Two Men & A Tie Clip

A couple of days ago, I was talking to a friend. He said that he believes that one of the biggest stumbling blocks to making progress on the local level is the degree to which people identify their political beliefs with the national leadership of the two major parties. He pointed out that the vast majority of “local” people have far, far more in common with each other, than they do with any individual who serves in any of the three branches of government in Washington, DC. By viewing issues in the Washington context, he said, they are blinded from the realities of the common good.

Today, I attended a cousin's wedding. I spent much of the time talking to one of my elderly uncles. At one point, he pointed to my tie clip, shown above, which Robert F. Kennedy handed out on the local courthouse steps, while running for Senate in 1964. “Now, you are a democrat, and I'm a republican,” he said. “But I'm going to tell you something you might not like to hear. I think that the leaders of both parties are in cahoots. They don't give a shit about the people any more. They've sold this country out.”

I'm curious what other forum members think about either/both of these opinions?

Thank you.

H2O Man
Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party Member

It's just easier to be cynical than to be well-informed. No surprise that he identifies himself as a republican, since they seem to take the party line at face value without much critical thinking involved. JMHO

If you ever read OpenSecrets, you can see that the same corporations fund both parties. They just hedge their bets on one side or another depending on the election cycle. As industry insiders, professional politicians have much more in common with each other than they do with us.

the hell they are doing. They have trouble thinking past today let alone what affect the decisions they make today will have ten years down the road. So they listen to their leaders to know the answers. And the leaders are just as lost.

In my own twisted mind, I kind of combined the two ideas. Our elected representatives tend to live the same basic lifestyles: live in the same types of housing, drive the same aurtomobiles, have the same size bank accounts, get campaign donations from the same interests, and break bread with one another, both at work and in the same social circles. Meanwhile, "grass roots" people tend to share the same attributes with one another -- but identify with "leaders" they have little or nothing in common with.

For it has been obvious for decades now that we the people, and this country as a whole, has been bipartisanly sold down the rive in order to benefit the rich and powerful elite.

He has a PhD, and has studied political science his entire adult life. I think he was "lost" for many years, but is finally understanding the deal.

the best chance for the huge masses of the people having a halfway decent life will be when the democrats are in charge. i'd go 3rd - and more to the left - party, and i will, as soon as there's a chance that that further left party can win an election. but i am in NC and just don't believe that i can do other than vote democrat.

the only way to move the Democratic Party to the left is to do so from the grass roots up. That is why I frequently advocate (or, blab on and on about) people becoming more active in their own communities, workplaces, schools/colleges, etc. The only "third party" I'm interested in is the authentic Democratic Party, with linkages to the Progressive Left.

I believe there are A FEW good Democrats at the federal level but most are indeed corrupt. I know lots of good Democrats at the local and state level.

But today's republicans are downright evil.

That describes my own thinking, as well. Thank you.

Ergo the pols of each party are markedly different. Maybe it's just hard to change a two century old country.

I appreciate your response.

In my opinion, our nation has changed quite a bit since 1999.

To the first point, I tend to agree with your friend's observation that national politics tends to divide folks who normally would agree on issues that are related to local stuff. There is so much disinformation out there that it's really hard to discern what is real. So many people get their so-called "facts" from Fox News and radical right radio and internet. It's really divisive. And, that's exactly the point. Because, it's no secret that dividing communities is a whole lot easier than doing the real work that's needed. Nationalistic propaganda is so widespread that the common good you mention is blurred into a point of view that prevents well-meaning local folks from doing what is right due to ridiculous opinions formed from, well, nationalistic propaganda.

To the second, I have long believed that both parties are completely corrupt, but I remain a Democrat because I have no bleeping choice in the face of Republican monstrosity.

Long live whoever figures out an exit to so-called 'bi-partisanship'.

Peace,

Steve

school board election last week, I appear to have gotten more votes from republicans, than did my opponent (and he damned sure didn't get any votes from democrats). I suspect that this was because most people figured that I'd do a better job than my opponent, regardless of what label applied to either of us.

It makes for a curious dynamic. I view myself as a grass roots democrat. Yet I always find myself reassessing what that means.

I believe that the federal government is becoming less relevant and local government is on the rise. As long as Washington is paralyzed, communities will have to pull together on their own and they will.

sence unless the two parties have formulated a plan or a deal for some type of agenda for the country later when theings are massively FUBARed for this country.

Also the stepped up medicinal marijuana raids by Obama make me feel that the Federal pigs look at the average Joe in the US as prey to be squashed.

The Federal goverment is not very much of the people by the people and for the people anymore.

Do I need to mention the Federal Reserve lying to congress merely because if the truth was heard there would be a run on the scammer - fraudster banks?

And 2 secret service agents and a local cop came to interview me once for repeatedly telling Senate Cornyn's aide FUCK YOU! This was after he deliberately tried to get me mad as hell.

Another time an FBI agent - along with a city detective and a city uniform cop - and I think one guy was with the DEA - but I am not sure but he was wearing a white cotton T shirt and a black bullet proof vest with a large badge embossed on it - all came to see me. ^These was for telling Rep Ted Poe's aide to go fuck himself.

In both instances I was told I had not broken any laws. So I told them that I knew they were there just to intimidate me.

Look at how the US park Police treat people at the Thomas Jefferson memorial for merely dancing or to be exact for desiring to express themselves by dancing.

I have already decided that unless we start taking our power back then we cannot vote for either party and expect a change to take place.

I do not use that phrase to shame Obama's slogan of "Change you can believe in" or what ever it was. But unless we stop accepting less than we are assured of in the US Constitution then we should not believe the political campaign lies of either party and roll over when we realize that we were looked at as not deserving of the truth by the candidates who know they can get away with their lies.

And I see Obama's statement that we have to9 make him do it as an arrogant admission that he has no measure of truth in him. I could be wrong but I am saying that because I fear the moderator will strike my message.

And I also feel that is not the correct thing to happen here.

That would mean that either elections are fixed, or that once people get elected they change somehow and lose their conscience. But their conscience must be faulty to begin with for it to change...o what would work (since people with a conscience wouldn't respond to money and power incentives). Hypnotherapy? Threats against their family? Alien abduction?

Other than that, I really can't think of any basis for his worry.

What happens to them when they attain that power is that they switch to preservation mode.

I have a friend who votes straight Republican just for the abortion issue. I have told him lots of times that they will never outlaw abortion totally because they are afraid he and others like him will not feel the need to vote for them anymore. I have come to believe and have told this same friend that the Democrats will never give us a good form of health care for the same reason.

They don't necessarily lose their conscience, but self preservation takes precedent. They soon figure out or are told that they can not give us what was promised. Giving us what they promised to do will take away our incentive to vote for them. They can only give us enough to make us think we will some day do what we want.

I used to be against term limits but am now in favor of them.

There is no mention of anyone being "worried" in the OP. That one belongs to you, alone.

I might move the 90% up a bit, though.

So your uncle is correct if he intends "in cahoots" to mean they act the same way.

--imm

Take a look at Obama. Oh, he talked a good game....and then once elected went on to extend many of the same policies we saw with Bush. Raids on medical marijuana dispensaries, tax cuts for the rich, continuing the wars..expanding one and and even starting another, etc..It just goes on and on.

The letter after the name matters little anymore. I honestly don't think either party gives a damn about regular people...they serve a higher power and it sure as hell isn't us.