Is Cornell West echoing the sentiments of the great W.E.B. DuBois?

DuBois, in his The Souls of the Black Folk argued for the concept of a "double consciousness." Seems that West is building on that concept and, in my opinion, has a valid point about Obama and how his understanding of self has been developed and how that is markedly different than those that come from a slavery background and were raised by those with the same.

Although as a good progressive, we should make room for him just in case. :)

How, exactly, is West's assertion that "all (Obama) has known culturally is white" related to DuBois's discussion of double consciousness?

Not saying it is a 100% example, but as I was teaching Harlem Renaissance concepts yesterday and covered DuBois, it struck me that there were some very similar concepts. Obama is black but also has his "white" self that he more strongly identifies with.

I'm not ideally positioned to comment on Obama's racial consciousness (nor, to my knowledge, is anyone else on DU). But I see no sign that he "has a certain fear of free black men."

If anything, West seems to be saying that Obama basically isn't "conflicted," he's culturally white (although West doesn't put it quite that way). The experience DuBois describes is common; the experience West describes is, presumably, not so common.

Hadn't come at it from that angle. I'll give it a "think."

this is not the same world that exist today.

she simply pointed out that the world has indeed changed.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1133918&mesg_id=1134117

What do you think it means when the statement is that things have changed? If I said that driving 75 mph was impossible and quotes someone from 1912 and the reply was "things are different now" it would seem clear to me that the implication was that the thing quoted no longer is applicable. Absent any elaboration, I don't believe my response was inappropriate.

You made a blanket statement that things are different. If you want to talk about the complexities and what may still apply, go ahead. Love to have the conversation. But when your statement is just that "things are different now" then it seems to me you are saying that the point DuBois is making in his essay is no longer valid. Elaborate if you wish. Don't get mad at me because you are trying to communicate in short blurbs and your intent didn't come through.

marriages weren't even fully legal in the U.S. until the late 1960's.

Of course things are different now, DuBois lived in a world an interracial person was looked on "with amused contempt and pity". We live in a world where a person of mixed race is the President of the United States.

What Dubois has to say on the issue is no longer valid?

by linking him to an icon.

Context is everything. I would hope that we have evolved in our thinking and as a society since that time.

I think half the problem here is that Obama does not cater to those who have made their living off of identity politics. It's time to pay homage to the past but transcend those stereotypes. Most kids don't even pay much attention to race anymore.

Where do you live? Because I teach high school in Wisconsin and I can guarantee you that kids do pay attention to race. Things aren't as bad as they were during the time of DuBois but to claim that race doesn't matter anymore (and that it doesn't have an impact on identity) seems to me to be foolish.

Obama's speeches on race were not courageous. They were meant to assure Whites that he wouldn't be the President of Black America much like Kennedy had to assure Protestants that he wouldn't be the Vatican's President.

Race matters, but Obama can't address it or he will be done. Race is the only social problem that people think that if you talk about it, it gets worse...so we should ignore it. :eyes:

not wasting my time

DuBois. All african-americans have double-consciousness. It's not about half-white half black african americans. West is talking about something distinctly different.

I'm sick of people trying to use black icons to take down Obama because he's black. People don't see how racial they are being over this thing. If you got a criticsm then criticize, but this attempt to use critics who happen to be black as the holy grail is despicable.

I have no problem with what Belafonte said, his comments are no different than other crticisms regardless of race. But West waded into the water and it's not right to use Belafonte to support what West said. Now people are putting up pictures of MLK and Rosa Parks, etc etc.

People here are jumping the shark.

tell me this isn't happening:

"Now people are putting up pictures of MLK and Rosa Parks, etc etc."


:rofl:

And I'm not criticizing Obama for it (West is, agreed, but I'm not--I'm just looking at the concept). He is saying that Obama is more comfortable with his "non-black" side of his consciousness. And that his "black" side is much different than the majority of blacks in the United States. To me that makes sense. His father was African. He was raised in Hawaii by whites. How would his consciousness and comfort area NOT be different than some raised in an urban setting?

I don't know whether the OP is a deliberate attempt to misrepresent Mr DuBois or simply a misunderstanding, but DuBois would almost certainly be surprised at the way his words have been appropriated. And the worst part is that DuBois' philosophy changed so radically one could easily find something in his later pan-African and Marxist thought that might legitimately fit the occasion. The Souls of Black Folk, though, isn't it.

Without criticism, there are only followers - following for the sake of following

Obama has done some great things since Lily Ledbetter

He has also succumbed to the Military Industrial Complex, and I am afraid the killing of OBL will come at a price to him

Some say it already has

Nothing is for free

If you look at Obama's actions through a capitalist lens, things are much clearer, more defined

I would still say he's one of my lifetimes' greatest Presidents, and my lifetime had Carter, my personal fave

He is more "on our side" than Clinton

At the same time, he also sides with Big Oil, Corporate America and the WTO/IMF

Cornell West is a Professor - which means he has an ego

That does not mean there is no truth to what West has said

Cornell West is, and has always been, a Socialist. Not the Marxist variety but more the Eugene Debs type

Eugene Debs was a thorn in the side of every Presidential Administration he lived under

However, certain Administrations listened to him and understood his wisdom

And I can't and won't defend his anti-Semitic intimation.

Are you saying that West was echoing the sentiments of DuBois? Or extending the concept to bi-racialism? Because DuBois was referring to the duality of consciousness within all Black people- not making a commentary on bi-racialism.

A good summary from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_consciousness">Wikipedia:



Sometimes people we like and agree with say stupid shit, we don't necessarily have to go to bat for them. I'm conflicted on defending pundits and politicians. We don't know Cornel West OR Barack Obama, so why should we take attacks against them personally.

In the case of the President opponents have used those smears and personal attacks to discredit anything that he stands for. And as the son of African immigrants myself, I take many of the attacks against him personally.

In Cornel West's case he's getting grief for saying stupid shit about the President because he got slighted. (His policy critiques are spot on.)

I don't see the need to defend him, but I also think that his comments don't invalidate any criticism he makes of the President Obama's policies...Unless he were to show a pattern.