but once you look into it, it is desperate people rallying around a dogma that they see as a mechanism to unite and overthrow the tyrants ruling over them.

The subsequent Boxer Rebellion of the early 1900s is similar (AND the Boxers viewed the Christian Chinese as traitors given what the Western "Christian" nations had imposed on China since the Taiping Rebellion of the 1950s and 1860s). Like the Taiping rebellion the Boxers used a central dogma to unite, and once united to gather the peasants around them. Technically the Boxers were a "Religious" Movement, but like the earlier Taiping Rebellion the actual aim of most of the Rebels was overthrow of the Imperial Government which had came to be seen as the biggest problem for the Chinese Peasants.

For more on the Taiping Rebellion"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion

For more on the Boxers:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_Rebellion

The present Chinese Government is revamping the history of both groups, under Mao, both groups were viewed as peasants seeking the overthrow of a Government and landlords that suppressed them, the religious aspects were minimized. Today, the Chinese Government is emphasizing the religious aspects of each rebellion so to tell the Chinese people NOT to do similar revolts. This reflect the growing fears in and out of China of the growth of many of the same problems in rural China that have re-occurred since the 1970s that were officially stamped out in the 1950s (Landlordism being one of them). The present ruling class of China knows China's history and China's long history of peasant revolts that lead to the over throw of Chinese Governments in the pass (Which not only include the Revolution of 1949 itself, but the overthrow of the Mongols by the Ming Dynasty in the 1300s). There have been many failed revolts (The Boxer and Taiping Rebellions being the best know) but both were suppressed with the aid of foreign troops, something China could NOT use in 1949 AND can not use today.

Now to have a revolt you have to have something to rally the peasants around, other then land reform and government reform, the real reason for the rebellion will always be land reform but the start, the trigger, or any such peasant revolt generally has some sort of pseudo-religious center that unites a corp group that is then joined by the rest of the peasants. Falun Gong seems to be the latest form of these pseudo-religious group and the Chinese Communist Party seems to have made it a policy to suppress then since the 1990s, do to the fear it might be used as the corp for a peasant rebellion.

More on Falun Gong:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falun_Gong

I go into the above to show that the problem seems to be economic abuse by the people who control the Chinese government. The traditional way for Chinese Peasants to revolt against such abuse is to rally around a corp group (generally formed around some sort of corp group think, Christianity among the Taiping, Chinese Nationalism and anti-Christianity among the Boxers, and Leninism-Stalinism under Mao and his revolt against the Nationalist Chinese in the late 1940s).

Note the fear is NOT any religion itself, but a corp group who hold that corp beliefs and uses it to start a rebellion that the rest of the peasants rally around against the existing Government. This is the big fear of the present Communist leadership of China, that the peasants revolt like peasants have done before and overthrow the Government. To succeed any such revolt must have a center, and that center, in China, has traditionally been around a group that adopt a common set of values and uses that common sense of values to unite and revolt. Once in rebellion the rest of the peasants join up do to the harshness of their lives under the existing conditions. Such a revolt is what the Chinese Government fears and to avoid such a revolt suppresses any group that could be such a center (as seen in the suppression of the Falun Goug in the 1990s, Christianity since the 1860s etc).

I bring up this, for these recent killings imply harsh economic times that leads to people looking for answers to the problems. This is how the above centers tended to start, peasants getting together in regards to common problems and seeking relief. China tends NOT to have rebellions during good times for the peasants, but the rural peasants of China have been through a very rough 30 years (and this is worse if you compare it to the coastal cities which have seen a boom in the last 30 years, through low income workers in such cities are no better then the peasants who stayed on the farm). These recent killings implies severe and chronic hardship that people are looking for relief from (The Chinese had a huge increase in drug use during the same time as the above rebellions, again for the same reason as the rebellions, severe economic hardships). That a game could get more then one person to commit such a crime as killing children and then escaping would lead to someone actually trying to do such a crime, sounds like someone who is under severe strain and sees the game as a relief and then sees actually doing the crime as a relief of the strain. It is a sign of problems within China that no one wants to accept (let alone admit).

If China breaks down into some sort of Civil War how does that affect the rest of the World? How does that affect the US? Oil consumption by the Chinese would increase do to the need for military intervention (and in today's world such military operations requires a huge amount of fuel) and being an internal revolt China will spend itself broke to put it down, even if that means paying $1000 a barrel for oil. Sooner or later the American Driver will call it quits when it comes to buying fuel, the Chinese government will only do so once the revolt is put down (And in my opinion, the former will occur while before the later i.e. the price of Oil will be to high for Americans to pay for, long before the Chinese Government give up paying for oil at whatever price it is charged).

Yes, this frightens me, for it shows China is NOT as stable as we like it to be. If a center corp can be formed and start a rebellion China will go into a Civil War. I suspect it will start in Western Rural China Proper i.e. NOT The two Western provinces of Modern China (Tibet and Xinjing, old spelling Sinkiang, sometime referred to as East Turkestan), but that part of China just East of Tibet and Xinjing. The rebellion will then spread to the coastal cities. Now, the Chinese Government will do all it can to prevent this, first by suppressing any group that it fears may become a center corp, but the Chinese Government has an Chronic Cash Shortage at the present time, most of the booming Urban areas are controlled by the children and Grandchildren of the leaders of the Communist party. As such the leadership do NOT want to increases taxes on such "investors" nor does the Government want to impose restrictions on what such "investors" do in regard to their workers.

In many ways the present government of China is in the same trap as the Imperial Government of China was in the 1800s. The government knows what it has to do, but does NOT want to do to the fact it means attacking the wealth of people in the government or close relatives and friends of the people in control of the government. The government officials would like to suppress the peasants (with who they have minimal contacts) but you can only do that so long before they revolt (i.e. to revolt is to die, but when dying is NO longer the worse thing you are facing you will revolt). What is needed is a taking of property of the new investors class, but that class is made up of children and other relatives of the ruling elites and as such the ruling elites do NOT want to do it (you can see a similar problem in the US, the ruling elite stopping any improvements aimed at their wealth but it is all right to go after the wealth of the Working Class). The US has a longer history of working class rights (Unions still exist in the US) AND every so often the greed of the Investors class gets to much for the voters and the investors class gets scared (and permits Congress to do something for the working class least the working class get even more radical and take over the government). China, being a dictatorship, does NOT have that relief value, and thus will continue to suppress the workers till they revolt (As they did in the past). Something has to give and in China that tends to be at the end of a Revolt that overthrows the existing Government (And takes several years to undertake). In the US, we have elections and if the working class is suppressed to far, they tend to vote in their best interests and that scares the ruling elites enough to permit some modifications when absolutely needed (Thus the huge Democratic Congresses in the 1930s, and that Congress stayed Democratic, except for two years after 1946 till 1994, The Senate when GOP in the 1952 election, but returned to Democratic control in 1954 and remained in Democratic Control till 1980). We have a way to get relief, it is inherit in the the fact we elect a new Congress every two years (Unlike most other countries, which elect their legislature every six years).

Thus the US is NOT China, but neither is China the US. These recent attacks shows that China has a huge number of its people under stress. Other comments clearly show the problem tends to be economic in nature, and problems the Chinese Government can not solve (Knows what to do, but does NOT want to do what is needed). Being a one party state it can NOT permit elections that would permit opposition to use the economic bad news to replace the Communists (or at least get enough people elected that the Government will have to at least address the problems).

How long will this last? China was the top economy in the world in 1800, by 1860 it was in rapid decline. Given the option of providing a voice for the peasants, the Chinese Imperial Government opt for suppression. The suppression only worked for a while, but then the peasants revolting rallying around the Taiping rebels in the 1850s. The peasants again revolted in 1900 around the Boxers. The peasants supported the revolution of 1912 replacing the Chinese imperial Government with a Republic, but again rally around the Communists in the 1940s (The Communists had been a force in China from the 1920s onward, but in no position to overthrow the Nationalist Government till the peasants turned against the Nationalists in 1946).

I should not do papers like this at 2:30 in the morning, I find myself rambling on and on looking for a way to end the thread. Since I can not and I need to go to sleep I am leaving it here.

How would it affect the U.S. if there was an uprising in China? Although your post shows a pattern of uprisings, I think the West would intervene today, probably on the side of the Chinese Government sadly, to protect their own interests which are now so tied to China's economy. Unless it was a huge uprising, I think it would be suppressed very quickly as it was during last time. In retrospect, it was a disgrace that this government was making deals with the oppressive Chinese Government right after their attacks on the students.

More effective today than uprisings which would only get many people killed, are boycotts, strikes etc. On a massive scale of course, otherwise they would kill the strikers and it would all be over very quickly. It's obvious the Chinese Government fears its people though, otherwise they would not feel the need for the oppression.

Any "revolt" will start of a series of Strikes and boycotts, then push will come to shove as the Chinese Government moves in to suppress the strikes. The strikers will react back and sooner or later you end up in a Civil War. The Government of China will end up sending in more and more troops which will use more and more oil. This will lead to pressure on the price of oil upward (and my observation the US may end up cutting its use of oil before China will, China will be more willing to pay for oil for its army, then you and I will pay to go to and from work).

Such Peasant revolts can fester for years. The Taiping rebellion lasted over 20 years (roughly 1850-1870). The Communists revolt, in rural northern and Western China, lasted from the mid 1920s till it went on the offensive in 1846 against the Chinese Nationalists (i.e. another 20 plus year revolt). The key to both set of long term rebellion is long term support from the peasants (Mao even invented the concept of peasants paying "taxes" and keeping roles of what peasants paid what, so that no peasant ever had to pay more then his neighbor, thus providing him a steady source of income and the peasants a known amount they had to pay). Mao actions are taught in Schools throughout the areas that were influenced by the Chinese Revolution (Including Vietnam and the rest of South East Asia). As such almost every Chinese citizen knows of his tactics, and if you can get a core group to lead a revolt, all they have to do is adopt Mao's policy to their rebellion and the rebellion can last a very long time (20 plus years for example).

A revolt of that length of time in modern Rural China would lead to widespread increase use of oil by the Chinese Army. The Coastal cities will still be used as cash cows for the central government, but if the working class in the coastal cities started to demand rights, the Government will have to transfer troops from fighting the rural rebels OR give into the urban working class. To put down the rebellion the Central Government may even impose rules that they are rejecting now, so to undermine the support of any such rebellion by giving the peasants what they want (i.e. the concept that the Rebellion will be suppressed AND successful i.e. WHY the people revolted will be addressed even as the people who revolts are suppressed). We have seen this in the US. After the Coal war of 1921, the Federal and state Government started to impose restrictions on what a Coal Company could do in their company towns. This was one of the demands of the miners, their strike failed to achieved those demands, but the Government realizing something had to be done imposed them slowly over the coal company over the next 20 years (one way was to encourage the United Mine Workers to organize the mines). The strikes of the 1930s did little to win benefits for those workers who went on strike, but it set a pattern that lead to more benefits in the post war era as the corporations decided it was better to deal with the union then to suppress the workers. I can go on with cases where the revolt failed, but the reason for the revolt was subsequently addressed (i.e. the revolt was suppressed but did not fail for in the long run WHY the revolt occur was addressed). The same may happen in China. China may find itself in a strike bound period and decide to suppress the strikes, but then once the strikes are suppress put in power people who can address the reasons the strikes occur. The opposite can also occur, widespread suppression that leads to even worse conditions, but all that does it open China for a more severe revolt (The Taiping was followed by the Boxers, which was followed by the Communists).

Chinese history is fun to read, growing up I did NOT run across much Chinese history, but it is full of Peasants revolts that ended up overthrowing the existing Government. This is more true of China then any other Government I have ever read about. Most peasant revolts are suppressed even in China, but it is almost unheard of of a peasant revolt leading to the overthrow of the existing government (and that is clearly what happened when the Ming dynasty overthrew the Mongols). Chinese peasants seem to be able to organize themselves and revolt more then most other peasants. Maybe this happens for China is one of the largest countries in the world in both population and area, and thus it is hard for an outside country to take it over and thus any radical change must come internally. Other large countries with a huge number of peasants tend NOT to have any successful peasant revolts (Russia for example, even the revolution of 1917 saw the peasants backing the Social Democrats NOT the Communists). The rationale for this is that the peasants tend NOT to control the cities and as long as the central government can control the cities the central government has control over internal communications and transportation. The central government can thus defeat any peasant revolt in detail, one province at a time for the peasants can NOT move to another province for the Government controls the cities and the roads that go through the cities. This same control permits the Central government to concentrate it forces in the area it wants to suppress, and once suppress move the troops to the next area. Thus the peasants are kept divided, while the Central government holds the "interior lines". The Peasants in China seems to get around the control of lines of communications better then any other group of peasants. It may be the use of Chinese Rivers, it may be that the peasants can isolate themselves for years while they build up their forces better then any other country, but no matter what they have a better history of successful peasant revolts then any other country.

Side note: One of the reason China may have the most success in peasant revolts is that most other countries when their peasants are suppress to much end up being invaded by someone of about the same size. Japan, Korea and Vietnam are all to small, even combined together to take over China. Tibet is to isolated and Russia is to far away (Siberia is to underpopulated). Thus Mongolia and Manchuria are the only two areas of real concern to the Chinese. Both Countries have conquered China, the Mongols by an attack from Tibet, the Manchus by allying themselves with the left over leadership of the Ming Dynasty and becoming more Chinese then the Chinese themselves. Both attack China as it was divided among many different Chinese Kingdoms (the Mongols) or by Civil War (The Manchus). Neither could hold China for more then 150 years (the limit for the Mongols, if you date the Mongol rule from the days of Genghis Khan not his grandson Kublai Khan, if you date from the alter it did not last 100 years) without outside help (The Manchus stayed in power in the 1800s more to British and western help then anything else.

The Mongol (yuan) Dynasty:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuan_Dynasty

The Manchus (Quig) Dynasty:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qing_Dynasty

The Mongol Empire:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_Empire